Gun model

(Kl3ppy) #41

+1

+randomchars

(Kendle) #42

Unfortunately, for me, that’s exactly the problem, if the gun can be hidden I would feel forced to hide it, because it provides too big an advantage not to do so, especially (and perhaps specifically) if you’re playing DB in a competitive environment.

I guess for me the problem is I’m left handed, so aiming via a gun model drawn for a right-handed person is not as easy as if I was naturally right-handed, and also because I started playing RTCW clanned almost as soon as I started playing online, and was immediately advised by my new team-mates to hide the gun as a means to improving my aim, which it did, not seeing a (wrong-handed) gun model really helped me to focus on the crosshair only.

Every game in which I’ve been able to hide the gun I have, I just wish I didn’t have to, especially as I think it’s unfair on people who don’t or don’t know they can (in RTCW / ET you had to edit a config file, something most casual players didn’t even know existed).

As for things like FOV or graphics options, it’s not as simple as “A” is OK but “B” is not. A PC game should cater for different people with different hardware and different preferences, but only within a range of acceptable values. For example, FOV would probably be OK from 70 - 100, for example, and graphics tend to have low / medium / high options etc. As long as all these things are accessible via the game interface (and not only available to people who know there’s a config file you can edit), and as long as the highest and lowest values for these things don’t present a significant advantage, then there should be these options, and for a PC game certainly I can’t see a case for there not being these sort of options.

But gun ON / OFF isn’t a “range of values”, they’re the exact opposite of each other. Large gun model / small gun model, fine, those are options, but ON / OFF isn’t and I sincerely hope the game doesn’t go down that route.

edit: As for the comment about being able to hide the gun in ET and no-one crying about it, that’s true, but only because games tend to “devolve” over time, gradually reducing down to the lowest common denominator. In other words the reason people today don’t complain about hiding the gun (or anything else) is because those who previously would have done, don’t play anymore.

To understand how to improve a game (or any other product) a good starting point is to understand why those who DON’T play that game (or use that product) don’t do so. Or to ask those who used to but stopped, why they stopped. The current player base generally don’t complain about much, because they wouldn’t be the current player base if they didn’t like the game how it is.

(Rex) #43

So if you feel forced, just hide it. No problem!

But excuse me now, I’m going to buy some Razer stuff to get myself the next extreme unfair advantage. Not that I like them that much, but I feel I could lose a competition match without.

(Kendle) #44

Or play something else, that’s the other alternative.

Providing choice is good, because it’s inclusive and spreads the appeal of the game. Forcing some of those choices on players because they provide too big an advantage not to is bad, because it’s actually taking away choice.

(Kl3ppy) #45

[QUOTE=Kendle;422652]Or play something else, that’s the other alternative.

Providing choice is good, because it’s inclusive and spreads the appeal of the game. Forcing some of those choices on players because they provide too big an advantage not to is bad, because it’s actually taking away choice.[/QUOTE]

So its ok if SD offers the choice between showing gunmodel and hiding it or do i understand your comment wrong?

(Nemesty) #46

No problem in Shootmania but I don’t want to see that in DB :wink:
The option for left or right gun it’s a good idea I think.

(Dysfunkshion) #47

Most of the people who play competitive shooters know of .cfg files anyway.
I don’t ever WANT to hide my gun, it just feels wrong. Ofcourse that’s personal preference.
I also don’t see what’s the big issue. The gun takes maybe 1/25th of your entire screen and it’s the bottom part. It doesn’t hinder your sideview at all nor does it hinder your normal view. The only problem is when your either shooting up or down and in either case your peripheral view is pretty small anyways. When you’re viewing from long distances or just straight ahead, the blind spot is almost negligible.

As for fast turning while aiming with gun vs without, it’s the same. If you have good reflexes and a basic feel for the game, you won’t turn too far or not far enough. That’s something determined by experience and skill.

In any case a solution to the current discussion is to have a transparant mode for guns. You can see what’s happening underneath, but you’re also able to see what gun you’re using.

(Kl3ppy) #48

or add a cvar to show/hide gun.

a trasparant gunmodel is crap, as I stated above, add a cvar to show/hide gun and everybody is free to use what he wants. Never heard a discussion in WET/ETQW about showing gun model or not. Even Brink had this cvar. And when you dont know which gun your using, use a weapon bank when switching guns. Or the keys and get used to it.

Just had a quick research about UT Engine:

Weapon Hand: The options here are Right, Left or Hidden, and determine which hand your weapon is depicted as being held in. If you choose Hidden, no weapon is shown - this may improve performance slightly since weapon models are complex - however it may also cause confusion if you’re not aware of which weapon you’re holding at any time.

http://www.tweakguides.com/UT3_6.html

As it seems, you dont need a cvar in your cfg to hide the gun model, its an ingame setting. Also switching from right to left is possible too.
Since this game will use an UT engine, we will have a possibility to change the hand and to hide the gun.

(prophett) #49

There are a lot of good/great ET players who play with drawgun 1 - the decision is hardly forced.

Provide a menu option for drawgun on/off.

(Kendle) #50

Yes, you understand my comment wrong.

(Kendle) #51

[QUOTE=Kleppy;422684]
Just had a quick research about UT Engine:

http://www.tweakguides.com/UT3_6.html

As it seems, you dont need a cvar in your cfg to hide the gun model, its an ingame setting. Also switching from right to left is possible too.
Since this game will use an UT engine, we will have a possibility to change the hand and to hide the gun.[/QUOTE]

We’ll have whatever SD decide we’ll have (I would assume all these features can be enabled or disabled at the developers discretion).

I’d like to hear a case FOR hiding the gun completely, other than disagreeing with me that it’s an advantage, or at least why hiding the gun is neccessary when there’s an option for a small gun in the UT engine.

(Ruben0s) #52

I hope that it will be impossible to tweak this game through a config. I am a bit jealous at console players, they are forced to play with the same settings. I can only dream about that for the PC.

(Mustang) #53

I’m playing devil’s advocate but here goes, my hip is not at eye level.

(rorgoroth) #54

Kendle, why do you hate freedom so much? Why must people be locked in your all gun or small gun jail and not given all choices because you presumably have had bad games against people who use hide gun option?

If people want to deal with having their gun off and spend extra brainpower mentally keeping track of what weapon/item they are using, let them, props to them imo :slight_smile:

(Kendle) #55

Ironsights

(Mustang) #56

Huh, what has that got to do with showing a gun model for hipfire?

(Kendle) #57

It’s not freedom (of choice) if choice A is significantly advantageous to choice B.

(rorgoroth) #58

Sorry, but sooner or later you are going to have to stop blaming other peoples configs for your own failings in stupid, meaningless video games. What next? Lock peoples resolution and force windowed mode? Lock all grpahics settings incase someone sets their gamma too high? Ban anyone from online play if they kill you? Where does this ridiculousness end?

(Kendle) #59

Hopefully when you stop using strawman arguments and understand the issue being discussed.

(rorgoroth) #60

That depends on the individual though. Does anyone who hides gun automatically play like they got mad hax? To me it’s like saying people who master strafe jumping should be stopped and that mechanic ripped out of a game because the others that cant master it think it’s unfair.