k43 vs garand - fair?

(bani) #1

Axis have a rifle which not only has more rounds per clip, you can reload it mid-clip.

Do you think this is fair?

(Cyber-Knight) #2

Nein!!!

:angry:

(Brevik) #3

It’s not really fair, but I’ve only ever used them for sniping, and I’ve not really been that worried about the difference.

The axis guy’s extra rounds and reload don’t matter a damn when you’ve just shot him in the head as he’s looking for a target… :smiley:

(Wicky) #4

I also thought it was unfair, until I realized that the allied covert ops can be a key figure in most of the maps. While the axis covert ops is damaging constructions and planting confusion among the allies, the allies covert ops can effectively bring victory to his team by sneaking through team-doors with an engineer.
Talking about teamdoors, there aren’t ANY which are for allies, so the improved sniper rifle from the axis is somehow a bonus, to even this out that the axis can’t bring anyone through a team-door because there simply are no locked doors for them :slight_smile:

So my vote goes to: Fair

(Brinkman) #5

yeah if you’re using them for an assault weapon then you’re not doing your job and picking hte wrong class

(Ifurita) #6

I have absolutely no problems with the differences in capabilities. I play mostly Stopwatch servers, so both sides get to deal with the differences in reload and magazine capacity

(Dawg) #7

I would not call it ‘fair’ so much as ‘not unfair’. The Axis weapon is definately superior in the game. The game weapons are based on the real-world weapons. If they want them to be more balanced, then the allies should use the same sniper rifle as the Germans (as in RtCW) rather than one peculiar to the allies.

Considering the other capabilities as balancing out the weapon difference is not a good measure (IMHO). Hopefully, there will be a nice selection of community-created maps that will allow the axis to sneak into things rather than the allies.

However, I believe that the weapon is a secondary feature of the class. CovertOps should be spotting mines, using satchel chargers, laying smoke, and otherwise exploiting their class features to aid their team. Yes, sniping also helps, but spotting those mines is often the most important thing a covertOps can do for his team - but doesn’t.

Dawg

(tjw) #8

Wunderbar!!!

(bani) #9

er… i wasnt talking about the covops having this rifle so much as the ENGINEER having it.

they balanced the mp40/thompson, even going as far as making them have the exact same ROF/damage/spread/clipsize even when this deviated from the real life characteristics of the weapons. so i’m wondering why they didn’t do the same for k43/garand.

(bani) #10

yeah if you’re using them for an assault weapon then you’re not doing your job and picking hte wrong class[/quote]

so i’m wrong in picking the garand as allied engineer? :???:

(Brinkman) #11

yes… only thing good about it is grenade alt fire. but that combo doesn’t even come close to the SMG/regular grenade combo…

if you cant finish them off at a distance with your SMG then switch to grenade hold it in for 3-4 clicks and let it go…

(duke'ku) #12

if you can’t finish them off within normal grenade range, your aim sucks. seriously.

(bani) #13

yes… only thing good about it is grenade alt fire. but that combo doesn’t even come close to the SMG/regular grenade combo…

if you cant finish them off at a distance with your SMG then switch to grenade hold it in for 3-4 clicks and let it go…[/quote]

strange… because i pwn with the k43/garand. i use it almost exclusively over the smg as engineer. these rifles have no spread increase, even when you are sprinting…

so your position is that its fair that the k43 has larger clip and reload mid-clip used by engineers?

(bani) #14

…and when people start making maps with allied teamdoors?

(Dawg) #15

Oops. I got caught up in what everyone else was saying. I assumed we were discussing covertOps. My bad.

But I stand by my opinion that I do not find it unfair. Fair? No. Unfair? No. Wishy-washy? Me.

I, too, found it kinda strange the way they balanced the SMGs exactly but left the rifles so disparate.

Dawg

(SCDS_reyalP) #16

IMO, the garand should have some redeeming value. Greater accuracy or slightly more damage. Or maybe give the allied engineer one more clip, to make up for the ammo they have to waste to reload.

The engineer rifles are quite effective, as long as you don’t expect them to be as accurate as an SMG. Treat it like a semi-auto shotgun rather than a sniper rifle.

In the long term, I think skilled players will lean toward the SMG, because you cannot reliably get headshots at range with the rifles. The randomness of the aim is just too big. The SMGs have a much bigger spread, but fired in single shots or short bursts, they are FAR more accurate.

([B]Visa) #17

I think the garand for the engy is fair…

The reason is that I think it actually encourages people to be engy more as opposing to vanilla Wolf, where the engy is only used to plant/diffuse dyno…

I’m not very skilled with the garand and actually prefer the smg but I think it’s nice to give them something different and useful.

Ike-T

(Ranstaton) #18

The K43 is actually very good in close combat, which is why I use it as a Covops almost always. But whenever I’m on allies I use the Sten because the garand is crap compared to it.

I do not think one team should have a stronger sniper rifle then another. I think they should balance it in some other way like giving the allies an extra clip and letting them reload mid-clip.

They should add a bolt action-rifle…

(SCDS_reyalP) #19

Another thought. People say that not allowing the garand to reload mid-clip is ‘realistic’, but think about how reloading works in ET.

Suppose with and SMG you have 40 rounds outside your gun, and 5 rounds left in your gun. You ‘reload’, which, according the the animation, is just a matter of changing clips. Now you have 30 rounds in your gun, and 15 rounds on your person. If you wanted to be realistic, you should still have 1 clip that only has 5 rounds in, neglecting the question of whether there is a round in the camber. Combining the shells from from two partially used clips is a time consuming operation.

In other words, reloading in ET is completely unrealistic anyway. Many realsim games force you to discard a partially used clip when you reload. That isn’t realistic either (since if I were in the field, I would almost certainly choose to keep the partially used clip), but it is closer.

I’m not saying that ET should go with the realistic approach, just pointing out that it is abitrary to cling to one point of realism while disregarding others in the same area.

(Cyber-Knight) #20

taht’s right. reloading in Wolf is hardly realistic, so why should teh Garand take a different route?

Those reload rates are incredibly fast. You can’t do anything remotely that quickly in real life.

Increase your cg_fov to about 140, and see a Thompson reload. You technically don’t even change the magazine. All he does is pull out the mag, and put the same mag back in and then pulls on the cocking handle. is that considered reloading?

In real life you’d hafta either fiddle around and find a fresh magazine, insert it, and then cock it, then put the old magazine away. (you don’t throw empty magazines away, especially if the have a few rounds left in them)

or take the current magazine you have and put more bullets in it, which would take some time and then put it back in and then cock it.