Edge Lighting(Radioactive Goo)

(Linsolv) #61

[QUOTE=Seyu;280088]The converse is also true then. The sniper stuff has been nerfed anyway.

So, you and the normal gang has problems playing contemporary shooters then?

Then that will just put you at a disadvantage.

The obvious.

It is more than a flaw. Adding in-your-face visual cues to shift the focus on killing people when the primary goal is to accomplish objectives is akin to putting a Deathmatch mode when the game is designed around objective-based gameplay.[/QUOTE]

Ignoring the 1st point. Don’t even know what you’re talking about, I just don’t care. It’s nothing personal.

2nd point: Don’t be stupid. You’ve GOT to know that’s a false dichotomy. I find it easier to play MLB 11 The Show with my Sixaxis than it is with my Power A Pro Elite that I use for FPS games. Can I use the Power A? SURE. Obviously! Not like my Dualshock 2 that doesn’t even theoretically work, that presents PROBLEMS. The Power A just makes it a little less easy.

No comment.

I agree. Consoles are probably holding PC gaming back. However, in a sort of catch-22, PC gaming is a niche. So while PC gaming should be moving faster, very few people (by comparison—it would still number in the tens of thousands, at least) would be keeping pace with the fast movement. So I don’t really know how to feel about the Console-holds-PC-back line.

A counter-argument: I tried the Quake Wars: ET demo the other day. My PC at the moment isn’t really up to a standard where I could conceivably play games on it regularly, but I thought if I played against AI it wouldn’t be a big deal and my lag wouldn’t hurt anyone’s game. Got to the end, where you have to plant the bomb on the reactor thing. And over and over, I’d rush in, kill 3-4 bots, start to plant, and because I forgot to check around the corner or in the shadows or something like that, I get killed halfway through the plant. The “radioactive goo” means you don’t have to play some stupid guessing game as to whether or not there’s a guy camping the corner right by the bomb site.

(Nail) #62

tell a bot to deploy radar

(Linsolv) #63

I assume it’s an experience thing, and also probably had something to do with the fact that I was playing with bots such that they were rarely capable of pushing an objective, where a team could probably push faster than I could keep up, so I’d have backup.

Point being, there’s DOZENS of examples where you can’t complete a legitimate objective because of some camper in the shadows taking advantage of his ghillie suit or something. How can you fix it? Well, whenever the enemy’s in the dark, light them up. Easy as that.

(Seyu) #64

Ignoring the 1st point. Don’t even know what you’re talking about,

That it will be easier for snipers to shoot down players in the same way as it would be easier for other players to spot them.

2nd point:

You could just have said that it’s about preferring one thing over the other and not necessarily picking the good over the bad rather than make that convoluted analogy.

Anyway, if people preferred this sort of hand-holding they wouldn’t have raised such a hue and cry over the red arrows in Quake Wars.

However, in a sort of catch-22, PC gaming is a niche.

What makes you say that?

Got to the end, where you have to plant the bomb on the reactor thing. And over and over, I’d rush in, kill 3-4 bots, start to plant, and because I forgot to check around the corner or in the shadows or something like that, I get killed halfway through the plant.

That could be attributed to a lot of factors. This complaint would carry some weight if it came from a QW vet.

(tokamak) #65

Yes exactly, it places the emphasis entirely on the wrong part of the game. “Yo people, fire at these dangerously coloured targets, forget the objective”.

The “radioactive goo” means you don’t have to play some stupid guessing game as to whether or not there’s a guy camping the corner right by the bomb site.

That’s not guessing, it’s estimating. It requires situational awareness. There’s a lot requires to estimate whether there’s someone hiding in that objective. If you killed 7 out of 8 people on your way to the objective then the chance is lower than when you killed just 3 people. Radar (or interrogation) becomes more valuable. Even instinct plays a role here. You might not have consciously kept track of what’s going on but chances are your subconscious figured out a whole lot more and assessed the situation more accurately.

It were exactly these things that made ETQW fun to play. It was more than just fingering your mouse and keyboard.

Point being, there’s DOZENS of examples where you can’t complete a legitimate objective because of some camper in the shadows taking advantage of his ghillie suit or something. How can you fix it?

Anticipation.

(Humate) #66

A counter-argument: I tried the Quake Wars: ET demo the other day. My PC at the moment isn’t really up to a standard where I could conceivably play games on it regularly, but I thought if I played against AI it wouldn’t be a big deal and my lag wouldn’t hurt anyone’s game. Got to the end, where you have to plant the bomb on the reactor thing. And over and over, I’d rush in, kill 3-4 bots, start to plant, and because I forgot to check around the corner or in the shadows or something like that, I get killed halfway through the plant. The “radioactive goo” means you don’t have to play some stupid guessing game as to whether or not there’s a guy camping the corner right by the bomb site.

Good to see you checked it out. :slight_smile:
Yes there are places on certain maps, players will use as cover and camp. But much like SC2 where ‘safe’ players always scout the middle of the map first, you usually check these spots before planting… With experience it becomes second nature to check them. Its not a guessing game :slight_smile:

Also dont know whether it was a 12v12 or 6v6, but checking the kill log and being aware of how many kills you and your team got in one push, gives you a fair indication of how many players are left to defend.

(tokamak) #67

The scouting element is just totally gone indeed. It would be akin to playing an RTS without fog of war or at least one where you can clearly see the opponent’s buildings.

Also dont know whether it was a 12v12 or 6v6, but checking the kill log and being aware of how many kills you and your team got in one push, gives you a fair indication of how many players are left to defend.

Also a great tool for assessing the situation. Indeed.

EDIT: I just thought up another analogy. Sometimes people forget to turn their car lights on in the twilight. You need to be completely aware and looking out for these cars to spot them in time while the ones with their lights turned on require no effort at all, you see them whether you want to or not.

Now while driving a car you obviously want to spent as little effort possible in spotting cars, your life depends on it after all and there’s more to watch out for.

But in a shooter, especially a tactical shooter like this, that effort becomes desirable. It becomes a skill that you can train. Being aware of possible incoming enemies is a limited resource that you can chose to set your mind to. It’s something you can’t do all the time, sometimes you want to focus on something else, a objective, killing enemies, interacting with team-mates etc.

So constantly figuring out whether it is or isn’t appropriate to focus on something like this is what I see as an incredibly important part of the game. It’s a chore to have to do this in a car, but behind your pc it’s fascinating to experience. The game doing this for you and thus taking that part away turns it into a completely different game for me.

(Ragoo) #68

[QUOTE=tokamak;280146]The scouting element is just totally gone indeed. It would be akin to playing an RTS without fog of war or at least one where you can clearly see the opponent’s buildings.
[/QUOTE]

wtf are you talking about. It’s not like you see the enemies glowing trough buildings and such, that’s actually what the radar does which you don’t criticize lol

If I look at an enemy I want to see him clearly and don’t play a game of guessing.
In a level like Container City it seems hard enough to distinguish between the background and some of the clothing options. If there wasn’t any indicator or anything that would a) give an advantage to people who wear stuff that blends better with the environment on a certain map and b) probably (as always) give an advantage to people with lower graphic settings or even certain custom settings which isn’t necessary a goal the devs want to achieve.

I can totally understand SD for implementing this when they see problems with spotting enemies properly.
Only thing I didn’t like at first was how much glowing it was and how ugly it looked. But as I said judging from a recent video it’s not that horrible any more.

edit: In response to tokamak’s edit: I’m really happy you aren’t involved in the development of BRINK.

(tokamak) #69

That has a sufficiently costly prerequisite, if the orange goo has this (a passive/active ability or a buff) then I will keep my mouth shut. If this really is such a huge issue for people then they ought to pay for it.

If there wasn’t any indicator or anything that would a) give an advantage to people who wear stuff that blends better with the environment on a certain map

Depending on the map that would give Allies, Axis, Strogg and GDF an inherent advantage as well. It was never a problem in any of these games.

(Seyu) #70

That won’t be problematic because the maps in Brink feature a more diverse color palette than what one sees in other shooters.

In BC2, player skins have their camouflage change according to the terrain of the map and the majority is still able to identify the enemy without problems. If people can live with that then they should be fine with Brink’s multicolored levels.

(Hyperplutonium) #71

You guys have really blown this out of proportion. When I played this game (container city) I didn’t see the outlines so I don’t see what you guys are raging about.

(tokamak) #72

Ha yeah and how long was that ago?

(Herandar) #73

That’s because it was a rather late addition to the game. But yes, it is definitely blown out of proportion. Play it first and then decide if it is problematic.

(tokamak) #74

Everyone here has an an opinion on at least several aspects of the game without first-hand experience so don’t be a hypocrite.

(Senethro) #75

Except Brink isn’t those games and SD have identified this issue as a problem through playtesting.

(tokamak) #76

I acknowledged that it may be a solution for consoles. They already said they’re playtesting everything on controllers which suggests a console bias to me. I’m not buying that this is a problem for PC. That’s just nonsense.

(Seyu) #77

A problem for what?

(Herandar) #78

And thus the cycle begins again…

(DarkangelUK) #79

Lets use a little bit of lateral thinking here. If they added rim-lighting to help clearly identify friendlies and enemies, what do you think the problem would be?

(tokamak) #80

Lack of interest from the lobotomised demographic.