Enlighten us then, record a demo on a PB server and tell us how to spot the cheat. Just don’t post a link to demos of known cheaters that we’ve already seen.
Until then, have a good life (and a dancing banana 
).
ENEMY TERRITORY HACKERS
Sauron_EFG
(Sauron|EFG)
#101
DG1
(DG)
#102
I take it your classes have just got around to context. The point everybody else seemed to master was that: there are quite a few cheaters, but put into the context of the tens of thousands of ET players there are hardly any.
OK?
I havent worked out yet if it’s you that is that stupid, or that you simply expect everyone reading your crap to be (an act of stupidity in itself).
Jimbo99
(Jimbo99)
#103
Kendle,
There are alot of friendly fire off servers. You probably have them filtered off. As the game grows the list increases. There are some that start out with FF off as beginner servers but remain FF off after they gain regulars that have become much better.
The anti-lag code in ET is not as good as you say and ET is very ping unforgiving. Anyone playing can easily see that pign is a big factor in duels. As well, there are a number of reputable sites which lay out what is an acceptable ping and what is not.
As for the admins cheating. Really nothing needs to be added to what I posted. It is pretty clear that the admins can and do modify teams, respawn rates, etc. I have set up a server in-house at my computer shop and I can guarantee you that the admins can adjust many settings to their likings.
If you are talking only competitive league play then you have valid points. But the vast majority posting about cheating and the opportunities for cheating are not playing in those leagues, instead they play on pub servers with FF on and FF off.
One thing notable about your response is that you have a set way you think the game should be viewed and hence played and therefore anyone playing in an othewise different fashion is a noob whom you could care less about. That’s fine as long as you stay within those bounds and don’t attempt to foist your view of how it is done and should be done on everyone.
The source code is out there (as I have a copy of it) and there are lots of programmers capable of looking at, modifying it, and recompiling it. This clearly indicates that the game will loose integrity, big time. One of the reasons they haven’t officially released HL2 is because the source code was stolen. People with less then honorable repute and intentions had access to it and that would have ruined the game in the developers view. They have now taken nearly 6-12 months to rework the game so that those possessing the source can’t benefit from it.
So, easily, and clearly, it is the case that giving server admins the source and allowing them access to modify all the variables (variables they should have access to) will hurt the integrity of the game. The variables are nice to have control over but not everyone is honorable and that is clearly seen by visiting some of the public servers. It doesn’t take long to recognize when a server admin is playing with things which were initially designed as “balancing” factors in the game.
I watch players when I am in limbo waiting for respawns and I have yet to see a player cheat. I stated that in my original post.
Note: (Except for a muzzle through a door or firing through a box or propelling players over walls and into areas of the map believed to be unreachable, and, of course, the /playdead thing on the gold rush map).
I have watched players getting owned in duels and from following them clearly they are inferior players. I have seen how they do not point to the head, how they do not spin properly, how they do not jump, etc.
I consider myself a decent player, but by no means an expert or pro. I can hold my own. I have a good ping and I choose servers where I have the best ping.
I also know that the game is someone flakey. for instance, panzers still have remarkable jumping ability when they fire. Panzers are supposed to be heavy and I really find it hard to believe that jumping is possible with one of them on your shoulder and that your targetting and successful hit should not be severely affected while jumping with one and firing. I feel the same way with a machine gun. If you jump you should loose accuracy and be susceptible to being hit. Going prone should not provide you with any sort of mitigation bonus (not saying that it does or doesn’t) but it should make you more prone to headshots.
None of those are considered by me to be cheats. But they factor in how people perceive the game. Time will educate those people as to what is odd behavior and what isn’t. Some just don’t know that jumping helps so much when dueling. That’s when ping really comes into play. If your ping isn’t very good, say in the 150-300 range your opponent can spin around behind you and be shooting you before you have a chance to react because you don’t know it. I’ve seen it many times.
In case one doesn’t know, 3 shots to the head means your opponent is dead. Any weapon, every weapon I have tested results in 3 shots and your dead when hitting in the head.
I have tested this out by using 2 computers on a land non-dedicated server in my computer shop. Pointing a pistol, pointing a sub machine gun, pointing a sten, etc result in 3 shots to the head and you are dead. Of course panzer fire is something different.
What’s odd is that I have stood behind someone in the game and put my gun to the back of their head and shot 10 times and they still lived. Shooting them 10 times on the my test server and they die.
I have also noticed that players can take an inordinant amount of damage from behind (or from the back). The lesson learned is not to shoot people in the back.
The point behind this is that players may perceive these things (such as someone with the ability to do headshots) as a cheater or they can jump around them in a duel and get to the side and shoot them in the head repeatedly and fast. They think their ping is good but the result is they just can’t react well with such a low ping.
Another oddity of the game is the engineer’s rifle grenade. It always goes off exactly when it hits you or comes within range of you. That same grenade thrown by the same engineer by hand instead of launching it goes off after it hits the ground and sometimes a second or two after. This is an oddity of the way that weapon is designed. As a consequence engineers with the rifle grenade with some decent practice and kill well with it, almost beyond belief, and certainly outside of what might be considered by some to be realistic. The end result is some feel it is cheating.
Since this uses the quake engine one can see how some of these issues came into being.
Jimbo99
(Jimbo99)
#104
I take it your classes have just got around to context. The point everybody else seemed to master was that: there are quite a few cheaters, but put into the context of the tens of thousands of ET players there are hardly any.
OK?
I havent worked out yet if it’s you that is that stupid, or that you simply expect everyone reading your crap to be (an act of stupidity in itself).[/quote]
There are cheaters in every game. Every game has some juvenile mentality aching to play the game and get a rise out of the opponent when something happens they didn’t expect
It is funny how some game developers are extremely unforgiving and will examine even the minute possibility of cheating and some developers are fogiving of it until it ruins their hope. For instance, the EverQuest developers are extremely unforgiving of cheating/cheaters and they ban them from the game in a heartbeat. The Diablo developers were very forgiving until the cheating got out of hand.
Both of those games are from companies with a sense of high level integrity about the quality of their games. Blizzard has now taken a strong stance against cheating, but a few years ago the cheating in Diablo was so out of hand that when SC came out there was grave concern about it destroying the game before it got started. Luckily this did not happen.
The point being is that cheating is often not just a matter of killing someone or modifying rates of fire in a game. They can be as simple as modifying something to alter the balance, where sometimes even a delicate change can upset the balance.
Jimbo99
(Jimbo99)
#105
One cheat on servers where the players can /playdead (shrub–i believe), on the goldrush map, an ally can /playdead at the door to the bank and the game announcer indicates that the Allies have taken the first gold crate. Since I don’t cheat I don’t know whether they acually have it and if they are then trapped in the bank until the door is blown but I know for sure that you can /playdead and the announcer speaks about it.
On friendly fire servers, and there are alot of them out there and not all exclusively noob servers, propelling someone over a wall or up to an area of the map that is normally unreachable is exploiting FF off, and hence it is a cheat.
not_chicago
(not_chicago)
#107
As I said, there are quite a few cheaters in this and most games once they have been out a little while. I am surprised that ET does not have more. By the time RTCW was out for 7 or 8 months the cheating had gotten pretty bad in it. ET seems to have faired better than that, but I do see that the cheating is getting worse quickly. I think ET’s strenght is largely due to PB being more advanced that it was back then, and Splash Damage has worked closely with PB to get it to work more intimately with ET than with any game up to this time.
Jumbo99, you are quite correct that a large amount of cheating is done or propogated by admins. I have joined a game, been killed, and waited 18 or so seconds to respawn. Then switched teams, been killed, and suddenly I have to wait 38+ seconds to respawn. That’s when you think, WTF??? You mean this team waits only 18 seconds but the other waits 38 seconds? I have seen this countless times.
Countless. In fact, it’s probably the most common cheat of all in games. Ammo and air strike recharge times and stamina depletion are other common admin cheats. On some servers if you so much as touch your sprint key, your stamina is almost half gone. How sissy. There are quite a few unscrupulous admins in fact. It’s a shame. There are many other little things some admins tinker with to give their team an advantage over the other.It’s unfortunate but true that positions of “authority” draw the unscrupulous and dishonest people. That’s why there are so many crooked cops (not that all cops are), politicians, and game admins. The feeling of having power over others in a strong aphrodisiac to dishonest and disreputable people.
It’s easy to discount someone’s opinion when they say they have never seen or only on the rarest of occasions say that they have seen a cheater. You know such a person is talking trash. We have all seen the guys who spin and headshot you with consistency from a distance, or the guys that use the pistol and only make headshots consistently, and the ones who can take 12-18 rounds without dying, or the ones who can switch weapons intantaneously instead of it taking almost a full second. That one is common too. They run out of ammo with their smg and they are firing a pistol at your head instantly. lol It happens so fast you can’t even seen their arms moving during the weapon change. (I only play on servers where my ping is less than 70 ms and I get 80-150+ fps at 1280x1024, btw) And the ones who go prone in less than 1/2 second instead of the default 2 seconds or more. That one is very popular now. You see them prone in mid air before the even hit the ground because the action has been hacked to take place so fast. lol
Back when RTCW was pretty new, I got my older brother to play with me and we used telephone headsets while we played together on the same team. Kinda like TeamSpeak but better. Talk about fun. When he was just starting to play the game, I remember joining a server and waiting for him to finish copying some files and get connected to the server. In less than 2 minutes I encountered an autoaimer. I told him that I had already seen one. He scoffed (and he is quite a good player). After joining and fighting for about 5 minutes, he said, “WTF is that sht???" Oh no. Uh uh. That’s bullsht right there.” I said, “See, I told you.” Consiquently, we left the server and had a few hours of fun on another where cheating was minimal if not non-existant.
It’s obvious that those who claim to have seen no cheaters are either very poor players who are somehow the few in the world who are unable to tell what cheating looks like or they are just talking trash for other reasons. There will always be idiots like them in gaming. I must say I get a kick out of seeing them crawl out of the holes when the word “cheat” is posted anywhere on forums though. lol It’s like taking a headcount of the misfortunate ones.
I’ve never known a single game in which even average players don’t spot cheaters with relative ease or in which cheating was virtually non-existant. Not one. Because there are none, never have been, never will be I fear.
I’ve said my peace here. I’m out of this thread. Let those who claim cheating is virtually non-existant or somehow invisible blather amongst themselves. They know the truth and they know that others do to, but they simply have to try to convince you. It is their compulsion.
Adios Panzerleros.
ildon
(ildon)
#108
Once entering the caves on fueldump as allies I turned to the right and saw a medic there crouching and killed him and he accused me of wall hacking even though he was in plain view. 
He was all like “OMG I WASN’T MAKING ANY NOISE”.
MADDOG
(MADDOG)
#111
Thanks a lot ssmith for complementing me on my skills! I haven’t really been looking on this link of the SD forums but there are a lot of things going on and I have seen a lot of cheaters out there! Yesterday I was playing on one of my favorite servers and while I was sniping I saw a flash come from one of the windows in the second half of the fuel dump map! At first I thought it was a player shooting through the window but as I was looking I noticed that there was no one there and then another flash and I bullet whizzed by me! I moved to higher ground and then I noticed that the guy was shooting through the wall and was killing my teammates! I just stayed on him with my sniper just to see what he would do next but I kept seeing that he was shooting through the wall! So I took his ass out! 
And kept doing so tell he left with his wall hacks, aimbot and a mysterious hack that shoots through walls must have been a test or something because he had no name was a blank!
Depth_Charge
(Depth_Charge)
#113
Not meaning to start shit but if you can shoot him don’t you think he can shoot you?
EvilBaga
(EvilBaga)
#115
I was playing on this server…and…well…lunch was ready…so I …stopped…low blood… sugar…levels…gah!!!
Must go!
Oral_B1
(Oral B)
#116
You must be really twisted to have multiple accounts and converse like they’re totally separate people…
Sauron_EFG
(Sauron|EFG)
#117
MADDOG:
Tracers do appear out of thin air sometimes (a bug), but they won’t hurt you. There’s no shooting-through-walls cheat.
I’m sure we could explain what happened if you had a demo.
Kendle
(Kendle)
#118
No wonder IRONMAN sees cheats everywhere. Not one of the things mentioned in that ridiculous post are cheats, they’re all prefectly normal server settings or animation abnomalies.
That’s got to be a Troll, because I don’t think it’s humanly possible to be that stupid, is it?
ouroboro
(ouroboro)
#119
LOL, to be fair, there are many dozens of ET hacks out there, so perhaps he’s just been on crappy servers. Rule of thumb is, only play PB servers, only play ETPro 3 servers, only play servers that enforce the more common cvars (if u drop the console and it says no cvar violation but it didn’t check any, /disconnect, because half the players there will have m_pitch at 0, LOL), etc. Also, get some sort of mod - soundmod, skinpack, whatever - for example those monster skins from that haunted house map, and leave the mod in your game directory all the time. If you ever see/hear the mod when you’re not on the map they were made for (meaning the server isn’t also using those sounds/skins), you will know the server is unpure, and should run like hell, because there will be players there who see you as wearing bright clown colors, LOL.
Not to start a fight with anyone, I’m totally at ease about cheaters so long as I follow the above rules, but the fact remains that us old CS players know exactly what’s possible and I for one always check out a new game thoroughly and only play servers with the most stringent settings.
Paranoia about cheaters is a bit too much, but ignorance isn’t always bliss, and being naive is equally pathetic. Educate yourself, take proper precautions, then relax and have fun. 
Kendle
(Kendle)
#120
No, IRONMAN probably hasn’t been on crappy servers, in fact I doubt he plays ET at all. Most of his drivel is a deliberate attempt to spread FUD.
For instance, he swaps teams during a game and notes they have different spawn times! Well d’uh!! And that’s a server admin cheat as far as he’s concerned!!!
He’s mentioned the “prone hack” before, but he knows full well it’s simply the animation out of synch with what actually happens, but no, he insists it’s a hack and we’re all using it.
He’s brought up so-called “cheats” time and time again and every single one has been proven wrong, but he just won’t listen. When someone refuses to listen the way he does I can only think:-
- “Troll” as in deliberately spreading his drivel to undermine the game (can’t understand that mentality personally but apparently low-life like that exist).
- “Stupid” as in despite posting eloquently and coherently he really does have the IQ of a gnat.
- “Egotistical” as in simply can’t accept being beaten in a computer game so has to “invent” cheats to account for his poor performance.
Take your pick cos I think he’s a combination of all 3.