A word on individual skill

(BioSnark) #61

[quote=Crytiqal;355577]Last objective on refinery.
3 tanks spawncamp would be so “pro” and competative[/quote]
Never seen 3 tanks on refinery anywhere near as effective as 2 on ark. ETQW vehicle spawn design sadly neglects that they could easily enable the later heavy spawns and disable early ones as the map progresses. It’s good that most players are oblivious to the amount heavies/fliers available on maps like outskirts and arc.

(Apocalypse_Pony) #62

[QUOTE=Tandem;355617]I’d like to see those games.
Laughs@ XBox Team “DeSTROYYYeD!”[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I get the feeling that more than a game character was destroyed.

Leet Console Jockey, “I’m the best there is man, I’m the best th… what the… what’s happening! WWAAAAaaaaaahhhh!!”.

(NthLegion) #63

I know I’m going to regret asking this, but why are PC gamers so proud that they can aim better with a mouse than a console player can with a controller?

A mouse is a superior aiming tool.

It’s like being proud your a better shot because your shooting a modern rifle and the other person is shooting a musket.

(peteXnasty) #64

So is the top of the line in brink no longer engi with double weapon buff and a carb 9 rushing you down? Cause I remember that beating me 200% of the time no matter how well I aimed or reacted

(Acorn1021) #65

[QUOTE=NthLegion;355693]I know I’m going to regret asking this, but why are PC gamers so proud that they can aim better with a mouse than a console player can with a controller?

A mouse is a superior aiming tool.

It’s like being proud your a better shot because your shooting a modern rifle and the other person is shooting a musket.[/QUOTE]

DISCLAIMER: I was playing xbox for around 10 years now. I JUST switched to pc.

Because 12 year olds think that they are mlg when playing slow games like CoD and they have aim assist on.

But when you go and play on pc and play real skilled games (Quake live) you get destroyed.

Basically they think they that they are good, but when in fact it’s just the aim assist. We don’t have aim assist on pc.

(Zanchile) #66

u dont need aim assist because the mouse is better for aiming.

(Jess Alon) #67

[QUOTE=Acorn1021;355709]DISCLAIMER: I was playing xbox for around 10 years now. I JUST switched to pc.

Because 12 year olds think that they are mlg when playing slow games like CoD and they have aim assist on.

But when you go and play on pc and play real skilled games (Quake live) you get destroyed.

Basically they think they that they are good, but when in fact it’s just the aim assist. We don’t have aim assist on pc.[/QUOTE]

Guess what? I can click on stuff on my computer faster with a mouse then with one of those dumb rubber thumbsticks that some laptops have.

Honestly I wish I had a gaming rig so I could shut certain people up. Because dragging and clicking a mouse… especially if you have some superior special mouse is simply easier. That’s why you don’t need aim assist.

(Acorn1021) #68

Yes. But the fact that people gloat about their awesome trick h34dSH0tz on xbox live is just dumb. They are only allowed to if they have aim assist turned off.

(thesuzukimethod) #69

you do understand how aim assist works on console, right? (generally speaking, it works different game to game, but generally)

(Acorn1021) #70

Yes, it’s more noticeable at closer range. But I wonder if all those swipe shots I got were legit, or did I get some (even if it’s little) assitance from aa.

(thesuzukimethod) #71

my experience is it’s made out to do more than it actually does - basically allows you to ramp up the speed/sensitivity but helping to prevent overshoots when you stop moving the controller stick. On a mouse this is easy…you can move the crosshair pretty fast with the mouse, but as soon as you stop moving the mouse, crosshair stops (obviously)…with console/control-stick, either the sensitivity would be too high and you’d constantly overshoot, or too low, and it would seem sluggish.

I’m only posting about this b/c it seems like people think the AA is some sort of ultra magnet lock on that does the work for you, but actually, it’s a workaround (if you will) to better emulate the mouse mechanic (read advantage) that is already available to pc folks. of course twitch games benefit from this more than a game like brink, where the teamplay and objective focus diminish (not eliminate) the benefit of quick/twitch reflex (these skills still serve you well in Brink, but not to the same degree as something like QL (and frankly, why i play it and not QL). we could argue whether the hand/eye coordination to move the mouse, or the modified version that gets deployed with a controller is a more difficult “skill” to master, but i find the console/pc comparison to be overblown (and as tending to get filled with elitist/hyperbolic rhetoric as much as it’s a discussion of substantive issues)

I play brink with AA both on and off, and I find it to be pretty transparent

(jazevec) #72

[QUOTE=NthLegion;355693]I know I’m going to regret asking this, but why are PC gamers so proud that they can aim better with a mouse than a console player can with a controller?

A mouse is a superior aiming tool.

It’s like being proud your a better shot because your shooting a modern rifle and the other person is shooting a musket.[/QUOTE]

Bad analogy. In your example, musket is harder to use until you load it. At which point shooting a musked and a modern rifle is basically the same. Besides, both console controllers and mice are modern devices.

A better analogy would be one person counting using roman numerals, and the other one using hindu (arabic) ones. There’s some difficulty in using both, but you can get much far using arabic numerals. But to do that, you have to possess greater skill. Skill ceiling is higher.
Another analogy: one person riding on a tricycle and another on a plain bicycle. The bicycle is not much harder to ride initially, but you can do amazing stuff if you train a lot (off-road, cycling races, etc).

(I picked bicycle and tricycle not because one is childish and the other not, but because I couldn’t find any other analogy except the nerdy one with numerals)

(RabidAnubis) #73

[QUOTE=Smoochy;355113]but the thing is most games have a flaw somewhere. in bc2 its the ease of sniping. yes, we can go after snipers and mess about find the hill they are hiding on but its zero fun. fun is what gaming is about. being headshot by someone you cant even see because they have a 12x scope and look like a bush just isnt what i call fun.

i think this is why brink feels more fun than any FPS ive played since bf2142 (missed out on qw:et, just bought it on steam last night! :)). i rarely feel cheated or ripped off. sniping is easy in brink but not as effective as in some games and are much easier to counter with the small maps.

i think generally in brink the best equipped player with the most skill will win. i can take out a heavy with a pistol as a light, because i can outshoot and out manouvre him. burst shooting will often beat a pray and sprayer etc.[/QUOTE]

YOU PLAYED 2142!

THEY HAVE TO DO A REMAKE OF THAT!

I do agree with you. The singleshot weapons take a lot of skill, but most of automatics really depend on reaction time.

(Jess Alon) #74

I play with aim assist off because the cross hairs jitter and it’s actually HARDER to aim at the ones you want to aim at.

But aim assist is minimal compared to some other shooters.

(RabidAnubis) #75

[QUOTE=jazevec;355737]Bad analogy. In your example, musket is harder to use until you load it. At which point shooting a musked and a modern rifle is basically the same. Besides, both console controllers and mice are modern devices.

A better analogy would be one person counting using roman numerals, and the other one using hindu (arabic) ones. There’s some difficulty in using both, but you can get much far using arabic numerals. But to do that, you have to possess greater skill. Skill ceiling is higher.
Another analogy: one person riding on a tricycle and another on a plain bicycle. The bicycle is not much harder to ride initially, but you can do amazing stuff if you train a lot (off-road, cycling races, etc).

(I picked bicycle and tricycle not because one is childish and the other not, but because I couldn’t find any other analogy except the nerdy one with numerals)[/QUOTE]

I think the mouse is TOO accurate personally.

I do understand where you are coming from, but the issue with the mouse for me is that people become WAY more accurate than in real life. The controller has it’s falls, but I think it is better overall, with quicker access buttons. (Switching weapons, nades)

I do think they should have made Brink on either the consoles or Mac/Pc. Doing both was too much for them.

(Jess Alon) #76

[QUOTE=jazevec;355737]Bad analogy. In your example, musket is harder to use until you load it. At which point shooting a musked and a modern rifle is basically the same. Besides, both console controllers and mice are modern devices.

A better analogy would be one person counting using roman numerals, and the other one using hindu (arabic) ones. There’s some difficulty in using both, but you can get much far using arabic numerals. But to do that, you have to possess greater skill. Skill ceiling is higher.
Another analogy: one person riding on a tricycle and another on a plain bicycle. The bicycle is not much harder to ride initially, but you can do amazing stuff if you train a lot (off-road, cycling races, etc).

(I picked bicycle and tricycle not because one is childish and the other not, but because I couldn’t find any other analogy except the nerdy one with numerals)[/QUOTE]

HAHAHAHAHA! Lets see you get better marks then someone shooting an AR15 by using a flintlock.

If you’re saying it’s harder to use a mouse at first you’re a retard. My wife could beat me using a mouse in Brink if I was on a control pad. And she get’s confused as to what’s up and down on the controller. But with a mouse you drag the cross hair to where you want to shoot and you click.

The mouse being intuitive by nature means it’s easier to learn how to use.

Maybe the mechanics of learning all the buttons on the keyboard is slightly harder. But the fact that you are using a mouse and pointing and clicking kind of alleviates that difficulty.

Using a mouse is like shooting a rifle or handgun that has a dialed in laser sight. Fast reflexes and hand eye coordination will win the day for you. It’s intuitive and you point and shoot.

A controller is like trying to learn how to shoot clay pigeons with a shotgun. Until you have that battlesense about it and when and where to shoot then you’re going to get killed alot.

(RabidAnubis) #77

I do think that Brink should be based on team skill, HOWEVER, I think the individual skill level is fine.

First off, my chief complaint is choices… I will take my favorite map from the security point of view to explain this.

A lot of the maps in brink have 1 exit spawns, or the exits are WAY too close from each other. This encourages camping. For instance, how about in container city there is an objective off to the far left from the enterance, and the hackbox you normally plant by the door opens up a path that lights can take by swimming and mediums by carefully hopping from crate to crate! And then off to the far right on top of that building the staircase that is blocked leads up to leads to the upper levels of the place, but you have to disable AA, the bridge of the ship is open to the Resistance. Also, the Air calls in an additional bot that travels on TOP of the houses in order to get to the enemy, but several bridges have to be opened by lights, several ones spanning over larger gaps made by engineers and a ramp has to be opened in order to send the bot down that ramp that leads up to the hights of CC right now!

Brink needed a map editor XD

(NthLegion) #78

[QUOTE=Jess Alon;355741]I play with aim assist off because the cross hairs jitter and it’s actually HARDER to aim at the ones you want to aim at.

But aim assist is minimal compared to some other shooters.[/QUOTE]

I agree with this. Aim assist in brink makes your crosshair jump around when enemies get clustered. I turned it off day one.

(thesuzukimethod) #79

[QUOTE=Jess Alon;355744]HAHAHAHAHA! Lets see you get better marks then someone shooting an AR15 by using a flintlock.

If you’re saying it’s harder to use a mouse at first you’re a retard. My wife could beat me using a mouse in Brink if I was on a control pad. And she get’s confused as to what’s up and down on the controller. But with a mouse you drag the cross hair to where you want to shoot and you click.

The mouse being intuitive by nature means it’s easier to learn how to use.

Maybe the mechanics of learning all the buttons on the keyboard is slightly harder. But the fact that you are using a mouse and pointing and clicking kind of alleviates that difficulty.

Using a mouse is like shooting a rifle or handgun that has a dialed in laser sight. Fast reflexes and hand eye coordination will win the day for you. It’s intuitive and you point and shoot.

A controller is like trying to learn how to shoot clay pigeons with a shotgun. Until you have that battlesense about it and when and where to shoot then you’re going to get killed alot.[/QUOTE]

this. mos def this.

controller is like aiming a gun, mouse is like pointing where the bullet will hit.

(Acorn1021) #80

Yes, because we want reality in our games. Stop reaching out for excuses because you are running out of them, and soon you are going to have even stupider excuses.

The only legit one is that you can adjust how fast/slow you aim move with sticks.