What about a APB style customisation? More options, detailed slidersytem

[tokamak]

I haven’t played Brink so there’s no way I can comment on how I would deal with xp-distribution in the game. Now I doubt I would comment about this to you in the first place, as you’ve already revealed to what extend you’re willing to discuss this in the first place.

[SockDog]

Wow, you’ve really got nothing to back up your argument and yet still refuse to acknowledge there are issues. It’s clearly cynical me and SDs incompetence.

[tokamak]

I suggest you got back over the thread and read everything instead of just the odd posts.

[Szakalot]

since we are talking about xp systems, i think its a good idea to give bonus xp points if an enemy was taken down by more than one player. This:

prevents whine about fragstealin, since you still got the full xp for the kill (even though someone ‘took your frag’)

encourages crossfire and sticking together, as you can simply rack up more kills and get xp faster.

[tokamak]

At the moment each hit rewards xp (in a rather ostentatious fashion dare I say). I’m not sure if actually killing the target rewards anything on top of that. But if it did then a rather elegant way to reward several players is to put a multiplier (20% or so?) on the xp generated by the hits. This way your reward depends on how much you contributed to the kill while while finishing off players is rewarded as well (let’s face it, only damaging players is useless if the player lives to be a nuisance later on).

[Szakalot]

Not necessarily,
in both ET and ETQW, unless the player has a tactical weapon like a PF or an Oblit (or a clutch emp or whatever); having health below 20-30 will make you pretty much useless against anyone in a firefight.

But a player can regain their health, particularly a medic, so its pretty situational.

Still, critical damage to a number of players can prove quite beneficial.

Your idea does not resolve the fragsteal whine issue, compared to mine. Sure it can be abused, but you would need the enemies cooperation.

I am not against abuse, the way i see it, let the abusive people get their unlocks, get bored quickly and GTFO.

I am always more inclined to make the achievements easier. If you have unlockables to stuck a person to the game for 6 months, you’ve done your job. You really dont need something that would take 2 years of normal gameplay. Some will leave after that time, but im pretty sure a lot of players will get hooked up on the game, before they get bored due to lack of unlockables.

[tokamak]

A player on low hp can still complete objectives, heal/revive players, hack/repair deployables, call in artillery/air strikes and spot (interrogate) other players.

The true average value of killing a player as opposed to simply damaging him can be haggled about, it needs to stand in the right proportion to the other things you can do in this game or players will ignore the objective and start a deathmatch instead.

I am not against abuse, the way i see it, let the abusive people get their unlocks, get bored quickly and GTFO.

I am always more inclined to make the achievements easier. If you have unlockables to stuck a person to the game for 6 months, you’ve done your job. You really dont need something that would take 2 years of normal gameplay. Some will leave after that time, but im pretty sure a lot of players will get hooked up on the game, before they get bored due to lack of unlockables.

For me it’s not as much about getting the unlocks, it’s about letting xp keep it’s value across the entire lifetime of the game. If done right, xp should have the same value to a veteran as it has to a beginner. Very hard to pull off but it’s possible.

I feel you can’t trust players to do things for ‘free’. I know, ideally people play to have a good match, but even the biggest philanthropist can be seduced into doing something that doesn’t contribute to winning the game yet still awards him xp. In other words, xp is a very powerful tool to make people play the game as it’s intended and to ensure the best gaming experience. Dropping it leaves you without any ‘carrots’ to let players behave or even remain playing.

I know the moralists on this forum will immidiately say that they don’t even want the people who only play for the tokens. But I do, to me it makes no difference whether I’m fighting someone who wants to kill me for the xp, for the prestige of killing me, or simply because I stood in his way to victory. Letting xp devaluate would turn off a part of the playerbase unnecessarily.

[SockDog]

I suggest you got back over the thread and read everything instead of just the odd posts.

I was actually just waiting for an answer to your flip remark to explain away XP’s failings but hey it’s clear you don’t have one. Lets leave it there.

[tokamak]

I didn’t say anything like that therefore I can only assume you’ve read half the thread.

[SockDog]

That’s a good thing and not bad as you think it is. Provided the xp system is representative of good play (and I don’t expect anything less in Brink) then you shouldn’t be able to tell the difference between someone playing to win the game or someone playing for the hat, as they both need to perform the same actions to achieve that.

[quote=tokamak;233122]If you can rack up xp while being useless then the xp system is so heavily flawed I doubt I would want to play this game. Once again, I expect nothing less than a proper xp system from SD.

But for the sake of this discussion, it IS a premise we should accept, leave the rewards out of this, if people play the game ‘wrong’ then the xp system itself is flawed, not the stuff you can buy with it.[/quote]

Of course it can, it just requires a sophisticated model. Complexity can’t ever be a reason not to do it.

So basically, SD needs to create a accurate model of the game such that all actions are rewarded fairly including any actions that are unforeseen but benefit or detriment the team overall? Basically they need to create Skynet or accept that the XP system itself is fundamentally flawed.

My point being that the reliance on XP to drive content delivery has always had the capability of being a corrupting NOT rewarding effect on gameplay. Adding more and more complicated rules hasn’t changed that and in some cases it makes things worse because you just give more opportunity to bend the rules or be punished by them.

To be very clear. In a perfect world the XP system would be great. However when games come out and you see strategy and balance issues months after release the expectation that a perfectly fair model of play is possible is a little naive to me. It’s also worth repeating that even SD acknowledges that people who’ll want to cheat the system will do so, but they hope they do it offline. To me that sounds like you’re not getting a perfect system and instead will just need to live with (or be oblivious to) the negative effects.

[SockDog]

And I suppose I need to point out that I know for many people, myself included, we’ll play the game regardless of XP and enjoy the game for what it is. I’m not suggesting the issue is so bad that it cripples the game, only that games focusing on XP and rewarding players who earn XP are leaning up against a flawed system and that there could be better, simpler alternatives that promote playing the game for an extended period of time.

[Cankor]

[QUOTE=Szakalot;232181]seriously?

MORE customization?

You wouldn’t rather see… I don’t know, a new map, a better weapon, less bugs or more balanced gameplay?
[/QUOTE]

I would rather see the “secure the objective and earn 10XP” bug fixed

[Nos]

I think someone said somewhere,

“We are sacrificing customization for better character models”
He also said something along the lines of when players are given sliders, they mess up the models, and they end up looking like blobs of goo.

So no sliders.

[Joshua_Morrison]

[QUOTE=Nos;233794]I think someone said somewhere,

“We are sacrificing customization for better character models”
He also said something along the lines of when players are given sliders, they mess up the models, and they end up looking like blobs of goo.

So no sliders.[/QUOTE]

Agreed,
they also sacrificing gender customization for more clothing which gets a huge thumbs up from me.

[Nos]

[QUOTE=Joshua Morrison;233802]Agreed,
they also sacrificing gender customization for more clothing which gets a huge thumbs up from me.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, you can’t really do shirtless women. All the clothing would have to be transferred to a ‘female version’ and that would be sub-par.

[Joshua_Morrison]

Yeah, you can’t really do shirtless women. All the clothing would have to be transferred to a ‘female version’ and that would be sub-par.

Yeah takes to much time and data.