Snipers should cost 100k each!

(henki000) #41

@Sorotia

Aim is not only about aim. You need to be undetected, safe and fast enough. Even if you could aim, the xp does not divide equally compared to skill/time against other mercs.

If they can’t aim a gun what makes you think they’re going to be able to aim a good spot to drop their ability?

What is good spot is relative preception. I think using abilities does not compare equally to accurate shots. Badly placed healing station can give you easier xp and credits and usually does.

@LifeupOmega

I have killed “good” snipers with knife and other weapons. Being a good sniper or any class means that you have a team that support you and keep your lanes covered. Its quite rare these days, I wonder why? Hmm, lets think. I think it could be because snipers are nerfed to the point that they are only picked by “leet” players. Thats why new players pick snipers, to be 1337. This is fast game, you can jump great distances very fast and beat enemy team communication by time. What I said about rushing just the middle was figuratively speaking. Sniping affects this kind of behaviour and can be especially noticed in competetive scene.

(Press E) #42

@henki000 said:
@STARRYSOCK

Playing sniper does not mean that you have to camp in corner and fail your team. Instead their second abilities, like heartbeat sensor or smoke grenade can be used as a effective weapon that benefits whole team. Then after their second abilities, its nowadays only about headshots. It does not mean that someone has no skill or it would be random occurrence when someone lands a HS. I think playing sniper rifle needs more skill than most of the other weapons, since it is more unforgiving. I dont play sniper as my main, but still think they are equal part of the surrounding sphere. I agree that Dirty Bomb is fast paced and versatile. I just think that sniping in this game is fast paced and without them the game would be less versatile. You say sniper is fun only for those who play it, I disagree. It just needs a new strategy to counter them, maybe walk behind and use knife. That is what makes snipers so great. If there were no snipers, people would not use side paths and just rush in the middle. Sharpshooters transform general gameplay to something different, it is always refreshing to see overall team synergy to take a different nuance.

I’m not saying their abilities are bad, just that the concept of sniper rifles in DB doesn’t fit. Spotting is an amazing ability, it’s more than a crucial part of the game, but sniping in general is not.

Whether or not they take skill isn’t what I was saying. They’re some of the hardest classes to play, but skill level doesn’t automatically mean something fits with the game.

Using flank routes isn’t something that only happens against a sniper, it’s something any half decent team does. Because well, snipers aren’t the only mercs that can block off a main route at range. Any firesupport or even a half decent aura with a blish can excel at range, but also in close quarters. Snipers on the other hand, typically can’t. In fact, machine pistols were nerfed in part specifically to make vassili less versatile at close range.

Not even focusing on what percentage of snipers are actually decent enough to pull it off, but locking down a route with a sniper doesn’t fit the game at all, it just makes things slower. Of course it forces the team to be creative, but it’s also possible to force that with a team of decent firesupport mercs as well.

TL;DR, I’m not talking about skill at all, but any sniper who is capable of locking down a route can usually accomplish a lot more as nearly any other merc. Firesupports and almost every other merc can already dominate at close, medium and long range, having snipers that are only decent at long range just seems redundant and out of place.

(Nail) #43

snipers are here to stay SD likes them

(Sorotia) #44

@Nail said:
snipers are here to stay SD likes them

Are you sure? That jump sniping nerf says different.

Not saying they should be in game, just really getting on my nerves that these newb Snipers that are carrying up the rear even on offense and they’re good for nothing.

Even when they contribute nothing to the match, refuse to change…it’s like you’re down a man or three depending on how many good for nothing are in the match.

A good Sniper can kick some real ass, but the number of good snipers is a tiny fraction compared to the number of shitty snipers who ruin games.

(Press E) #45

I highly doubt SD would ever actually remove snipers. Ideally I’d just like to see them reworked so the moa, felix and pdp were replaced with other fairly long range rifles and the mercs balanced accordingly, but well, you know how SD is. They’d rather just nerf something and leave it broken for over a year than directly deal with it.

(neverplayseriou) #46

@henki000 “I have killed “good” snipers with knife and other weapons” looking at what crap you’re all saying on here I highly doubt you’ve ever met any good players in game.

(znuund) #47

I have no idea, why this is worth discussing actually. They are part of the game. But since this platform is not contributing to any development anyway, go ahead :slight_smile:

(Press E) #48

@znuund said:
I have no idea, why this is worth discussing actually. They are part of the game. But since this platform is not contributing to any development anyway, go ahead :slight_smile:

It’s fun to talk about these things. Question why they exist and what things would be like without them. I don’t comment here because I think snipers will actually be removed.

(TitaniumRapture) #49

@STARRYSOCK said:

@znuund said:
I have no idea, why this is worth discussing actually. They are part of the game. But since this platform is not contributing to any development anyway, go ahead :slight_smile:

It’s fun to talk about these things. Question why they exist and what things would be like without them. I don’t comment here because I think snipers will actually be removed.

Yeah ranting is all I can do about it. :confused:

(henki000) #50

@STARRYSOCK

I’m not saying, that you say that sniper requires no skill. I’m not saying that flank routes are only option when playing against sniper. You cant lock a route only with a sniper. Like you said yourself, you can use other merc that block routes. Grenades, missiles and molotovs comes to my mind first. It suddenly makes sniping much more difficult. But still you have to be fast when countering or playing sniper and be part of versatile battleground.

@neverplayseriou

I have played Since March 30, 2015 and joined to dbnation contests and esl cup. Not with great success thought.

(Nail) #51

@Sorotia said:

@Nail said:
snipers are here to stay SD likes them

Are you sure? That jump sniping nerf says different.

Not saying they should be in game, just really getting on my nerves that these newb Snipers that are carrying up the rear even on offense and they’re good for nothing.

Even when they contribute nothing to the match, refuse to change…it’s like you’re down a man or three depending on how many good for nothing are in the match.

A good Sniper can kick some real ass, but the number of good snipers is a tiny fraction compared to the number of @$!# snipers who ruin games.

yes, I’m certain, jump snipe has been contentious since closed alpha especially considering it’s impossible to actually do irl

(Sorotia) #52

@Nail said:

@Sorotia said:

@Nail said:
snipers are here to stay SD likes them

Are you sure? That jump sniping nerf says different.

Not saying they should be in game, just really getting on my nerves that these newb Snipers that are carrying up the rear even on offense and they’re good for nothing.

Even when they contribute nothing to the match, refuse to change…it’s like you’re down a man or three depending on how many good for nothing are in the match.

A good Sniper can kick some real ass, but the number of good snipers is a tiny fraction compared to the number of @$!# snipers who ruin games.

yes, I’m certain, jump snipe has been contentious since closed alpha especially considering it’s impossible to actually do irl

Just like it would be impossible for petite little 120 pound women to jump around and fire shotguns with almost pinpoint accuracy without getting knocked onto their ass, or without injuring themselves?

Game has a lot of impossible that people do daily…

(Nail) #53

lol, I know several

reality isn’t the point, jump snipe should never be allowed imo, shouldn’t be able to scope while jumping, back in alpha there was originally no penalty, that truly sucked, I still don’t like it but whiners do, so it stays to some extent

btw, once again, snipers aren’t going anywhere, trust me

(Xenithos) #54

@teflonlove said:

@WatchAsILead said:
If we get 1 bad sniper on each team they cancel out

There is no combination where snipers are fun for anyone but the snipers.

Woke :open_mouth:

Really though, it’s less about the worst sniper dragging the team down usually, but the team that has no medics or the worst medics… that’s the team that usually ends up failing.

(Xenithos) #55

I’m sorry, but jump sniping was one of the stupidest thigns in DB back when it existed. A vassili throws a heartbeat sensor on the top of the bridge in chapel, then hides behind the wall of the tree, and literally just waits for a beep, jumps aiming at the beep, rights his aim mid jump and instant kill with a finish (because back then his shots would instagib as well). I had 3 people every spawn wave killed to that by just one sniper who happened to know how to jump snipe.

You want to talk about not fun? That wasn’t fun.

(Xenithos) #56

Also, I’d like to point something out, Vassili is kind of a ghost player when played averagely. No one here really comments about how useful vassilis are even when played AVERAGELY. The ones that have average score or high score but aren’t necessarily top scoring or having that score due to kills. Yes, I’m talking about the ones that throw their heartbeat sensors often, and you play the game knowing where the enemy is, and you don’t even stop to think about just how helpful that vassili is being simply by his ability.

I’ve had Vassilis that couldn’t hit jack crap, but threw their heartbeat sensors, and I’m sorry, I loved having them on my team in 7v7 and 6v6s.

(bgyoshi) #57

@Xenithos said:
I’m sorry, but jump sniping was one of the stupidest thigns in DB back when it existed. A vassili throws a heartbeat sensor on the top of the bridge in chapel, then hides behind the wall of the tree, and literally just waits for a beep, jumps aiming at the beep, rights his aim mid jump and instant kill with a finish (because back then his shots would instagib as well). I had 3 people every spawn wave killed to that by just one sniper who happened to know how to jump snipe.

You want to talk about not fun? That wasn’t fun.

I have mixed feelings about that, since it’s REALLY difficult to do. But on the other hand, sort of impossible to counter. The instagib combination was too good though. It wouldn’t be nearly as good of a strat with the way it works now.

Admittedly, I try to do a lot of shots while falling and forget that the accuracy is trashed in the air… and get a little sour, wishing I could. But at the same time… jump sniping… was actually OP, if someone could do it.

(SnakekillerX) #58

Remove snipers from the game? You people are out of your minds.
Don’t like the enemy team shutting you down with a sniper? Counter snipe and kill him, problem solved. Don’t like a shitty sniper on your team? Give them tips on becoming a better player/sniper and give them the time to learn.

I’d rather have a crappy sniper on my team than a crappy medic, at least I don’t have to deal with the though of having support from a crappy sniper incase I die or run out of ammo… that becomes a problem as soon as they become a medic, support, or even an engineer. When you expect them to do their job, and they don’t.

At least with a sniper they are spotting enemies, and trying to shoot people, while other players fill the important roles.

(GabebutGood) #59

I think everyone has bad games even with the skill cannon aka the PDP, sniping to very difficult even hitting body shots is hard sometimes. I do understand the plight of noobs playing valvoline and i’ve experienced it. I think people should be able to play who they want in pubs but in comp they should try and work with their team, however this doesnt always work. They should also understand that a sniper might not be very good at certain places on different maps, also they would hopefully know when to switch to different merc if they arent getting any value from sniping. I dont think changing their price or anything to that nature would change anything, I think this one is with the person playing.

I truly do think its a class that truly requires skill and requires some preexisting experience with accuracy, @GatoCommodore had said something about turning snipers into projectile weapons which I really like but that increases the skill cap quite a bit, I feel it would also require snipers to get damage buff to even out the difficulty vs reward. it would also mean that medium to close range sniping would alot harder so rushing them would be a more reliable strategy, very cool idea.

Also I have question, why is there such a large sentiment against body shots? They are more reliable, they can aid team mates in gun fights, pick off fleeing enemies etc. Mind you yes head shots do those but with lag, hit reg, and aiming in mix I dont think its sign of low skill or un-usefulness to a certain extent.

(Noir) #60

@GabebutGood said:
Also I have question, why is there such a large sentiment against body shots?

Because any player with little experience on FPS games can bodyshot consistently. It rewards way too much considering the little skill it takes. Low risk/skill - high reward.
The worse being those camping the back of the map who bodyshot you while you’re having a fair 1V1.