This game requires NO SKILL

(Nail) #61

[QUOTE=legend123;330987]Take a map like Container City.
Your spawn gets raped by a better defending team (which isnt always your fault) in the first part near the docks by the deployment area.
Everyone goes on about dying trying to leave the spawn.
The medic just chills back and buffs/revive people and loses his energy bar so he cant revive. Instead of attacking he stands there and waits for the bar to regenerate.

Thats is not efficient teamwork. It is selfish.[/QUOTE]

yep, and it has nothing to do with the game, but the morons playing CoD in Brink

(R_Shackelford) #62

[QUOTE=TragHIP;330974]What exactly is wrong with wracking up points as a medic and coming out on top? If you do your job you deserve every point you get. How does it not take skill to kill AND risk your life unselfishly to save your teammates?

No team strategy in Brink? Seriously? Your post lost most of it’s merit with that statement.[/QUOTE]

I agree that there’s nothing wrong with being rewarded for effectively playing your class, but I do think the Medic gets a touch too much XP for its actions. That’s probably why I spec as a Medic to level up quick when starting new characters, and my supply pips are all spent (on others… I don’t buff myself until there’s no one else around to buff) before I’m fifty feet from the spawn, with maybe one pip saved for an emergency revive.

(F. Otzenknecht) #63

I think the OP has no idea when it comes to skill.

Yes you can shoot while running/jumping/falling. Yes, the weapons don’t have that much recoil. True. But that leads to the requirement of a different type of skill: being really fast and agile.
That’s what I always liked about the SD games. I think with these weapon and gameplay mechanics, there is a lot more aiming skill required than in CS or COD (where in COD there is less real skill required than in CS).

And in SD games the task of mastering the mechanics is much more entertaining. Brink got more casual (unfortunately from a PC gamer’s pov). Also true is, that ET:QW was slower that W:ET and now BRINK is slower that ET:QW but still: it is much faster than CS and it DOES depend whether your aiming is that good that you can track a head while jumping.

I’d invite the OP-Pro-Gamer-1337 guy for a match of Brink against an SD game veteran, Brink, ET:QW or W:ET and we’ll see how much skill is involved. If he was right it should end like 50:50 or so - but i don’t think so.

I played competitive CS from 2001 - 2004 - I know what I’m talking about. All of the mentioned games require skill. But the skill in games like the SD games, UT or Quake are much harder to learn/master than in (casual imo) games like COD/CS.

// EDIT: All the post relates to playing against humans - if you’re talking about playing against bots, you’re right, there is no real skill involved.

(TragHIP) #64

[QUOTE=legend123;330987]Take a map like Container City.
Your spawn gets raped by a better defending team (which isnt always your fault) in the first part near the docks by the deployment area.
Everyone goes on about dying trying to leave the spawn.
The medic just chills back and buffs/revive people and loses his energy bar so he cant revive. Instead of attacking he stands there and waits for the bar to regenerate.

Thats is not efficient teamwork. It is selfish.[/QUOTE]

Ok, I’ll give you that scenerio. Wouldn’t you admit tho’ that is a rather extreme case of someone exploiting a situation? I certainly don’t play that way.

The more I think about your scenerio I have to ask you to look at it a different way: If your entire team is trapped what else should the medic do but buff and rez? He is probably counting on his team to overcome the onslaught eventually. I’m just saying it may not always be selfish motives.

:penguin:

(TragHIP) #65

I agree the medics probably do get tad too much XP. Splash Damage probably felt like they needed to sweeten the pot just to get people to play medics.

(Mad Hatter) #66

About that Medic thing. I’ve found that a much more efficient method is to expend all of your pips as quickly as possible, then bum rush the enemy and take out as many of them as you can before inevitably dying. Then you respawn, rinse, and repeat. Those revive-o-campers aren’t farming XP as well as they could be. :<

(legend123) #67

[QUOTE=TragHIP;331080]Ok, I’ll give you that scenerio. Wouldn’t you admit tho’ that is a rather extreme case of someone exploiting a situation? I certainly don’t play that way.

The more I think about your scenerio I have to ask you to look at it a different way: If your entire team is trapped what else should the medic do but buff and rez? He is probably counting on his team to overcome the onslaught eventually. I’m just saying it may not always be selfish motives.

:penguin:[/QUOTE]

Yes I do admit it is very rare but its possible (ive seen it done).

When the meds energy bar is low he should rush out and help shoot the opponent down (instead of just waiting there).

But I see you understand me at least :smiley:

(riptide) #68

Yea lol… this is just as bad if not worse than “COD kids” Oh and before anyone says anything I preferred Arena Shooters.

Container City doesn’t favor the defense… those guys get hardly any XP compared to me when I switch medic and just watch people rush out and die so I can get the syringe and res XP. Once I’m low on supplies I rush out trying to die as quick as possible and do it again.

In all seriousness I’d rather have a team fighting for 5-1 K/D ratio. We would have a better chance of completing the objective.

(zenstar) #69

[QUOTE=riptide;331096]Yea lol… this is just as bad if not worse than “COD kids” Oh and before anyone says anything I preferred Arena Shooters.

Container City doesn’t favor the defense… those guys get hardly any XP compared to me when I switch medic and just watch people rush out and die so I can get the syringe and res XP. Once I’m low on supplies I rush out trying to die as quick as possible and do it again.

In all seriousness I’d rather have a team fighting for 5-1 K/D ratio. We would have a better chance of completing the objective.[/QUOTE]

The whole “must have best XP” thing is a stupid mindset. What are you going to do once you hit max level? Stop playing the character?
The only important thing is whether your team wins or loses. If you’re playing to earn the most xp then you’re not playing for the right reasons and you’re not getting the teamwork part of the game at all.

(zenstar) #70

The medic has the same health and firepower as everyone else in the team. If he’s currently unable to buff or revive (or better: heal before needing to revive) then he can still be extremely useful taking down the enemy.
There is no point to camping in Brink. You’ll respawn with more supply and ammo if you die pushing an attack / making a defensive stand. And if you don’t die then you’ve helped push your team towards victory.
Camping is a silly strategy.

(riptide) #71

[quote=zenstar;331148]the whole “must have best xp” thing is a stupid mindset. What are you going to do once you hit max level? Stop playing the character?
The only important thing is whether your team wins or loses. If you’re playing to earn the most xp then you’re not playing for the right reasons and you’re not getting the teamwork part of the game at all.[/quote]

make new characters and do it again. Why level as anything but the best xp farming class. Need top of the scoreboard no matter what. Must have moar xpz . If i got the most xp i helped my team the most so i did my job. I cant carry everyone. I hope they raise the level cap to 62 soon so I have a reason to keep playing but can still remain unique in ability choice.

(fearlessfox) #72

Brink’s skill is about situational awareness and team tactics much more than the ability to shoot the place up.

I was going to reply properly to this thread, but when the guy announced himself an “elite pro” it put me off. My fault, I should be a bigger person than this…

(legend123) #73

[QUOTE=zenstar;331148]The whole “must have best XP” thing is a stupid mindset. What are you going to do once you hit max level? Stop playing the character?
The only important thing is whether your team wins or loses. If you’re playing to earn the most xp then you’re not playing for the right reasons and you’re not getting the teamwork part of the game at all.[/QUOTE]

Maybe it is a stupid mindset, maybe not. The point is it exists already. So why not KD ratios,
revive/game, kills/game, dozens of stats.

When I play for xp (when my team is absolute garbage) thats all I do. I help them out but if they cant help themselves then your teamwork and team are going NOWHERE.
What happens when I max levels? I still play with them. I rarely make a new character because its all the damn same. More important than how my character looks and what he has equiped is the gameplay. Brink needs to improve it drastically!

(Smoochy) #74

[QUOTE=JuggallinJuggolo;330558]Okay I will be honest with you. I am a competetive gamer, I play because I like to compete and I like to get better and better as I go on. My first CS rounds (CS is prolly the gratest FPS of all time) went bad but as time went back on, I developed better and better skills until I became an elite pro and competed in clan matches and tourneys. Going from a no one who couldnt hit crap to a pro who was feared and reviled really made me feel good. Later I played other FPS games that were greats like the COD series, Medal of Honor and of course, Teams Fortress 2.

All had a similar enjoyment factor, u start out as a sucky loser noob but then you develop skills and with hard work and determination, you become a hardened expert. In a professional game like CS or COD (Any of them from 2 on up, tho I am not big on MW), 9 times out of 10, a player with pure skill will beat a player with no skillZ. Why? The games are deep and u have a lot to learn. This is true for TF2 as well, which is a better comparision since its more of a cartoon game like Brink is.

But Brink?

There are NO weapon mechanics. All guns are the same. All guns work the same. There is no room for strategy, the levels are too small. I mean, its 2011 and the levels are the size of a Quake 3 map. Come on yo.

The game isnt fluid. You dont have to think or strategize, it wont help. Theres no reason to think of what position to take because the game is too simple and it wont help you anyway. All the game boils down too is running randomly and bashing the button. You dont even have to burst fire, recoil doesnt matter. Just smash the button.

Horrible.

The game doesnt even show you your K/D to allow u to see how you are doing. Because the developers realized how pore their gameplay mechanics are, they replaced K/D with a liberal, everyone gets points/everyone’s a winner system that just DOESNT WORK.

Fail.

Epic fail.

: ([/QUOTE]

there are plenty of tactics. maybe you dont get objective games. i often have to swap class multiple times to get the win. and btw- k/d is irrelevent in objective based games. we dont want servers full of campers who dont want to help the team as it might impact their k/d

its odd you brink up TF2. i bought it and hated it. the smallest maps in the world and rounds last about 1 minute. maybe i didnt give it enough time but i got zero enjoyment from it.

im coming from original UT, original MOH, BF series (not a big fan of bc2 as its not a proper BF game) etc.

ive had some of the best teamwork ive had since bf2142 with this game. last night i was with some great players and we worked as a great team. steamrollering the opposition even when attacking. knowing the right class and having enough of each class is the key.

recoil is a massive factor on some guns. i use 2 smgs for CQ combat and AR/rokstedi for longer distances. each weapon has its ups and downs and the attachments make a difference.

(zenstar) #75

[QUOTE=legend123;331177]Maybe it is a stupid mindset, maybe not. The point is it exists already. So why not KD ratios,
revive/game, kills/game, dozens of stats.

When I play for xp (when my team is absolute garbage) thats all I do. I help them out but if they cant help themselves then your teamwork and team are going NOWHERE.
What happens when I max levels? I still play with them. I rarely make a new character because its all the damn same. More important than how my character looks and what he has equiped is the gameplay. Brink needs to improve it drastically![/QUOTE]

Here’s why I don’t think KDRs should be added:
It encourages camping and not risking yourself for the team (minimize deaths, maximise kills, let everyone else do the hard work) for the biggest KDR.
XP is assigned for all sorts of things and can be balanced to make sure that selfish players never get the best XP.
KDR cannot be balanced. It’s equation is kinda set in stone. Why add something that encourages gameplay that is the opposite of the intention of the game?
Do you really need dozens of stats when the only important stat is “Team won”?
People need to be encouraged to learn the team strategy of the game. If they refuse to play with the team then they’re never going to do well and will probably move on. Adding KDR is just going to make people think that it’s important when it really isn’t.

(legend123) #76

[QUOTE=Smoochy;331192]there are plenty of tactics. maybe you dont get objective games. i often have to swap class multiple times to get the win. and btw- k/d is irrelevent in objective based games. we dont want servers full of campers who dont want to help the team as it might impact their k/d

[/QUOTE]

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD. please stop making these awful statements against kd.
I said it once and ill say it again KD does not run the game.
1)The majority of players from those games like CoD left in the first week after Brink was released. Why do you think the population went from15000+ to 3500? Thats one of the reasons.

2)Objective team based games have kd in the past and they worked (without having campers ruin the game).
For example Splash Damages earlier game W:ET. The best teambased game imo and it still lives to this day (it has more ppl playing now then Brink for goodness sakes.

(Kl3ppy) #77

[QUOTE=PsYcHo;330568]If you’re too (elite)pro for Brink then just go away :wink:
You know why there is no K/D on the scoreboard? BECAUSE K/D DOESN’T MATTER! This game is about teamplay.

And yes, you are ‘epic fail’.[/QUOTE]

First, i just read till ur post and i have to say, ur stupid and a fail. Brink is a FPS, First Person Shooter, and Shooter implies that killing is one of the important things so there has to be a K/D. If not u can play wow or some other crap …

(Smoochy) #78

[QUOTE=Kurushi;330841]To answer your question, no it’s not Halo, it’s Quake 3 and there will be no arguments about it. Take that as seriously as you like.

No offence but you’re obviously quite new to it all so it probably does seem like CS invented everything[/QUOTE]

i call UT :slight_smile: horses for courses i guess. but i much preferred UT to the quake games. i preferred the weapons and gamemodes (i was in the top 40 at domination) and maps. i also liked the engine and worked on a few mods. oh the days of SDKs… we miss you! oh, and free map packs from the devs. years of support etc… back when companies really cared.

my personal fave online FPS was battlefield2142. just for the variety of gameplay and the best toys.

(Steinernein) #79

What.

Logic error much? Make sure you check your premises and then double check your conclusion.

(Smoochy) #80

[QUOTE=legend123;330987]Take a map like Container City.
Your spawn gets raped by a better defending team (which isnt always your fault) in the first part near the docks by the deployment area.
Everyone goes on about dying trying to leave the spawn.
The medic just chills back and buffs/revive people and loses his energy bar so he cant revive. Instead of attacking he stands there and waits for the bar to regenerate.

Thats is not efficient teamwork. It is selfish.[/QUOTE]

not everyone has hours to spend. i spent the first week playing occasionally and not knowing the choke points. the last few times ive attacked on ccity we have won every time. ive only been camped in the spawn once and i learnt from that.

the problem for me is the restriction on player characters. i like the idea but when you join a server with your level 20 engi/soldier and you have no medics. you have not enough pips or medic abilities to help. if i have my medic/op i have all the med stuff thats decent and all the fun OP toys. but you dont want to play with the same character every game. maybe if you could at least swap characters before the map starts you might even this out.