Requests For Competition Tweaks

(Rahdo) #161

Yeah, that had already been in the plan. But I hadn’t thought about taking it one step further and making it available for non-clan players…

(Shiv) #162

maybe a quick vote to decide who’s uniform to use for the match, during warmup of course… and when you spawn for the actual game your in the uniform that had the most votes.
then you avoid the case of the dodgey ass cape!
and everyone will be in Santa suits!

(SockDog) #163

Wouldn’t you just make this a client side change like force_model?

I’m assuming the body types stretch and fit to any of the clothing options. So in the character creator you just have Rebel and Security Uniform options and a menu entry to switch it on and off.

If it did work that way one suggestion I’d have is to allow wildcard items of clothing. So you could for example stipulate in your rebel uniform the clothing on the torso and legs but allow each of the players defined headgear and footwear to import and display. or the other way, you could just define the headgear (big red/green arrow hat) and allow the rest of the clothing be as defined by the players.

(darthmob) #164

If you are supposed to distinguish between classes and team on a public server than surely a dedicated player can do it without problems. Hint: learn to play the game! :rolleyes:

PS: Of course, if there are no visible differences between the classes in public play I can understand the request for competition.

(tokamak) #165

Very good point. Calling for bright skins and easy distinguishable uniforms specifically for competitive play speaks book parts about the skill of an average comp player.

(.Chris.) #166

And what if you cant easily distinguish teams in public either?

I don’t get why some are bashing people here for suggesting what appear to be reasonable ideas to help some form of competition scene to develop from day one, the rest can be picked up by a competition mod later on to add further refinements that the scene demands after trying the game out fully.

Having the basic features to aid competition play that don’t affect the gameplay such as pause and spectator lock, would be greatly welcome in any game personally speaking

(tokamak) #167

If it’s a fundamental problem, which I doubt SD would allow to exist in the first place, then why would deserve competitive players a special treatment?

(darthmob) #168

[QUOTE=chr1s;198414]I don’t get why some are bashing people here for suggesting what appear to be reasonable ideas to help some form of competition scene to develop from day one[/QUOTE]Basically there is nothing wrong with that. It’s just that different people have different opinions on what is reasonable and what isn’t. :slight_smile:

(acidrain) #169

Why do you guys care so much about the requests of competition players? If it’s not part of your default gameplay then it doesn’t affect you. If it aids a certain group of players and doesn’t change the way you play the game then why take that away from them?

Is it because you feel that any development time spent on their requests means fewer features for public play? That’s a bit selfish isn’t it?

(tokamak) #170

No, it’s just the attitude that comp players deserve a less faulty system than public players which I don’t like. Competition features should always be external, the gameplay (which involves the question of bright skins etc) should stay the same.

Basically it said "Yo, we competition players really need bright skins to discern between team mates and enemies, what? Pubs? Well let them fiddle around and shoot their friend’s brains out, they’re just pubbers anyway.

(shirosae) #171

[QUOTE=acidrain;198448]Why do you guys care so much about the requests of competition players? If it’s not part of your default gameplay then it doesn’t affect you. If it aids a certain group of players and doesn’t change the way you play the game then why take that away from them?

Is it because you feel that any development time spent on their requests means fewer features for public play? That’s a bit selfish isn’t it?[/QUOTE]

It’s even worse than that in the above argument about team colours:

Apparently if it’s difficult for pub and comp players alike to tell the teams apart, fixing it would be considered ‘special treatment’ for comp players, because the suggestion came from comp players.

Automatically dismissing suggestions that penalise no-one and benefit some/all players solely because they came from comp players is a little like cutting off your face to spite your nose.

(tokamak) #172

Yes, it does bother me that it’s posed as a sole pub concern. There’s a suggestions forum if you’re so worried about gameplay issues.

Again competition tweaks should not meddle in basic gameplay. They’re all external features that help competitions run more smoothly.

(DarkangelUK) #173

Tbh, brightskins are bloody ugly and would only offend what looks to be a beautiful looking game. At the end of the day, it’s gonna primarily be for comp players which, if previous discussions are anything to go by, could be added in a comp mod. i don’t think the artist want to go through the trouble of making the chars look awesome, just for players to turn them into bright, luminous green blobs…

(SockDog) #174

Jesus why is everyone so bloody petty and bitchy?

IMO (as a PUB gamer) a Force_Models feature would be a nice option. It allows people to afford more clarity and consistency when playing. It addresses the concerns of people who fear the “custom cock tattoos” scenario. It also provides a good basis for a competitive mod if not totally solving it. It’s optional.

(Nail) #175

what’s with all this “brightskins” talk
I thought competition features were teamlock, speclock, pausing, weapon restrictions, broadcast capability, etc, what league uses “brightskins” ?

(tokamak) #176

Indeed, all the rest are proper competition settings, bright-skins as a means to solve hypothetical gameplay issues however, isn’t. It’s basically implying that competition deserves less issues which is nonsense.

Or calling everyone names for that matter…

(aimology) #177

Having a quakelive feature in this game is pointless. Dont need brightskins. If you cant tell the enemy apart from their jersey color to your teammate colors you shouldnt be playing in the first place. I do admit that the skins should not be the same as the other team, but other then that, no you dont need brightskins. Ive never seen a game with “brightskins” except for quake. Unless you count cheating and using them.

(deadlights) #178

I am sorry if this idea was suggested, as I only really picked up on the later end of this arguement, because people seemed to be bashing eachother non stop, but I had an idea never-the-less.

Brightskins = no. As a vet from Quake3 and QuakeLive. I really think that would seriously hurt the flavor of BRINK. It is useful for QL because of the EXTREME level of professional play… It was at one time, the top most professional game ever played. Comp tweaks and config tweaks were important for smooth play and common ground between competetors. Often they used the same cfg.

So because of idTech4, we know there will be some config toggles and stuff… But yes, I agree maybe it will be difficult to tell teams apart in BRINK with out arrows. Because the art looks amazing, and really until we play we wont know… But maybe speculate it could be hard.

So… With that said. Why not make a CVAR that allows for there to be Red vs. Blue. The old traditional. Then when teams connect they have a unlocked Blue or Red jersey for their team, depending on what side they join. And this can be a server setting or just a “pro mod” feature.

Or maybe to avoid pub servers unlocking this CVAR all the time and hurting the flavor of BRINK with all the effort SD has done with their art… Maybe when people install the game a Red Shirt and Blue Shirt are already unlocked? Or maybe that will be more confusing if there are PUBs with mixes of shirts running around and red is killing red and blue vs blue… etc.

Just trying to get some ideas going, and again I appologize for a repost if some one suggested this idea.

But I think alot of dispute can stop if this is simply a CVAR unlock. I think that was just the purpose of the post. When you have a game that can go to comp play, there is often a ProMod made. W:ET, ET:QW, CoD4, CSS… etc. So, why not already have some of these CVARs ready? This does not mean the pubbers have to even think twice about them. They will never know they are there. But when it comes time to set up a match on a private non pub server, you can unlock some settings… and BOOM. More competetive game, even playing field, different from pubs yes, but the same concept. Then every one is happy.

Is that a problem? I don’t see it…

(deadlights) #179

Ok, I just took time to see a little of the arguement. Now my post above I still think is important to read, but I want to address Tokamak for a sec here. Also, I did not read most of this thread due to all the hate… And if I am just stubling on a rant here, or missed the point of what is going on, I am REALLY sorry guys… I will replace that wasted 5 minutes with an e-cookie. PM me.

Tok, first… I am not going to bash you in anyways. Or cut you down or make you feel shi*ty. I am going to make some assumptions and please correct me if I am wrong.

I see you are a pubber, and thats how you play. I am assuming that you don’t care for comp play, nor truly understand it. I also assume you have not played comp? And because of this I want you to kinda see where the comp guys are coming from, if you don’t. Ok?

Now. I feel like I can talk to you because I am an admin for an online league called Stronger Than All. We hosted many seasons for Quake Wars recently. I play comp games. It is what I do when I game. All of SD’s games have been in TGL, CAL, STA… etc etc. Online leagues that make it so we can do battle and well, play e-sports. Now I am not trying to insult your intellegence, and you have made some good arguments… I know you know what e-sports is… :slight_smile:

BUT

The principal behind comp play is simple: Fair and balanced play. So both clans can start on an even field when it comes to the GAME. The skill then comes from the match and well, the better clan wins. And there are NO excuses to why the other clan lost. One is just better and the game can’t be blamed because of an in-balance. (This is of course, what we wish for… people still complain and hell, each game will have a little something, but we do with what we can.)

Sometimes to acchieve this, tweaks have to be made. Changes to the game. And this is allowed because most if not all developers are happy to see their game go places!

So if I am reading your post right, why do comp players get special treatment? I would not look at it that way. I would look at it this way:

  1. There is the pub/stock/vanilla game that is BRINK. That is Quake Wars, CoD4… etc.
  2. Each game has unlocks, skills, weapons, ranks etc… Things that can make one player better than the other. See where I am going with this?
  3. A pro mod is made. Because often these systems make the game unfair right at the start of a match. What if one clan had 4 rank 55 players and the other clan had 2 rank 34 and rank 20 etc… Well the one with 55 have better guns and abilities. Can we call this fair? No. Or even no?

So, in short… Don’t look like it as special treatment. Look at it like two game modes. You like CTF, I like Death Match. You like PUB games, I like Comp games… See? So we reach a common ground. You can cross over if you want, but you don’t have to…

Now the bright skin arguement? Well what if that was only an option on their locked server? (I don’t want those btw, see above post) With their own rules, own different ways or playing, and weapons… etc? What if you NEVER see it? Would that bother you then?

I would not call it special treatment. I would look at it as another way of playing the game. These CVAR unlocks will help keep more players happy… Because SD’s job is to keep all players happy. Casual, Hardcore, Noobs, Comp, Killaz, OMGHAX (not really), etc…

I hope that helps. And sh*t I did not read most this thread. If I missed the point, my bad. But really… I think it is silly to get all crazy on eachother when we should be hitting common ground here. Comp play will not effect you if you do not want it do… Just like if you hate CTF and love DM, well then don’t play CTF.

peace

(tokamak) #180

See, that’s exactly the problem! Why should competition be more fair and balanced? A pub player is not in any way a less serious player.