Air Strikes in Brink, yes or no Rahdo?

(mortis) #41

IMO, one thing that plagued both W:ET and ETQW was artillery and air strike spam on the objectives; forcing a more infantry based scenario increases the need for domination of the objectives by team play at point-blank range rather than a continuous rain of artillery. I’m eager to try Brink if nothing else because it will require more face-to-face gunfights.

(Senethro) #42

Hey, getting a bit sensitive kids, aren’t we? That was a single sentence.

Alright, lets go.

[QUOTE=Ryan;219528]
@Senethro:
says the guy who keeps repeating how BRINK is full of glory and is absolutly perfect in ANY way, in every thread. …fanb0i[/QUOTE]

This is the revealing line that shows how warped your perceptions are. Nowhere have I made this claim. You only feel that way because I disagree with you. I have concerns about Brink and have no delusions that it’ll be the perfect game.

What am I concerned about? Movement speed. I’m concerned it won’t be fast enough. Thats all. The huge list Jamieson posted are pathetic quibbles that noone should care about, actually improvements, or just him being flat out wrong. Many of them are features that have worked in other games, so to claim that they don’t work is just churlishly wrongheaded. (Edit: THought of another one. Changing body types during a match)

How about you keep your grievances to the threads for them instead of trolling by bringing them up each new thread? Alternatively you could be like Chris and express reasonable doubt that is (usually) thought out and explained.

(Jamieson) #43

Where have I not expressed my points with well thought out and backed up arguments? The simple point is that I have and you can’t argue back because my argument is solid. Your right that these features have worked in other games, My argument wasn’t that the features can’t work but might not in Brink. It gets even worse when you try to combine multiple features, ever heard the expression trying to do much in one go?

Look at the Rank system, it depends on numbers, There is only 1 successful game at the moment that uses the rank system Brink proposes to use and thats Quake live, which is a well established franchise and has huge amounts of players, thats why the system works because players don’t notice the division because there are enough players to play with in each rank band. Do you really expect Brink to have the same numbers as QL?

Poor keyboard layout, Not being able to select grenades or preselect for objectives, If developers designed the Brink version of the game for the Xbox 360 with the Mouse and keyboard in mind it would be horrible the same applies for the PC how is this not explained or well thought out? its simple.

The xp system is not fair, Its based on overall performance not the players current performance, it rewards time invested like an MMO and not skill like an FPS. Its not going to work, Its going to reward bad players who play frequently but be horrilbe for casual players who play say once a week, Let me explain, Every time you play you earn XP and rank up, But because you don’t play frequntly enough you are never the same level as the people you are playing so you will get owned all the time and this is going to be horrible.

VOIP off by defualt for the PC is a big mistake, its good for consoles because the community sucks but for the PC it is a disaster.

I mean seriously how many times do I have to spell it out to people or are you just an idiot, because thats the impression you give me…

(Senethro) #44

[QUOTE=Jamieson;219568]Where have I not expressed my points with well thought out and backed up arguments? The simple point is that I have and you can’t argue back because my argument is solid. Your right that these features have worked in other games, My argument wasn’t that the features can’t work but might not in Brink.

Look at the Rank system, it depends on numbers, There is only 1 successful game at the moment that uses the rank system Brink proposes to use and thats Quake live, which is a well established franchise and has huge amounts of players, thats why the system works because players don’t notice the division because there are enough players to play with in each rank band. Do you really expect Brink to have the same numbers as QL?

Poor keyboard layout, Not being able to select grenades or preselect for objectives, If developers designed the Brink version of the game for the Xbox 360 with the Mouse and keyboard in mind it would be horrible the same applies for the PC how is this not explained or well thought out? its simple.

The xp system is not fair, Its based on overall performance not the players current performance, it rewards time invested like an MMO and not skill like an FPS.

VOIP off for the PC is a big mistake, its good for consoles because the community sucks but for the PC it is a disaster. [/quote]

I should know better given that you guys just ignore anything anyone says and repeat yourselves in the next thread, but ok.

All keyboard layouts are poor layouts, including your own. You can’t make a keyboard layout to suit everyone or even 30% of everyone, so just make the buttons re-bindable and add some basic scripting.

You don’t need to pre-select grenades or tools because they’re always pre-selected. All the time. Constantly. Only a button away and they animate faster than in W:ET/ETQW. You don’t and have never had a point here.

VOIP off is far from a disaster. Just play on a VOIP enabled server. Anyone who cares about communicating will turn it on and the rest will just ignore you the same way they would even if they could hear you.

Rank system: I don’t even get what the problem here is? If the game has the numbers it’ll work, and if it doesn’t have the numbers then we’ll have bigger problems to be concerned about.

The XP system is… unpleasant but tolerable. All XP systems are broken and get abused by stats padders and rank babbies. Perma-XP has the least side effects because these people only grind once and then never again. As long as you can unlock everything in, say, uhhhh 15 hours good play? That a good number?

I mean seriously how many times do I have to spell it out to people or are you just an idiot, because thats the impression you give me…

Yes, it must be that I’m an idiot and not that you’re worried about silly things.

Also, you’ve yet again missed out two things that actually matter. Movement speed which is central to the whole game and the ability to choose your body size, which I perceive as being at least as important as class.

(Jamieson) #45

[QUOTE=Senethro;219570]I should know better given that you guys just ignore anything anyone says and repeat yourselves in the next thread, but ok.

All keyboard layouts are poor layouts, including your own. You can’t make a keyboard layout to suit everyone or even 30% of everyone, so just make the buttons re-bindable and add some basic scripting.

You don’t need to pre-select grenades or tools because they’re always pre-selected. All the time. Constantly. Only a button away and they animate faster than in W:ET/ETQW. You don’t and have never had a point here.

VOIP off is far from a disaster. Just play on a VOIP enabled server. Anyone who cares about communicating will turn it on and the rest will just ignore you the same way they would even if they could hear you.

Rank system: I don’t even get what the problem here is? If the game has the numbers it’ll work, and if it doesn’t have the numbers then we’ll have bigger problems to be concerned about.

The XP system is… unpleasant but tolerable. All XP systems are broken and get abused by stats padders and rank babbies. Perma-XP has the least side effects because these people only grind once and then never again. As long as you can unlock everything in, say, uhhhh 15 hours good play? That a good number?

Yes, it must be that I’m an idiot and not that you’re worried about silly things.

Also, you’ve yet again missed out two things that actually matter. Movement speed which is central to the whole game and the ability to choose your body size, which I perceive as being at least as important as class.[/QUOTE]

Well what ever Senethro, you asked for me to explain myself so I did and you obviously couldn’t care less so whats the point with trying to reason with you, and yes I didn’t bring up the speed and movement because I don’t think its a problem, you see Im not a close minded as you try to make me and others out to be, Atleast I try to compromise on issues you just completely disregard everything as not a problem, If its not a problem then why do so many people feel the same way?

Look at your reply it doesn’t make sense at all. XP whores who have permenant rewards are better than ones who do it once? what are you on about? So all someone has to do is XP whore for 15 hours then they have all the rewards in the game and they never have to earn them again like they normally would with an xp system based on campaigns. I think I know which is wosse.

Seriously go back and read my reply, ok good now go back and read it again and try and see the issues from a different perspective instead of your own stuborn one.

(Senethro) #46

XPwhores with perma unlocks only whore once so they’re unlikely to affect your game. XPwhores without perma unlocks whore in every game and annoy you constantly.

Seriously go back and read my reply, ok good now go back and read it again and try and see the issues from a different perspective instead of your own stuborn one.

Ah, irony.

(AnthonyDa) #47

Let’s hope you’re wrong here, because you can’t change your body type midgame, unlike classes.

(.Chris.) #48

Yes, he knows, he pointed this out as one of his concerns few posts ago :slight_smile:

(Jamieson) #49

[QUOTE=Senethro;219578]XPwhores with perma unlocks only whore once so they’re unlikely to affect your game. XPwhores without perma unlocks whore in every game and annoy you constantly.

Ah, irony.[/QUOTE]

So they can get away with it aslong as they don’t affect you right? Hows that fair, If they only have to do it once there is less chance to get caught. If there doing it all the time you can kick/ban them. You didn’t think this through did you.

Ah irony.

(Senethro) #50

I suspect that the cause may be similar to why theres no female models. Given the extensive customization possible, being able to change body size may TRIPLE the amount of working memory required as each body size will have its own model, animations, maybe even voice. Being limited to one means you don’t need to load the Heavy/Medium/Small versions of each player’s character every map.

If thats the case then I’ll just have to live with it and I won’t keep bringing it up in every thread because theres nothing I can do about it. If its a design choice then I’d hope that SD have tested how the game works both ways.

(Senethro) #51

[QUOTE=Jamieson;219587]So they can get away with it aslong as they don’t affect you right? Hows that fair, If they only have to do it once there is less chance to get caught. If there doing it all the time you can kick/ban them. You didn’t think this through did you.

Ah irony.[/QUOTE]

Oh look, you’re a petty minded little person who thinks ingame ranks and stats actually matter and that stats padders are doing something morally wrong instead of something that is slightly irritating and is detrimental to other peoples enjoyment.

You shouldn’t punish people for having no life and wanting to waste their time making little progress bars go up. They’re already being punished. What you should do is prevent them getting in anyone elses way.

I would also appreciate it if you could explain how your post was ironic because I’m feeling very stupid over here for not understanding.

(Jamieson) #52

It does matter when they have a real effect on gameplay, it didn’t matter in ETQW because the stats were pritty much pointless, if you wanted to cheat yourself and say you got all the achievements then fine it had no effect on anyone else, with this system it will so it isn’t pointless at all.

By your own logic we are all sad for looking at bars go up and down arn’t we? the only difference is that Xp whores use a different method, not so open minded now are you…

(brbrbr) #53

thats point to release title/product for same fanbase/customers, whose value previous product, rather that trying create cheap replica of another ones.

anyone who want airstrke - can send beans all around world to Brink players to ensure AirStrikes ingame.

(Senethro) #54

I’d prefer there were no bars at all but if bars is the only way a game can get published these days I’m willing to tolerate them as long as they don’t get in the way of my enjoyment of the actual game.

Cheating in ETQW stats did have an effect on other people because you’d get people playing counter-productively in games on purpose to grind up a stat. I’d hope that perma-unlocks would reduce this, so long as they are unlocked quickly. Or the game is designed that playing correctly is the best way to grind, to get grinders to play properly.

(Szakalot) #55

there is absolutely no way to avoid grinding, if people put their mind to it.

As long as a particular set of conditions/variables makes grinding more efficient than random play, it will be abused. The only solution is to let people progress proportionally with time, regardless of their performance, which is ridiculous anyways.

(H0RSE) #56

first off, the only way the xp system can really be unbalanced is if the unlockables make you a god. If the abilities are numerous, but not unbalanced, who cares? If the you a rank 50 and I’m rank 1, you have high level skills, but I can aim better and understand the fundamentals of the game better, I’m most lkley going to turn out the victor. Also, If you’re so concerned with being “outclassed,” use the rank matchmaking - it’s there for a reason.

Second, the game is played the same way on and offline. If people are so concerned with leveling up and grinding, chances are they will get friends together and play some bot matches.

I can see where you guys would be concerned about the above issues, but I also think you are blowing it way out of proportion. It’s like hearing a child cough, and immediatley thinking it has TB.

(signofzeta) #57

[quote=Jamieson;219542]I think its going abit to far to say that Wolfenstein was only about the single player I mean if they didn’t care about the MP then why did they include it into the final design of the game.Why did they bring in a seperate developer? If they didn’t care why not just release a single player story expansion for a cheaper price, the game costs £35 in the UK, for that price you expect a decent MP.

If people got the wrong impression then I think the mods and developers should take some of the blame to, They never exactly made it clear did they? It was all yes we are listening and the game is going to be great etc.

The difference with people wanting SD to make similar games and hating on IW is because SD make good games, Its simple really, If somebody cooks you a nice meal you don’t go NO next time make sure it is crap don’t do it the same, If somebody does something crap you don’t go well ok make it just as crap next time as well. Thats it really. There is nothing wrong with Brink doing new things i.e new concept new maps new design aslong as they keep the core themese and design features the same because why fix something that isn’t broken?

If Brink wasn’t a FPS I would not be interested because I mainly enjoy FPS games, if it was a TPS Id be really suprised and you can’t really expect SD to make an MMO/RTS now can you, The point is stick to what your good at i.e. FPS such as ET and ETQW which were awsome games, why deviate so much from formulas that worked.

ETQW didn’t have a massive player base not because it wasn’t a good game but because of the delays and the poor marketting, Because Activision ****ed them over, Hence why SD are now with Bethesda not Activision.

The only gameplay issue that put people off was the fact that the Strogg and GDF were different. All you had to do was make them the same again like ET and Brink was good to go, you don’t need all the ‘noobfriendly’ features. I know SD want to appeal to new people but if they keep it up they will lose all their existing fans which is bad for business.[/quote]

I didn’t think Wolf 2 MP was supposed to be objective based gameplay initially. It was only when they RTCW elitists found out that there wasn’t objective based gameplay in Wolf 2 that they started to cry, and Endrant came in the last minute and quickly tacked it on before release. And then Activision messed things up with their policies.

But in all seriousness. This thread reminds me of a time when my brother was playing MLB 10 the show.

This is how it goes.

him: NOOOOOOOOOOOOO DOUBLE OUT.
me: it’s double play you fag.
him: SO? SAME THING!
me: no it’s not. The process that just happened is called double play.
him: SO? DOUBLE PLAY IS GETTING TWO OUTS, THEREFORE DOUBLE OUT!!!
me: it’s not called a double out. It’s called a double play.

And then the argument goes on.

But I gotta tell ya man, MLB 2k10 is for casual gamers. Everything in that game is super easy in easy mode. But MLB 10 the show, that game is beast. It takes no prisoners. On easy mode, I got slaughtered 10 nothing. 10 the show is for hardcore baseball fans who like to manually control their baserunning, and it was always meant to be. But if SD wants to make the game for newbies, then let them.

(AnthonyDa) #58

[quote=signofzeta;219614]I didn’t think Wolf 2 MP was supposed to be objective based gameplay initially. It was only when they RTCW elitists found out that there wasn’t objective based gameplay in Wolf 2 that they started to cry, and Endrant came in the last minute and quickly tacked it on before release. And then Activision messed things up with their policies.
[/quote]
Gief source ? (legit one, thx)

(H0RSE) #59

[QUOTE=Jamieson;219568]The xp system is not fair, Its based on overall performance not the players current performance, it rewards time invested like an MMO and not skill like an FPS. Its not going to work, Its going to reward bad players who play frequently but be horrilbe for casual players who play say once a week, Let me explain, Every time you play you earn XP and rank up, But because you don’t play frequntly enough you are never the same level as the people you are playing so you will get owned all the time and this is going to be horrible.

VOIP off by defualt for the PC is a big mistake, its good for consoles because the community sucks but for the PC it is a disaster. [/QUOTE]

does this make you feel better…

[QUOTE=Rahdo;211538]
for pretty much every single one of you guys on this board, i suspect that simple “take me to the next mission” option will not be good enough, and you’ll all instead opt for the “take me to a server browser” choice. once there, you can find missions where voip is on by default (for everyone), FF is on, player ranks are restricted or open, high level abilities are allowed or disallowed, etc.[/QUOTE]

(Apples) #60

Obviously senethro and horse are noob trollz, let /care about their wall mind and talk to ourself.

/me stuck in an infinite loop.

Anyway I’m freaking tired to answer all your “ideas” , but here the point imo, you (i.e. my opponents, you’ll recognise yourself naap) keep saying that one button nade are sooooo cool and fresh, tell me one game where any serious gamer think it is? And please dont take BC2 or MW2 as exemple, selling billion of copies isnt what I call a good game, you keep trolling and avoiding answer (or you are really really naap about selectable tool, weapon_bank for nade etc etc, did you play any SD game ever?

Thats why we are here, cuz I hope our voices will be listened, the amount of freaking “I_am_blind_cuz_I_am_a_freaking_fanboi” tend to annoy me, myself, and I nowadays, oh wait, its not just me, but at least 50% of these forums and 90% of crossfire guyz, been said already, but bettter is freaking paradox over good…

So if now you keep telling us that instant grnade spam and no selectable tool are waste question, I for now declare you as a freaking noodle with no clue, even if you have some “wrapped” arguments, I consider them as void, we dont play in the same category I guess, go to sandbox nao! SMART is appealing you!