The game's fun, but where's the skill?

(Fallout) #41

Any game that has “go full auto and run side to side” as a good medium quarter tactic clearly is not going to require much skill in combat.

The game’s clearly meant to allow newbies to have fun even when they can’t aim at all. If it takes three headshots, again it’s supporting spraying over actual aim.

Yes, ET takes skill. Everything does. Walking in a straight line takes skill. It just takes skills that are more common sense than developed like in other games.

Hell, I’d say the only reason competitive RTCW even exists anymore is because Id supporting the “lets host tournaments for games people don’t really play much anymore and offer nice prizes” (Quakecon)

RTCW/ET is a fun game that is clearly designed to appeal to casual gamers.

(senator) #42

CS is a ‘just point your gun at the enemy an pull the trigger’ game beecause after 1 sec either you or the other one is dead, no need for fancy maneuvers… is that skill ?

In Q3 and UT2003 you “go full auto and run side to side”… is there skill required??

In ET if you see an enemy and you go full auto you’ll usually miss a lot (even if crouched) because the longer you shoot the worser your bullet spray becomes. So you have to fire in bursts. And you probably cant just sit out the firefight because if your opponent is skilled he’ll be able to shoot back (low ROF = takes longer to kill = enemy can fight back) and a sitting duck is easy to hit. So you have to dodge his bullets aswell as trying to find another good position to fire some shoots at him again.

I’ve played most onlie shooters and I think Et requires a lot of skill to master the weapon and become a good player while many other games are newbie-friendly and all you need to learn is to point the crosshair at the enemy and pull the trigger. That requires skill, not doubting that but ET requires the skill to aim AND the weapon handling skill !

(Whizzy) #43

It’s so funny reading this that i had to reply.
Fallout ever tryed OLTL, ever played 1v1 did you ever try to actualy hit somebody instead of hoping to be lucky and hit your enemy.
If i want some real playing a play RTCW and ET (thnks SplashDamage thnks)
if i need some mindless no worry’s where to shoot just blast away gaming i take Q3 or UT except for thr ctf i never have seen any teamplay or skills in both games but i am fairenough to say i don’t play them that much. For me it is no fun running around with a rocketlauncer just blasting away.
Pick Ups? if anything makes a game somewhat easyer it’s throwing pick ups in it no ammo anymore just wait and it will spawn at the place it will spawn always, in RTCW and in ET you need the help of your teammates for that ammo (or health) You can’t play a single class and promote all the way up you need all classes to play so the variaty in gameplay is “built in”
I have seen many respected players trying to explain to you how this is working (hi Iffy hi Englander hi many many others) and you still try to convince us that Q3 and UT requieres more skill and teamplay.

Ok here is a challenge for ya then (also for all that DO like to play ET)

We are in the process of creating a free RTCW ET tournament open to all players. Since we just started this group is relatively small and we are seeking for more players (especially for the Allied side) The tournament is a spin off from the Battlefield Europe tournament that is played in the next few weeks. Fallout if you are so certain that every NooB (yes your answers in this thread makes you an RTCW NooB in my eyes) can play this game then we certainly need you

for everybody that is interested in BE-ET and want to check out what the heck i am talking about please go to This forum here and read all the info for those who also would like to participate in the BE tournament go to This forum
and put your money where your mouth is

(HellToupee) #44

let me see all fps’s have the side to side thing CS UT Q3 all of them, the head is a tiny target if you sprey and prey you arnt even going to hit the target let alone the head, ive played ut cs q3 all of them and in cs there is far less skill required in a fight because it takes few shots to kill, i have never owned this game i was at a net cafe with no rtcw :(, ut2003 its who has the better weapon, q3 much the same. In rtcw and et the fight is fair you have the same weapon and most classes have the same health, to win the fight you need to be better than the other, now if you think et is so easy its easy for him to so as easy as you can kill him he can kill you.

If you think ET requires no skill (implying u can beat anyone and everyone) prove it against a good player.

(ToeD) #45

seems to me that you are just using the same arguments all the time fallout :o
i think whizzy has a good point. you prove it that we are all newbies and you are will show us how to play this game. hell ill even do a 1on1 vs you myself (if you live in europe that is) irc://irc.quakenet.org/bloodpack << ill be there just ask for ToeD.

(Whizzy) #46

Even when not living in europe he is more then welcome to try us on at BE-ET or against me in a 1v1 i play most of the time USA based servers and i am not afraid of a little lag Hell i even let him choose the server :disgust:

(Unstoppable) #47

They only team for real is the Teamwork with a clan

If your playing witha buch of nobody’s like normal its only rare u do teamwork

its more like Luck if you get teamwork withut ur m8’s

but most of the time ppl just run about like headless chickens trying to get kills

Take the Beach lvl the sea battiery or what ever

their is a back way in and mostly all the axis noobs just want frag’s so they all forgot about it and Most of the time if u play a map the Objecitve goes boom and ppl say WTF HOW!!

and then the 1 person says their is more than 1 way to a map…

and the noobs go HUH?!?!?!?

lol Classic

(Cosmos) #48

People are still learning the maps so I’m not expecting all the players on the team know what they are doing. Perhaps in a few weeks then we shall expect better teamwork as the players have gone through all the maps and tested all the new features compared to the old RTCW if they have used that before.

(Stee) #49

I think you’ll find the guns in CS are modelled on todays weapons which are a lot more precise than the Thompsons/Mp40’s of WW2 which actually did spray a lot, u should take facts like this into consideration before u start criticising the skill of the game compared to others.

(SCDS_reyalP) #50

ROFL, you got those demos of you owning some CAL-I players yet ? Come on, lets see 'em. Since combat doesn’t take much skill, you should be able to hold your own at least, right ?

Oh wait, you don’t respond to anything that would disprove your bullshit claims, most likely because you are just a ****ing useless troll. Of course, that was fairly obvious from your first post.

Tolling message boards is a no skill game if I ever saw one, and you are not even particularly good at that :smiley:

(ZeAvIs) #51

First off fallout, there are some flaws in your argument.

  1. You say that ET/RTCW only require the use of the SMGs and running around and shooting. The fact is, you still have to be good with the SMG to kill people, its the same in every game that has an SMG. CS is all SMGs but instead of running around and shooting, its walking and shooting. The thing is, the SMG is not the only viable/useful weapon in this game just like in Q3/UT2003.Those games require you to be skilled in many weapons other than just one. The rifles with the grenade launchers are really good and take a lot of skill in order to aim the grenade launcher right. The mortar is a hard weapon to use because its difficult to aim. Contrary to what you might think, Flamethrowers are difficult to use because of the fact that they have limited range and you move slower. Panzers seems to be less skillful, but mind that in order to shoot panzers you need a full power bar, so after you shoot you have to wait a long time with your pistol. Also you only get 4 rockets so randomly using panzers will result in you having no ammo. While ultimitle you will get an easy kill sometimes, overall you will be wasiting a panzer and will not be effective at hindering the enemy.

  2. Individual skill in this game is more than just mastering weapons, its also mastering skills of the various classes, and im not talKing about teamwork im talking individually. You have to be good at sneaking around and getting silent kills, destroying objectives with charges in order to be a good covert ops, regardless of how your team is doing. Same with medics and engineers, Field ops and soldiers. You can be an awesome medic without killing anybody, same with engineer. Heavy weapons require you to kill people, thats their job.

Basically, any game with a SMG has the same skill curve as this game because they are require the same skill to master using that weapon. But this game as well as other games require you to be good in many different weapons. THis game just extends that to classes.

(GrumpyDog) #52

I disagree with whole strafy shooty stuff. I’ve KIA’ed a lot of guys by just kneeling and shooting for center of mass or head. They tend to jump all 'round like “CS-Rabbits” and I win as much if not more than they do. Jumping around just throws your aim off, and gets too much tunnel-vision inducing adrenaline going.

Move carefully along walls and cover, don’t get tunnel vision by sweeping for targets constantly, and ID before you shoot. Practice. I’ve seen plenty of noobs tunnel up and forget where they are and end up cannon fodder. Remember ask yourself am I a handgrenade/sniper/mg/Ops “love doll” where I am standing or moving right now?

Just my opinion…

:beer:

(BoneZ) #53

IF you think there is no skill curve and that CS takes more skill then lets see you and some of your CS buddies Start up a wolf clan and Take CAL or something. Should be easy with the little skill involved :smiley:

Take some of the top players in RTCW and try and frag them one on one,
see how far you get, theres tons of skill there.

I’m sure i could come up with a simmiler list of reasons why CS and other games Require less skill then RTCW and ET but i’m not going too because they are different games and there is no reason to play or criticize a game i don’t enjoy

(=TR=Harpo) #54

takes no skill eh? anyone besides me went to the 0++ server and left after five minutes of frustration becase everytime you stick your head around a corner you get your head blown off? Hell that happens to me on alot of servers and i consider myself to be pretty good. And you can tell who the newbies are, there the dead ones on the ground, killed because there manuevering sucks. As for the panzer being a “cowards” weapon, i use it sometimes, i fire once then charge in w/ my pistolas blazing. The people who arent good at panzer get killed very quickly by everyone else. That jut how it goes. I like CS, i play CS, and i have to say that the skills arent the same, but just as hard to get. It probably seems easy to you cause you play CS, and that helps the skills alot. AS to yur comment that CS dosent promote camping, HAVE YOU EVER PLAYED CS!!! never have i played a game(and i play alot of online games) with more camping pussies. They sit in a cubicle on office, behind a box on italy, everywhere. And when the map rotation comes back, oh theres the same guy in the same place. I do like CS, and play it almost as much as RTCW and ET, but your arguments are flawed and moronic. Go to the 0++ server, and have fun. i apologize for no new paragraphs.

(nobody) #55

LOL, you guys are funny… arguing over such irrelevant thing… “skill”, “shmill”… who cares??? People play particular online game because it’s fun. Period. Everything else is irrelevant. Look at it in simple way, no need to fill your brain with useless subjective OPINIONS about particular aspects of the gameplay, especially trying to force them onto someone else. Your opinion, regardless how logically it sounds, won’t make other person (such as me) stop liking the game. So why bother? If you don’t like the game - don’t play it. If you like it - then play it. As simple as this. :stuck_out_tongue:

(Phoenix-D) #56

On mines and rockets:

They aren’t skilless. Rockets have a delay before firing. Sure, you’ll often kill someone; that’s what splash damage does. The difference between good at bad there is a good player will kill more than one person, or kill the tank AND the driver (where a newbie might miss, or aim for the treads…which doesn’t always kill the driver)

Mines? Placement. All placement. Put them in bad spots and you TK or no one comes near. Now, they take some skill on the reciving end; if you can react quick enough you can stop them from detonating. Just stop when they click (and hope the lag doesn’t get too bad)

I’ll come back again when Fallout stops repeating the “Spray and pray” arguments over and over and over, ignoring everyone else…and end with this.

Game using SMG, random running and firing:
2-15 kill/death

Game using SMG, running to dodge, stop/crouching to fire:
9-5

Same server. Same players, more or less. It is really amusing how many people still think you’ve died if you go prone. :slight_smile: