[quote=“Black;149784”][quote=“Someordinaryguy;148419”]How to fix Sparks:
1)Revert all changes to REVIVR and MPs
2)REVIVR does not headshot (instead doing normal bodyshot damage)/reduced headshot damage (1.25/1.50 instead of 2.00 for example)
3)Reduce medpack cooldown by 2s
boom Sparks is still viable without being a sniper wannabe[/quote]
Not even close to balanced.
The revivr should not do damage period. It gives her both offensive and defensive capabilities with no drawback or disadvantage.[/quote]
In that case, Sparks would be pretty much unable to defend herself. You’d have to give her SMG primaries to make up for that.
[quote=“WaffleMonster;149755”]
Fragger barely changes the way the game is actually played[/quote]
lol
Except for the tiny and irrelevant part where the Fragger + Sawbonez combo is so ridiculously overpowered that it is used nearly 100% of the time and it’s suicide to not run it in a competitive environment unless your team is very temporarily switching the Fragger to something else like a PDP Redeye (which isn’t exactly a fine example of a balanced alternative anyway).
[quote=“Dawnrazor;149805”][quote=“WaffleMonster;149755”]
Fragger barely changes the way the game is actually played[/quote]
lol
Except for the tiny and irrelevant part where the Fragger + Sawbonez combo is so ridiculously overpowered that it is used nearly 100% of the time and it’s suicide to not run it in a competitive environment unless your team is very temporarily switching the Fragger to something else like a PDP Redeye (which isn’t exactly a fine example of a balanced alternative anyway).[/quote]
Just because something is played a lot, doesn’t mean it’s OP. Both sawbonez and fragger are mercs that are good in every situation and as a result get picked all the time. Fragger doesn’t actually change the way in which the game is played. If fragger wasn’t in the game, dirty bomb would still be played in the same way.
[quote=“WaffleMonster;149809”]
Just because something is played a lot, doesn’t mean it’s OP. Both sawbonez and fragger are mercs that are good in every situation and as a result get picked all the time. Fragger doesn’t actually change the way in which the game is played. If fragger wasn’t in the game, dirty bomb would still be played in the same way.[/quote]
It’s the literal definition of OP. It is more powerful than every possible alternative to the point where it renders any team composition not centered around Fragger and Sawbonez to be objectively inferior. Therefore OP.
[quote=“derpypenguinz19;149795”][quote=“Black;149784”][quote=“Someordinaryguy;148419”]How to fix Sparks:
1)Revert all changes to REVIVR and MPs
2)REVIVR does not headshot (instead doing normal bodyshot damage)/reduced headshot damage (1.25/1.50 instead of 2.00 for example)
3)Reduce medpack cooldown by 2s
boom Sparks is still viable without being a sniper wannabe[/quote]
Not even close to balanced.
The revivr should not do damage period. It gives her both offensive and defensive capabilities with no drawback or disadvantage.[/quote]
In that case, Sparks would be pretty much unable to defend herself. You’d have to give her SMG primaries to make up for that.[/quote]
I also agree with giving sparks a primary as I have said previously I don’t believe any merc should be cheated out of a primary.
However the primary should be long range to help support her role as a medic in the back healing from a safe distance.
[quote=“Black;149815”][quote=“derpypenguinz19;149795”][quote=“Black;149784”][quote=“Someordinaryguy;148419”]How to fix Sparks:
1)Revert all changes to REVIVR and MPs
2)REVIVR does not headshot (instead doing normal bodyshot damage)/reduced headshot damage (1.25/1.50 instead of 2.00 for example)
3)Reduce medpack cooldown by 2s
boom Sparks is still viable without being a sniper wannabe[/quote]
Not even close to balanced.
The revivr should not do damage period. It gives her both offensive and defensive capabilities with no drawback or disadvantage.[/quote]
In that case, Sparks would be pretty much unable to defend herself. You’d have to give her SMG primaries to make up for that.[/quote]
I also agree with giving sparks a primary as I have said previously I don’t believe any merc should be cheated out of a primary.
However the primary should be long range to help support her role as a medic in the back healing from a safe distance.[/quote]
So now we have corner-peeking Sparks that can pop heads with a burst rifle or (even worse) a PDP with the capability to self-heal and she can hold her own at close quarters.
That’s not much different than Sparks before the first REVIVR nerf.
[quote=“BananaSlug;149732”]
yes i had that in mind, i forgot to write it, and i am just tired of sparks immediately healing her self, sparks i think is supposed to be weaker merc that stays behind team and revives ppl in the middle of the fight
and if you know aura cant one shot skyhammers[/quote]
I suspect you never heard about “Shotgun can one shot! OP! No skill! Nerf!” threads. With REVIVR, you need to make a head shot. With shotgun you need to aim in general direction of enemy player.
[quote=“WaffleMonster;149809”]
Just because something is played a lot, doesn’t mean it’s OP. Both sawbonez and fragger are mercs that are good in every situation and as a result get picked all the time. Fragger doesn’t actually change the way in which the game is played. If fragger wasn’t in the game, dirty bomb would still be played in the same way.[/quote]
Cook grenade, shout “FRAGGAH!” and insta kill 1-3 enemy players. No skill required to play 150 hp merc with cool weapons and launch grenades left and right, especially if you have pocked Sawbones who heals you to full HP with every med pack.
Sparks needs absurdly more skill and time to learn to play well. And still will not be better compare to Fragger-Sawbones combo.
SD seems to want to nerf all skill based mercs to some trash level, so it’s just easier to take high hp mercs like Fragger/Sawbones and play dumb “Go forward & shoot” game play.
[quote=“Black;149815”]
However the primary should be long range to help support her role as a medic in the back healing from a safe distance.[/quote]
Sniper/Burst/Assault rifle? No thanks. Her primary should be either REVIVR without damage falloff or SMG-9/Blishlock/Hochfir.
[quote=“WaffleMonster;149755”][quote=“Jesus;149735”][quote=“WaffleMonster;149552”][quote=“Jesus;149413”][quote=“WaffleMonster;149329”]
The reason why I say it’s skill less gameplay is it takes no skill reviving as sparks in that situation whilst if you are a standard medic you are forced to fight first or make the decision to try and go in with defibs and face almost certain death. [/quote]
For me to finish your ennemies faster when there is a sparks is just adaptation to the merc you are fighting. Almost common sense.
And if you are saying revive from distance is bad gameplay well then you might as well remove the merc because on that point nothing changed. And if standard medic have to go fight for someones revive, thats because they have the weapon to do it they have smg’s and shotgun and two of them has way more hp. You cant expect a merc with 80hp and a secondary to go out of his way like a sawbones thats just bad faith. [/quote]
Adaptation yes, awful gameplay yes. I know a lot of comp players who just wished sparks was never introduced and many who refuse to play this game because of the way she changes the game.[/quote]
And i wish fragger was never introduced cause of its awful “i cook my grenade two seconds and throw it iin your face so you cant dodge the death” Do you see me making thread for fragger nerf every now and then like a nab? Am i asking for overkill nerf on him? Am i stoping to playing the game because of him ? No i just adapt to it and try to kill him before he throws the nade. Its stupid not to play because of one merc ability and the people doing that are stupid. Fragger is bad gameplay too. Skill less on top of that absolutely anyone can be good at fragger. Yet other players arent asking for nerf constantly get over yourself and stop asking to nerf every merc you dont play just to make the game easier for you. If you cant adapt to a Sparks or to any other merc, the only one with a bad gameplay is you.[/quote]
Sparks is a merc who utterly changes the game and there’s very little you can do about it. She’s like vassili back when he had instagib. [/quote]
This is utter bullshit you just had to finish your damn kills it doesnt even take one second ffs.
@Black You know Revivr IS her primary? If you want to give her grandeur or dreiss it doesnt really change anything just split the stuff in two different weapons.
I personally think the long range damage on revivr was fine since she is supposed to be a long range merc but if people really think she was OP they should have nerfed the close range, which is where she shouldnt be good at being a long range merc.
So my proposition is:
Reverse the Fall of Damage Health on Revive so that it increases with the distance, resulting in close range low damage and low revive and long range which is actually more difficult is reward.
Maybe reduce a bit the self healing capability to make it fair for other snipers (or remove it and make the reviver heal teammate)
give her the Defib like medic instead of the helping up on the F keys (or maybe she already have it never tried actually) So That if she wants to full revive fallen teammate she either have to take a step back which isnt always possible or she have to risk it and go with the Defib making her having to risk her ass.
[quote=“derpypenguinz19;149835”][quote=“Black;149815”][quote=“derpypenguinz19;149795”][quote=“Black;149784”][quote=“Someordinaryguy;148419”]How to fix Sparks:
1)Revert all changes to REVIVR and MPs
2)REVIVR does not headshot (instead doing normal bodyshot damage)/reduced headshot damage (1.25/1.50 instead of 2.00 for example)
3)Reduce medpack cooldown by 2s
boom Sparks is still viable without being a sniper wannabe[/quote]
Not even close to balanced.
The revivr should not do damage period. It gives her both offensive and defensive capabilities with no drawback or disadvantage.[/quote]
In that case, Sparks would be pretty much unable to defend herself. You’d have to give her SMG primaries to make up for that.[/quote]
I also agree with giving sparks a primary as I have said previously I don’t believe any merc should be cheated out of a primary.
However the primary should be long range to help support her role as a medic in the back healing from a safe distance.[/quote]
So now we have corner-peeking Sparks that can pop heads with a burst rifle or (even worse) a PDP with the capability to self-heal and she can hold her own at close quarters.
That’s not much different than Sparks before the first REVIVR nerf.[/quote]
I honestly don’t know where you got all this from and you are just embellishing your warped perception of how it’s imbalanced.
Sparks self heal has a good cooldown period and she can’t hold at close quarters very well with a burst rifle because it’s meant for long range.
I’m talking about sparks needing to switch between her revivr and weapons giving her a vulnerability in fights instead of allowing her to be offensive and defensive with her revivr.
[quote=“Jesus;149949”]@Black You know Revivr IS her primary? If you want to give her grandeur or dreiss it doesnt really change anything just split the stuff in two different weapons.
I personally think the long range damage on revivr was fine since she is supposed to be a long range merc but if people really think she was OP they should have nerfed the close range, which is where she shouldnt be good at being a long range merc.
So my proposition is:
Reverse the Fall of Damage Health on Revive so that it increases with the distance, resulting in close range low damage and low revive and long range which is actually more difficult is reward.
Maybe reduce a bit the self healing capability to make it fair for other snipers (or remove it and make the reviver heal teammate)
give her the Defib like medic instead of the helping up on the F keys (or maybe she already have it never tried actually) So That if she wants to full revive fallen teammate she either have to take a step back which isnt always possible or she have to risk it and go with the Defib making her having to risk her ass.
[/quote]
Yeah I know the revivr is her primary. The point is to split the weapons. Make the revivr a strictly defensive weapon making sparks vulnerable when she has it out and trying to revive someone. Hence remove the damage from her revivr.
But your point on:
[*] Reverse the Fall of Damage Health on Revive so that it increases with the distance, resulting in close range low damage and low revive and long range which is actually more difficult is reward.
Is actually a pretty fair proposition because even though the revivr can be used offensively, she will still be at a disadvantage in close range gun fights.
[center]@Black
For the healing side i think it can be fine to negate the close range revive with the reviver. Maybe its a bit too much but i think its worth a test cause right now sparks is more of a close range mid range medic which i dont think she was meant to be.
Like if you are too close you cant revive with it, but we give her the Defib on the F key instead of helping so that to revive someone to close to her she either have to take a step back, which isnt always possible and which will not full health revive the teammate, or she have to get out her comfort zone with Defib to full health revive a close teammate.
This offers ennemy potential windows to kill merc that on longer distance can full revive ennemies and one shot most squishy merc providing the player have the skills for it.
Of course she keeps the secondary as primary.
Some will say that she isnt fair to snipers that she can snipe because on top of that she can heal herself, for that first of all sparks has no scope on reviver the ADS is really crappy i dont recall using it once while playing her,
but if and only if it really is big deal after all i suggest to give her only one pack with about the same cooldown which regen half of her life she wont be able to heal herself that much.
And even if her “healing” potential to other merc is touched it should really matter cause her strong point is the revive not the healing.
Another solution would be to buff a bit her hp to 90 id say as 100 maybe too much and remove completely the medpack by replacing it by the Defibrilator as ability instead of just putting it on the F key, and giving the Revivr a minor heal about the same thing or less than the old packs to minorly support the alive teammates to allow her to give a little bit more survivability to her teammate in an attempt to avoid them to die too close from her as it wouldnt benefit neither her or her teammate since should either have to expose herself or revive them with much less life.
She would still be strong at long range like she is meant to be but weaker at close range and sometimes forced to take risk. On the other hand if she has the capacity of sniping snipers and minorly heal her ennemies in one weapon she is the only medic who cant heal herself. but this last option may not please a lot of player.[/center]
This solution would actually be nice with my cobalt 181 tornado agent which has Quick draw, it wouldnt really be big deal with the speed at which i switch my weapon
[quote=“Jesus;149948”][quote=“WaffleMonster;149755”][quote=“Jesus;149735”][quote=“WaffleMonster;149552”][quote=“Jesus;149413”][quote=“WaffleMonster;149329”]
The reason why I say it’s skill less gameplay is it takes no skill reviving as sparks in that situation whilst if you are a standard medic you are forced to fight first or make the decision to try and go in with defibs and face almost certain death. [/quote]
For me to finish your ennemies faster when there is a sparks is just adaptation to the merc you are fighting. Almost common sense.
And if you are saying revive from distance is bad gameplay well then you might as well remove the merc because on that point nothing changed. And if standard medic have to go fight for someones revive, thats because they have the weapon to do it they have smg’s and shotgun and two of them has way more hp. You cant expect a merc with 80hp and a secondary to go out of his way like a sawbones thats just bad faith. [/quote]
Adaptation yes, awful gameplay yes. I know a lot of comp players who just wished sparks was never introduced and many who refuse to play this game because of the way she changes the game.[/quote]
And i wish fragger was never introduced cause of its awful “i cook my grenade two seconds and throw it iin your face so you cant dodge the death” Do you see me making thread for fragger nerf every now and then like a nab? Am i asking for overkill nerf on him? Am i stoping to playing the game because of him ? No i just adapt to it and try to kill him before he throws the nade. Its stupid not to play because of one merc ability and the people doing that are stupid. Fragger is bad gameplay too. Skill less on top of that absolutely anyone can be good at fragger. Yet other players arent asking for nerf constantly get over yourself and stop asking to nerf every merc you dont play just to make the game easier for you. If you cant adapt to a Sparks or to any other merc, the only one with a bad gameplay is you.[/quote]
Sparks is a merc who utterly changes the game and there’s very little you can do about it. She’s like vassili back when he had instagib. [/quote]
This is utter bullshit you just had to finish your damn kills it doesnt even take one second ffs.
[/quote]
Taking 1 second in mid combat to go for gibs in a game as fast paced as db is a game changer. Before sparks came along you could purposely leave enemies un-gibbed to bait medics out of positions, you wern’t under pressure to gib enemies instead of shooting at people engaging you. In addition gibbing enemies before they are rezed isn’t always as easy as it sounds, the reality is that sparks brought back revive trains (very low skill gameplay).
Fraggers nades have been nerfed into the ground, they no longer instagib which means that a lot of the time those kills count fornothing as a medic can instantly pick them up and they had their max damage blast radius halved making multi-kills far harder and rarer. You are also ignoring the timing aspect of nades, against decent players you have to throw them blind if you want to get kills.
What fragger comes down to is the m4 and a high health pool, to be effective with him takes a lot of fps skill (as he has no other ability to make him more powerful). This element you seem to be ignoring completely. What you seem to not understand is the “Go forward & shoot” gameplay is incredibly challenging and highly skill based. It requires excellent aim (fast movement combined with long ttk), excellent positioning and excellent timing (which comes from game sense). This is what makes db great, it seems very simple but has a very high skill ceiling.
In my time playing db, sparks is the easiest medic I have played.
Why? Because all you have to do is sit back and spam the revivr at fallen teammates and occasionally at enemies, this is incredibly low risk with high reward.
Since when did shooting at completely still teammates lying on the ground when under very little pressure become “skillful”?
Sawbonez requires far more game sense and ability to be effective as both a medic and a dueler. The decision making with a traditional medic is far harder than with sparks.
[quote=“WaffleMonster;150068”][quote=“Jesus;149948”][quote=“WaffleMonster;149755”][quote=“Jesus;149735”][quote=“WaffleMonster;149552”][quote=“Jesus;149413”][quote=“WaffleMonster;149329”]
The reason why I say it’s skill less gameplay is it takes no skill reviving as sparks in that situation whilst if you are a standard medic you are forced to fight first or make the decision to try and go in with defibs and face almost certain death. [/quote]
For me to finish your ennemies faster when there is a sparks is just adaptation to the merc you are fighting. Almost common sense.
And if you are saying revive from distance is bad gameplay well then you might as well remove the merc because on that point nothing changed. And if standard medic have to go fight for someones revive, thats because they have the weapon to do it they have smg’s and shotgun and two of them has way more hp. You cant expect a merc with 80hp and a secondary to go out of his way like a sawbones thats just bad faith. [/quote]
Adaptation yes, awful gameplay yes. I know a lot of comp players who just wished sparks was never introduced and many who refuse to play this game because of the way she changes the game.[/quote]
And i wish fragger was never introduced cause of its awful “i cook my grenade two seconds and throw it iin your face so you cant dodge the death” Do you see me making thread for fragger nerf every now and then like a nab? Am i asking for overkill nerf on him? Am i stoping to playing the game because of him ? No i just adapt to it and try to kill him before he throws the nade. Its stupid not to play because of one merc ability and the people doing that are stupid. Fragger is bad gameplay too. Skill less on top of that absolutely anyone can be good at fragger. Yet other players arent asking for nerf constantly get over yourself and stop asking to nerf every merc you dont play just to make the game easier for you. If you cant adapt to a Sparks or to any other merc, the only one with a bad gameplay is you.[/quote]
Sparks is a merc who utterly changes the game and there’s very little you can do about it. She’s like vassili back when he had instagib. [/quote]
This is utter bullshit you just had to finish your damn kills it doesnt even take one second ffs.
[/quote]
Taking 1 second in mid combat to go for gibs in a game as fast paced as db is a game changer. Before sparks came along you could purposely leave enemies un-gibbed to bait medics out of positions, you wern’t under pressure to gib enemies instead of shooting at people engaging you. In addition gibbing enemies before they are rezed isn’t always as easy as it sounds, the reality is that sparks brought back revive trains (very low skill gameplay). [/quote]
What ? Where you playing at the time where revive train was a problem ? because then you are saying non sense the state of the game right now is nowhere near the revive train issue we got.
Changing your gameplay when a new merc comes around is normal before the CW update in 1/2 we were getting a Rhino Aura combo, since Stoker is around these decreased a lot, just because Stoker obliterate them if they do this kind of camp. All in all you are just arguing that you dont want to finish your ennemies, well dont finish them and suck it up when they get revived ive never had a problem playing with or agaisnt sparks before the nerf, this conversation is going nowhere because you keep bringing non sensical argument out of bad faith.
The only very low skill level here is you arguing that you shouldnt have to finish your ennemies
Sparks is the easiest medic to play? While you have an Aura that can put an illiited healing station on cover and start corner peeking. You saying non sense again.
Go forward and shoot the hardest thing to do? with a fucking 150hp merc, this is literally the easiest thing to do in that game, especially with the M4 which has little to no recoil and quite good dps. If this is what Dirty Bombs come down to for devs and if they think like you we might call it Casual Bomb instead because what you are describing is something every decent fps players is able to do, and such general skill arent even called skill anymore thats just basics to play any fps. This kind of gameplay is not what makes DB great its just what make someone like FPS There is nothing challenging nor special nor funny in that kind of playstyle, you could play call of duty or battlefield with the same playstyle and the end you are not using the game mechanics at its full potential. But if thats their vision of Dirty Bomb they can keep it and witness their game dying slowly. There is another game out there who will be more than happy to welcome new players.
If you stayed your ass down behind a wall just reviving people while playing Sparks you can blame the merc, thats how noobies plays sparks every decent Sparks player has had a different playstyle than this simply to use the offensive potential at its best.
Fraggers nades have been nerfed into the ground, they no longer instagib which means that a lot of the time those kills count fornothing as a medic can instantly pick them up and they had their max damage blast radius halved making multi-kills far harder and rarer. You are also ignoring the timing aspect of nades, against decent players you have to throw them blind if you want to get kills.
What fragger comes down to is the m4 and a high health pool, to be effective with him takes a lot of fps skill (as he has no other ability to make him more powerful). This element you seem to be ignoring completely. What you seem to not understand is the “Go forward & shoot” gameplay is incredibly challenging and highly skill based. It requires excellent aim (fast movement combined with long ttk), excellent positioning and excellent timing (which comes from game sense). This is what makes db great, it seems very simple but has a very high skill ceiling.
In my time playing db, sparks is the easiest medic I have played.
Why? Because all you have to do is sit back and spam the revivr at fallen teammates and occasionally at enemies, this is incredibly low risk with high reward.
Since when did shooting at completely still teammates lying on the ground when under very little pressure become “skillful”?
Sawbonez requires far more game sense and ability to be effective as both a medic and a dueler. The decision making with a traditional medic is far harder than with sparks.
[/quote]
Sparks is the easiest medic to play? While you have an Aura that can put an illiited healing station on cover and start corner peeking. You saying non sense again.
Go forward and shoot the hardest thing to do? with a fucking 150hp merc, this is literally the easiest thing to do in that game, especially with the M4 which has little to no recoil and quite good dps. If this is what Dirty Bombs come down to for devs and if they think like you we might call it Casual Bomb instead because what you are describing is something every decent fps players is able to do, and such general skill arent even called skill anymore thats just basics to play any fps. This kind of gameplay is not what makes DB great its just what make someone like FPS There is nothing challenging nor special nor funny in that kind of playstyle, you could play call of duty or battlefield with the same playstyle and the end you are not using the game mechanics at its full potential. But if thats their vision of Dirty Bomb they can keep it and witness their game dying slowly. There is another game out there who will be more than happy to welcome new players.
If you stayed your ass down behind a wall just reviving people while playing Sparks you can blame the merc, thats how noobies plays sparks every decent Sparks player has had a different playstyle than this simply to use the offensive potential at its best.[/quote]
You are forgetting that core fps skills can be performed at completely different levels. You can take 2 players who “can aim” but one can do it better than the other.
When it comes to sparks, I never said you had to be sitting behind a wall “like noobies” to be creating rez trains. You are ignoring the fact that you can sit behind teamates reviving them whilst also shooting and racking up kills simultaneously (the reason why her long range firepower was ridiculous). Low risk, high reward gameplay. That’s how to play sparks to the maximum and at the end of the day she could dominate matches by both rezing and killing in a way no other merc could with no good counter and that’s what made her OP.
What’s challenging about traditional medics compared with sparks?
Decision making. With sparks you can just spam her revivr away to pick up revives and kills with relativiely little thought put into it. With other medics you have to decide when to lead with your defibs or shoot before reviving all in a split second. Sure, in pubs against low skill players aura is very easy to play but in comp where people know how to use explosives and people will kill you if you go in with your defibs out in most scenarios, traditional medics are far harder to play and arguably the most challenging class in the game to play.
Blame that on the dev for leaving her counter merc (aka phantom) completely broken and not reworking him and making him unpicked and not played by most player. This merc is supposed to be the ideal counter to mercs like Sparks and Vassili that are supposed to stay behind their teammate
Phantom is a counter to long distance merc he goes around slash them in there back sparks is a long range merc therefor phantom is a counter. You can even see it in the scrubs trailer when phantom kills vassili.
His role his clearly to get behind merc like that to eliminate them and other key mercs like engineer and other medic
Its not just supposed to be a cool guy going invisible and sword slaying everyone he is a recon and his mission as he has no spotting ability is (like vassili) to pick off key merc that are often squishier than assault, engi and medic. Phantom is supposed to be the perfect guy to get rid of Sparks and Vassilis. If you cant even see that you might want to question you tactical capabilities
