What about a APB style customisation? More options, detailed slidersytem

(LyndonL) #61

I tend to agree SockDog. I loved playing Fallout 3 but as soon as I reached my level cap I got bored of it and stopped doing the side missions.
If the XP and unlocks didn’t exist from the start I would have done every mission like I did with FarCry 2

(tokamak) #62

[QUOTE=SockDog;233009]Hate the concept of bread crumbing longevity through unlocks. It teaches people that the enjoyment in a game comes from the rewards you gather and not through actually playing of the game. Although I know SD have said they’re also concerned that just spooging all content would be overwhelming too.

Now I wonder why not just unlock content after a period of ownership (not playtime) or through the lifespan of the game itself (you know like when we didn’t charge for horse armour). That way you can dribble out content without it feeding the pokemans hiding in my damn FPS. :)[/QUOTE]

Two answers to that.

A- collecting gear is a purely cosmetic aspect of the game.

B- Paying experience for abilities means that xp has an actual value in the game which inspires people to play the game accordingly. The one thing that worries me is that there might be a point where everything is collected and xp stops having a value. I hope that there will be costs to rebuilding your character (like in WoW) so xp doesn’t inflate.

(maxtalent) #63

well if you have a maxed out char. you could use your extra xp to funnel over to other characters.

I thought you just bought abilities and then picked them before you played? so its more like perks then a skill tree. and i thought you couldn’t unlock everything in one go so that would be an incentive to replay.

(tokamak) #64

Yeah, it works like that, but that still means that there will be a form of ceiling where xp stops having value. I’d like to see xp always being valuable by having xp-sinks (like paying to reconfigure your abilities) added.

(H0RSE) #65

I’d like to see xp always being valuable by having xp-sinks (like paying to reconfigure your abilities) added.

they already mentioned you need to pay to respec your abilities. Stern said they are planning on having a “test phase” when you buy an ability. You have 24 hrs. to test it out, if you don’t like, you can sell it back at cost. After that, it cost you.

(tokamak) #66

I think WoW handles that part better. There it starts off as very cheap but it accumulates (exponentially) every time you reconfigure your build. So if you do it often it ends up being really expensive. Eventually this amount sinks back overtime.

It’s incredibly elegant as it takes phases of being content with your character and phases of trying something new into account. The only people who really suffer on this system are those who can’t make up their mind, which is exactly what it’s intended for.

(SockDog) #67

[quote=tokamak;233026]Two answers to that.

A- collecting gear is a purely cosmetic aspect of the game.

B- Paying experience for abilities means that xp has an actual value in the game which inspires people to play the game accordingly. The one thing that worries me is that there might be a point where everything is collected and xp stops having a value. I hope that there will be costs to rebuilding your character (like in WoW) so xp doesn’t inflate.[/quote]

A) I’m not talking about it’s effect on the game world, of course a hat is a hat is a hat (although I’m still lost on how abilities both have and don’t have an effect on the game world). However it has a very real effect of the people who play the game and why they play it. ie. they play for a hat primarily and the game secondarily.

B) And my point is XP, unlocks and whatever else have a crappy problem prone slope up and a crappy problem prone slope down with this sparkly peak where everything is perfect in the middle. Ultimately you’re teaching people to play for XP and unlocks, not play to enjoy the game.

As I said, if the idea is to slowly dissipate content then IMO it’s better to gradually unlock it over the lifespan of the game. Much in the same way that L4D unlocks a mutation each week. This keeps the game fresh, interest high and avoids the whole turning the game in World of Pew Pew.

I just hope the whole XP system is easily modifiable and so devalued totally from the day of release. That way I don’t have to listen to people tell me how I just died because they were too busy collecting XP for a “I’m a douche bag” t-shirt rather than played the fricken game.

(the_madman) #68

Amen!

(at least 10 characters)

(tokamak) #69

Ultimately you’re teaching people to play for XP and unlocks, not play to enjoy the game.

That’s a good thing and not bad as you think it is. Provided the xp system is representative of good play (and I don’t expect anything less in Brink) then you shouldn’t be able to tell the difference between someone playing to win the game or someone playing for the hat, as they both need to perform the same actions to achieve that.

(Apples) #70

Thats where we wont agree :wink: or at least its a big assumption there, racking up xp AND being useless for your team are not paradoxal stuffs IMO.

Peace

(tokamak) #71

If you can rack up xp while being useless then the xp system is so heavily flawed I doubt I would want to play this game. Once again, I expect nothing less than a proper xp system from SD.

But for the sake of this discussion, it IS a premise we should accept, leave the rewards out of this, if people play the game ‘wrong’ then the xp system itself is flawed, not the stuff you can buy with it.

(AnthonyDa) #72

W:ET & ET:QW XP system are “so heavily flawed”. Yet, you played them for a while.

(SockDog) #73

[quote=tokamak;233122]If you can rack up xp while being useless then the xp system is so heavily flawed I doubt I would want to play this game. Once again, I expect nothing less than a proper xp system from SD.

But for the sake of this discussion, it IS a premise we should accept, leave the rewards out of this, if people play the game ‘wrong’ then the xp system itself is flawed, not the stuff you can buy with it.[/quote]

The XP system relies on a defined model of play that can’t accurately account for variation or abuse. I’d argue SD have acknowledged as much as these conversations generally end in, ‘if people want to grind they can do so offline’. It’s not that it won’t happen but that it’s hoped it’ll happen somewhere other than online. So, the mere existence of an XP system IS the flaw. If you are paying attention to it then you’re not playing the game you’re playing the XP system and yes then you need it to be perfect otherwise the game suffers. If you ignore it then the system isn’t necessary.

In the context of this topic I’d say the XP system was the necessary evil to dribble out all the content, provide a tutorial/guide system, add character skill set etc. I’d frankly like to see a greater focus on smaller and much simpler methods to achieve the goals XP looks to achieve. Methods that promote just playing the game, maybe in the same way that K/D stats are now seen as being bad motivators so will XP, I can live in hope.

For now I hope that SD is considering similar stuff to what Valve is doing and including content/abilities as random or timed releases so that we’re not all needing to be focused on XP rather than the actual game.

(tokamak) #74

Quake Wars already had a much more advanced system, but in generally awarded the right kind of behavior. The guy on top of the xp list is usually also the guy that was the biggest asset to the team. If Brink can make the same leap QW did from W:ET then it’s pretty close to perfection.

Of course it can, it just requires a sophisticated model. Complexity can’t ever be a reason not to do it.

(Apples) #75

2 words : Obliterator - deployables

Nuff said bout XP in ETQW…

(SockDog) #76

Well you’re just clearly not in contact with reality. At least I approach Brink with a realistic expectation.

(INF3RN0) #77

Weird that the guy flying around the map blowing up deploys all game always gets the highest XP, especially when we are on the inside objective lol. Then there are those who auto-select the highest XP mission even if it is no where near helpful. The system is quite buggy, which is the reason why Brink is supposed to make that part better… I hope.

(ju5t_bl4z3) #78

Piercings… different hair cuts [especially for Black people, I’m tired of that one hair style we always get lol]
It’d be cool if the gun holsters could be customized also…

(tokamak) #79

Damaging disabled deployables rewarding as much xp as damaging functioning deployables is on my list of obvious flaws in QW’s xp system.

I didn’t expect anything better than just a cynical snark from you.

(SockDog) #80

So no response as to how this sophisticated model, which brings totally fair XP allocation, is possible? Just a cheap deflection? Guess it’s not so easy after all, huh.