Community Question: Shooting While Sprinting

(jRAD) #61

This is exactly why PMs exist - take it there, you two.

(INF3RN0) #62

My only complaint would be that Toka doesn’t consistently acknowledge that most of the time the “bunny hopping frag head” can also beat him at chess ;).

(Fetter) #63

I’d say you should be able to shoot while sprinting, but only with a pistol or equivalent small one-handed weapon.

(tokamak) #64

On the contrary, a universally skilled player should be rewarded the most. What doesn’t suit bunny hopping frag heads though, is complaining about the chess side of the game while claiming they’re superior in it as well.

(Humate) #65

Inferno is saying universally skilled players are rewarded the most, but you see them as bunny hopping frag heads.

(tokamak) #66

Don’t put words in my mouth. Cognitive and cerebral skill sets are different skill sets and a player can perfectly have both. When I’m talking about a bunny hopping fraghead then I’m talking about a player that mostly relies on his cognitive skills to get him by in a game. A universally skilled player wouldn’t be complaining about chess-like restrictions encroaching on his cognitive skills, as that’s what these restrictions usually do.

(Humate) #67

Im not putting anything in your mouth :wink:
Universally skilled players only bitch about chess aspects when its not balanced with the “cognitive” side of the game. In other words, you dont actually know whether they are universally skilled or not. You see them bitching about the chess aspect, and make the assumption they arent.

Ive posted on this subject before:
Anyone who has great battlesense and **** aim is a bad player.
Anyone who has great aim and **** battlesense is a bad player.

(tokamak) #68

I see them being unreasonable about the restrictions and thus assume they’re not good enough at it to get them by. They rather not use the cerebral skillset and just be a happy fragger.

The ETQWPRO mod (with the settings usually employed) is a good example of taking out all tactical nuances out of the game. You could run and gun however you like and there’s no real reason to stand still, you could just keep ticking away at everyone’s heads regardless of what you’re doing.

That is obliterating a great deal of the cerebral side of the game in favour of the cognitive part. Such settings aren’t universally rewarding.

Brink actually managed to reduce both skill sets by keeping the guns inaccurate no matter what you were doing. That’s of course even worse.

(Dormamu) #69

Others
Shooting while sprinting - yay!
while sprinting with a light body - no spread penalty for handguns - medium spread penalty for light weapons - huge spread/movement penalty for medium weapons;
while sprinting with a medium body - no spread penalty for handguns/Light Weapons - medium spread/movement penalty for medium weapons;
while sprinting with a heavy body - small spread penalty for handguns/light weapons, no spread penalty for medium weapons, huge spread penalty for heavy weapons;

(tokamak) #70

Lights should have medium weapons period. And that includes light weapons that function like medium weapons…

Yeah and the inverse for stationary spread (heavies having good accuracy while standing/scoping)

(.Chris.) #71

The restrictions are there to make the game playable in Stopwatch and to avoid 30 minute rounds and 2 hours matches.

(tokamak) #72

You needed to tailor the accuracy for that?

(shirosae) #73

If you have lottery spread while moving, improved accuracy while crouching/static and ironsighted, and leaning turned on, the maximum reward / least effort playstyle is turtling behind cover onlooking a chokepoint waiting for anyone stupid enough to move to approach so you can pop out/vanish at a buttonpress and score your headshots.

See Brink for an extreme example of this. Movement is penalised with the lottery spread, evasion is nerfed with the ultraslow movement speed, so the most effective playstyle is turtling, so the defence has an inherrant bias, so you get massively boring double holds repeatedly.

The goal of the restrictions in these promods is usually to make the most effective way to play not be the most degenerate and boring way to play.

With the typical ETQWpro settings, you can’t turn your cover on/off with a buttonpush, and having the nerve to move (like when you’re assaulting) doesn’t put you at such an accuracy disadvantage. It also has the effect of making gunfights much, much faster, turning the randomness from spread down and the skill requirements up.

You crouch or ironsight for range, not to play the RNG game by camping a chokepoint.

(tokamak) #74

With typical ETQWpro settings the only sensible thing to do is keep on moving all the time. There’s nothing else you can do. That’s what I mean with dumb cognitive play.

You present it as if the game is composed of two teams waiting each other out. This is just completely false. I’m not sure if you’ve noticed yet but with an objective mode one team is SUPPOSED to camp, IE defend the objective. It’s the attackers that need to find solutions and push on the weak parts of the defense rather than brute-force it with rushing in and praying you got the headshots right.

(.Chris.) #75

They do, only time rushing in works is when teams are stacked in the attackers favour, even then you’ll end up on tripmines and such.

Altering the accuracy and such hasn’t removed bugger all from ET:QW, you still need tactics to win albeit different ones to a 12 v 12 public server. When ET:QW competition was at it’s height clans were practising constantly, devising new tactics to get the upper hand, no one just went into a match thinking best aim wins.

(Breo) #76

Interrupt the sprint while firing is super annoying :mad:
I’m fine with option 1, with a small spread penalty.

(Humate) #77

The new conditions create new tactical nuances that are specific to stopwatch but also overall gameplay.

For example the hyper cant be used as a CQC weapon the way its used in vanilla. The windup immediately gets you tripled against most decent teams… so you need to use it at mid to long range like an acc lacc or use it at mid range during a flank. In vanilla, the enemy’s spread keeps you alive… allowing you to be more aggressive and in close.
Same thing for infantry rulesets vs vehicle rulesets. If you play hyper, when you have a beast tanker - you can go to town on everyone, as they are too focused on taking out the tank. You play in infantry rulesets, suddenly you are the number 1 target, so you have to play more passive.

(INF3RN0) #78

@Toka

ETQWPRO mod? Or do you mean infantry configs? The euros like to play more infantry configs than vanilla, etc. ETQW is not a game you can ever stand still in… that’s just poor decision making and does not meld with the speed of the game. In ETQWPRO your usually up against players who have a good handle on aim overall, but the tactics are still there; your just struggling to compete in other departments. The reason why ETQWPRO experiences for mid-range skilled players feels biased is because they are used to playing in an environment where there is an overall lack of smarts, confusion in organization, and range in ability. You can put a bunch of ETQWPRO die hard players in a vanilla pub and it’s going to be about the same experience… There are tactics that might feel like they work in a pub full of randoms that will be completely worthless in a more experienced group. It’s rarely the game to blame, but more so the players your up against when it comes to ETQWPRO. The spread changes aren’t too harsh, but are necessary to compensate for lovely net coding. The fall-off damage might have been over-done in terms of the AR vs Scoped AR, but that’s about it. With what your saying, I can only assume you have never watched/participated in any league play using ETQWPRO… as you would witness some of the most honed tactics and strategy as well as universally skilled players in the game. It is also very common for weaker aim skilled teams with team experience to completely obliterate much more aim worthy opponents in organized ETQWPRO matches, so that is also a testament to the importance of tactics. To claim anything otherwise is a naive misconception of your own ability and understanding.

(tokamak) #79

I really don’t care what it’s called. I’m referring to the practice of tweaking the spreads, whichever mod does that.

(timestart) #80

(Genuine quote)