[quote=“blonk;149752”][quote=“Merciless;149747”]
Jumpsniping has been around for close to 3 years. [/quote]
The game has been in open beta for less than a year. Where the hell are you getting these figures from?[/quote]
The game has been in alpha with released footage since 2012, and closed alpha was a buy in for people since January of 2013. Games don’t start when public betas go live on Steam. DB has been around, with a playerbase (albeit smaller), for way longer than that.
[quote=“blonk;149752”][quote=“Merciless;149747”]
Jumpsniping has been around for close to 3 years. [/quote]
The game has been in open beta for less than a year. Where the hell are you getting these figures from?
[quote=“Merciless;149747”]
Unless your brain isn’t slower then the average human being that’s something you realize well before 3 years. [/quote]
Which is why we, the consumers, are assisting Splash Damage with feedback on their beta product, because they are all just too stupid to do it themselves. You’re a real delight, implying they are mentally handicapped because they took away your toys? If this is the elite top tier community that’s brewing for Overwatch that’s a fantastic reason never to go anywhere bloody near it.[/quote]
I’m not calling them mentally handicapped because they took away my toys. They’re dumbing this game down to just a plain casual game. The very thing they advertised not to be. This game is supposed to be a fast paced, skill based competitive shooter. Patch after patch they are dumbing it down further and they’re not listening to their community. They do not give a single damn.
[quote=“triteCherry;149770”][quote=“Jesus;149725”]
Yeah “difficult situation to counter” meanwhile fragger can throw in your face with perfect precision a 2second cooked grenade that you can mostly never dodge. and he doesnt even have to stay out of cover for a long time. This is totally in their perspective of balance huh ?
[/quote]
To be fair there are limitations on Fraggers grenades, it’s not like he can do it constantly.
[/quote]
Here’s where it’s unfair. Anybody else with a SMG, Rifle or shotgun can jump shoot me and damage me in the process. When I use a sniper rifle I shoot one bullet. It’s unforgiving. Placing RNG on a weapon that shoots one bullet at a time is bad. As I’m there, trying to shoot a person while strafing left and right… this person bunny hops towards me, shooting me at the same time and damaging me. I could use my secondary weapon of course but… they nerfed that too. Can’t really compete with a solid primary gun.
Just imagine shooting me with your SMG while in the air and your bullets are just blanks until both your feet are touching the ground. That’s basically snipers atm.
It’s to the point were that I just stop using the mercs they touch. bad DEVS
[quote=“Merciless;149787”]
Just imagine shooting me with your SMG while in the air and your bullets are just blanks until both your feet are touching the ground. That’s basically snipers atm.[/quote]
I’m not the best person to ask to imagine that situation as I only jump to position myself or to escape, very very rarely would I use jumping to gain some kind of offensive advantage.
However reading through this thread I understand your position and having RNG is not really effective when balancing, does not increase the skill level required and is frustrating to the user. I do agree with the reasoning behind why they did it but they implemented it very poorly and I expect that it will be reverted in the future depending on how many adjustments it takes to realize it. At which pointthey have to adjust the adjustments.
All Free To Play game developers hit and miss a lot with balancing, I came from a game where they did a lot of misses which ended up in bankruptcy but looking at it from their perspective, they need a balance that is fun to use and fun to play against and at some point someone is getting pissed off. Considering that this is a free to play game they do have to consider the victim of the rifle as much as the user, which unfortunately is affected by the casual crowd’s potential whales even though it’s marketed as a competitive shooter.
In your opinion, since the developers seem keen on limiting the effectiveness of jump sniping, what is the best alternative would be for all players should the change be reverted?
[quote=“Merciless;149782”][quote=“blonk;149752”][quote=“Merciless;149747”]
Jumpsniping has been around for close to 3 years. [/quote]
The game has been in open beta for less than a year. Where the hell are you getting these figures from?
[quote=“Merciless;149747”]
Unless your brain isn’t slower then the average human being that’s something you realize well before 3 years. [/quote]
Which is why we, the consumers, are assisting Splash Damage with feedback on their beta product, because they are all just too stupid to do it themselves. You’re a real delight, implying they are mentally handicapped because they took away your toys? If this is the elite top tier community that’s brewing for Overwatch that’s a fantastic reason never to go anywhere bloody near it.[/quote]
I’m not calling them mentally handicapped because they took away my toys. They’re dumbing this game down to just a plain casual game. The very thing they advertised not to be. This game is supposed to be a fast paced, skill based competitive shooter. Patch after patch they are dumbing it down further and they’re not listening to their community. They do not give a single damn.
Here’s closed alpha footage recorded in 2013.[/quote]
You’re speaking of skill-based. But is it skill-based for the guy who did get killed by a jumping Vassili across the map and could not use his skills in this SKILL-BASEDexplosionsSituation to avoid this?
“Skill based” here, “skill based” there, only if it favors only one side of the coin. Your side. Because you’re the Vassili.
Which begs the question, what are you doing so close to them in the first place? If they are close to your sniper nest then it’s your situational awareness that needs work, not the gun. Bolt-actions aren’t supposed to be good at close quarters, and to a lesser extent mid ranges.
Which begs the question, what are you doing so close to them in the first place? If they are close to your sniper nest then it’s your situational awareness that needs work, not the gun. Bolt-actions aren’t supposed to be good at close quarters, and to a lesser extent mid ranges.
[/quote]
Whether the devs realize it or not, all the maps are designed for CQC, and even if they aren’t, everyone runs so fucking fast that a sniper is never safe, and is almost always out shot in a 1v1. A long distance and a nice little spot for a sniper can be closed in on in .0000000000000000000000000000002 seconds. The struggle is fucking real, and you have to actually play Vassili more than once to figure it out.
Also worth noting, DB is notorious for shitty spread balancing. Iron sight and your smg 9 turns into a sniper rifle where you can nail heads 50+ meters away. lol
Nothing I said needed to be fixed. Some of them may have been intended to be CQC, but inevitably due to the engine and game mechanics, they all are. All of the maps are too small with the accurate range every gun has, and the speed of every merc. With how fast everyone is alone, maps should be way, way bigger, but that’s just my opinion.
Thanks for attempting to correct though.
Which begs the question, what are you doing so close to them in the first place? If they are close to your sniper nest then it’s your situational awareness that needs work, not the gun. Bolt-actions aren’t supposed to be good at close quarters, and to a lesser extent mid ranges.
[/quote]
70% of the time I’m in medium to short range combat. The maps make it that way. I saw on one of your different posts that you don’t like playing as a sniper in Dirty Bomb. I’d like to know as to why that is? Which is something else that’s quite interesting considering the fact that you speak as if you know something about sniping but you don’t actually like sniping in Dirty Bomb so I’m pushed to think that you talk out of your ass alot.
Then I would work on that. The maps don’t make it that way, you do.
I do not play a sniper in Dirty Bomb because I am not a quick-scope sniper. I am a low kill, extreme long range sniper. That works in Battlefield, not in Dirty Bomb. XFactor, Levelcap, Matimi0 are quick scope snipers.
Then I would work on that. The maps don’t make it that way, you do.
I do not play a sniper in Dirty Bomb because I am not a quick-scope sniper. I am a low kill, extreme long range sniper. That works in Battlefield, not in Dirty Bomb. XFactor, Levelcap, Matimi0 are quick scope snipers.
[/quote]
You don’t play sniper in Dirty Bomb because you just can’t and it’s okay to admit it. It’s hard. It’s fine. Not only that but you can’t really snipe long range in Dirty Bomb. I know you added “extreme long range” but… I mean it’s either long range or it isn’t.
You can’t find the long range sniping in Dirty Bomb. You pretty much just agreed that Dirty Bomb doesn’t have a lot of long range spots to help snipers. You’re telling me to work on finding the spots to snipe long range… why aren’t you doing it if you enjoy long range sniping? You can’t. It’s medium to short range most of the time. The only experience you have is in the low kill, “extreme” long range sniping department. If that’s the case then… why are you even here? It’s a quake arena based style of game… As of now… as of now. That might change with time with how they’re patching the game. Seems like they don’t really know what they want to be at the moment but ORIGINALLY this was advertised as such so if you’re not a quick-scope sniper or just a plain sniper in Dirty Bomb then what makes your arguments valid exactly besides just hating on snipers because you just… hate them?
It’s very infuriating to see that people still don’t understand that getting kills from jumpshotting is 100% from skill and is VERY VERY VERY HARD TO PULL OFF. Now let me repeat that again. Jumpshotting is 100% from SKILL and is VERY VERY VERY HARD TO PULL OFF. I don’t see how it’s OP.
It’s like saying Fletcher’s sticky bombs are too OP because he can jump throw them in midair and kill people if he lands them so we should put RNG on his detonator. Sometimes when you press E for the detonator, RNG kicks in and determines whether it will get jammed or not. Like no, it’s part of the character’s abilities. You don’t just f**k it up like that.
[quote=“Xavien;149889”]It’s very infuriating to see that people still don’t understand that getting kills from jumpshotting is 100% from skill and is VERY VERY VERY HARD TO PULL OFF. Now let me repeat that again. Jumpshotting is 100% from SKILL and is VERY VERY VERY HARD TO PULL OFF. I don’t see how it’s OP.
It’s like saying Fletcher’s sticky bombs are too OP because he can jump throw them in midair and kill people if he lands them so we should put RNG on his detonator. Sometimes when you press E for the detonator, RNG kicks in and determines whether it will get jammed or not. Like no, it’s part of the character’s abilities. You don’t just f**k it up like that.[/quote]
Check my post on this topic man… I said only good/decent players can pull it off but when they do it’s total BS… Especially for instance (Just this example is enough) on Trainyard on the generator door for the second objective. If CDA Vassili is there with decent skills he almost completely locks this entrance for the train bomb plant. I can’t drive him out with nader ricocheting off the back wall … can’t with frager either… can’t with fletcher… and can’t with arty… the only viable way I found is to throw an airstrike perpendicular to the closed door (if he doesn’t kill me in the process of placing it in that manner) and to hope he doesn’t see the direction it’s going to land cuz he will just back up for 5 secs and we are all over this situation again.
Sure is skill based but you can’t retaliate… It’s BS. His head shows only for 0.2 seconds how am I able to kill him with SMG or something like that? He makes every shot count. One guy blocking whole passage with kills, not ability. Whack-a-Mole with mole that kills you with one bullet… I don’t wanna take sides in this stupid topic but this was BS abuse of the capabilities.
I have no problems if he is at the middle of the map jumpshooting me… I can do something about it… I have problems when his freaking head pops for parts of the second behind some cover and he lands a headshot on me. C’mon… I can’t even see his rifle showing up from my POV… how is this fair for me?!
[quote=“Xavien;149889”]It’s very infuriating to see that people still don’t understand that getting kills from jumpshotting is 100% from skill and is VERY VERY VERY HARD TO PULL OFF. Now let me repeat that again. Jumpshotting is 100% from SKILL and is VERY VERY VERY HARD TO PULL OFF. I don’t see how it’s OP.
It’s like saying Fletcher’s sticky bombs are too OP because he can jump throw them in midair and kill people if he lands them so we should put RNG on his detonator. Sometimes when you press E for the detonator, RNG kicks in and determines whether it will get jammed or not. Like no, it’s part of the character’s abilities. You don’t just f**k it up like that.[/quote]
In my opinion it’s skillfull but you can’t expect from everyone to share the same opinion as yourself. I don’t have any problem with jumpshotting snipers personally. But everyone has his/her opinion and we should all respect that.
Honestly, the last couple of topics about the jumpshotting have been nothing more than a poisonous debate (imo). I don’t think any of the “camps” (either pro or con) is going to change their view. At least that’s the impression I have right now.
What is it with people on this forum putting words in my mouth. I don’t hate snipers.
I’ve consistently said that the physics models need to be equal for all weapons and modes. I have no problem with reverting the change, as long as it is done for all mercs and weapons.
[quote=“onLooSe;149890”][quote=“Xavien;149889”]It’s very infuriating to see that people still don’t understand that getting kills from jumpshotting is 100% from skill and is VERY VERY VERY HARD TO PULL OFF. Now let me repeat that again. Jumpshotting is 100% from SKILL and is VERY VERY VERY HARD TO PULL OFF. I don’t see how it’s OP.
It’s like saying Fletcher’s sticky bombs are too OP because he can jump throw them in midair and kill people if he lands them so we should put RNG on his detonator. Sometimes when you press E for the detonator, RNG kicks in and determines whether it will get jammed or not. Like no, it’s part of the character’s abilities. You don’t just f**k it up like that.[/quote]
Check my post on this topic man… I said only good/decent players can pull it off but when they do it’s total BS… Especially for instance (Just this example is enough) on Trainyard on the generator door for the second objective. If CDA Vassili is there with decent skills he almost completely locks this entrance for the train bomb plant. I can’t drive him out with nader ricocheting off the back wall … can’t with frager either… can’t with fletcher… and can’t with arty… the only viable way I found is to throw an airstrike perpendicular to the closed door (if he doesn’t kill me in the process of placing it in that manner) and to hope he doesn’t see the direction it’s going to land cuz he will just back up for 5 secs and we are all over this situation again.
Sure is skill based but you can’t retaliate… It’s BS. His head shows only for 0.2 seconds how am I able to kill him with SMG or something like that? He makes every shot count. One guy blocking whole passage with kills, not ability. Whack-a-Mole with mole that kills you with one bullet… I don’t wanna take sides in this stupid topic but this was BS abuse of the capabilities.
I have no problems if he is at the middle of the map jumpshooting me… I can do something about it… I have problems when his freaking head pops for parts of the second behind some cover and he lands a headshot on me. C’mon… I can’t even see his rifle showing up from my POV… how is this fair for me?![/quote]
That’s like saying it’s BS that Fragger, Fletcher, Kira, Arty, Thunder, Nader, Skyhammer, RedEye and Stoker can throw/activate their explosives at you without actually showing themselves. Vassili is meant to be powerful at long range and takes a much higher skill to master rather than other mercs that are powerful at close range and quite a handful of people could master in a much shorter amount of time.
His jumpshotting where he shows his head for 0.2 seconds is literally the amount of time the player has to react to, which means you could easily run off or in zigzags without being shot.
Then I would work on that. The maps don’t make it that way, you do.
I do not play a sniper in Dirty Bomb because I am not a quick-scope sniper. I am a low kill, extreme long range sniper. That works in Battlefield, not in Dirty Bomb. XFactor, Levelcap, Matimi0 are quick scope snipers.
[/quote]
Hahaha no, just no. In Battlefield, long range sniping is completely pointless - it only means your targets are harder to hit, and it means you can’t get close enough to capture objectives. Plus, if you think that LevelCap and Matimi0 are close range snipers then you’re HIGHLY mistaken. XFactor is pretty good at it, but LevelCap and Matimi0 are really sluggish and inconsistent.
THIS is aggressive sniping in BF4 - the best way to actually help your team. This is MugsTV - the BF4 player with the most sniper kills in the US:
It’s not about doing nothing BUT going up close and quickscoping/noscoping, it’s about being able to take out targets at ANY range - because if you can only snipe at 100m or more, then you can never take objectives by yourself and you can never help out your team with your gadgets (such as Spawn Beacons, Motion Sensors etc - which are useless if they’re miles away from the action).
Ok, rant over.
[quote=“onLooSe;149890”][quote=“Xavien;149889”]It’s very infuriating to see that people still don’t understand that getting kills from jumpshotting is 100% from skill and is VERY VERY VERY HARD TO PULL OFF. Now let me repeat that again. Jumpshotting is 100% from SKILL and is VERY VERY VERY HARD TO PULL OFF. I don’t see how it’s OP.
It’s like saying Fletcher’s sticky bombs are too OP because he can jump throw them in midair and kill people if he lands them so we should put RNG on his detonator. Sometimes when you press E for the detonator, RNG kicks in and determines whether it will get jammed or not. Like no, it’s part of the character’s abilities. You don’t just f**k it up like that.[/quote]
Check my post on this topic man… I said only good/decent players can pull it off but when they do it’s total BS… Especially for instance (Just this example is enough) on Trainyard on the generator door for the second objective. If CDA Vassili is there with decent skills he almost completely locks this entrance for the train bomb plant. I can’t drive him out with nader ricocheting off the back wall … can’t with frager either… can’t with fletcher… and can’t with arty… the only viable way I found is to throw an airstrike perpendicular to the closed door (if he doesn’t kill me in the process of placing it in that manner) and to hope he doesn’t see the direction it’s going to land cuz he will just back up for 5 secs and we are all over this situation again.
Sure is skill based but you can’t retaliate… It’s BS. His head shows only for 0.2 seconds how am I able to kill him with SMG or something like that? He makes every shot count. One guy blocking whole passage with kills, not ability. Whack-a-Mole with mole that kills you with one bullet… I don’t wanna take sides in this stupid topic but this was BS abuse of the capabilities.
I have no problems if he is at the middle of the map jumpshooting me… I can do something about it… I have problems when his freaking head pops for parts of the second behind some cover and he lands a headshot on me. C’mon… I can’t even see his rifle showing up from my POV… how is this fair for me?![/quote]
On the topic of the jumpsniping over the wall, you realise that you can do it RIGHT back to him? When I played Vassili I’d do exactly what you were talking about, and the worst thing that can happen while you’re trying to do it is when they start using Fletcher/Nader/Fragger and jumping up on the other side and blowing me up with nades over the wall. Frankly mate, if you can’t take out the Vassili on the other side of the wall, then you’re not very good, because I’ve been pushed back from that wall by Fletcher/Nader/Fragger players who are level 15 and under…
Plus, if you use a Stoker you can stop them from using that spot (by burning the spot and keeping him off of it - because he has to use the corners of the wall so he can double jump). OR you can use Kira and surprise him with a laser which you bring down on the wall behind the generator, which will allow you to block off his escape as the laser closes in (if he notices it in time). As well as that, basically any merc with a shotgun, REVIV-R, or another MOA can completely fuck him up as he jumps (because they can deal a massive amount of damage with just one shot - which is what you need when your opponent is a Vassili and they are popping in and out of cover). Then you’ve also get the option of using Redeye’s smoke to cover your team AND be able to shoot him down when he jumps up.
Oh, and if you don’t have ANY of those mercs, you can always take the left route, flank underground and up behind him and mow him down with a backrage…
It’s not that hard.