Why lots of testers complain about bad aim?

(k1ruaa) #121

Well the last time I played ET about 2 weeks ago in a random pub I was between 41 - 46 acc in each map. The fact that hitboxes are larger and that spread is almost non existant makes it possible to get really high accuracy if you aim well. In Xt with the same kind of aim (+recoil management which is not that hard honestly) I think my accuracy is really far from 40/50%.
In Xt using hip fire you can hit every bullet only if you’re at close range. At mid/long range, even if you track perfectly, you won’t hit all your bullets due to spread. That’s kind of sad ;( What I really like in ET/ql is the fact that when my sights is on the ennemy, it hits no matter how fast you’re moving.

That being said, the spread affects everyone so it’s not a problem to kill people with good aim, it’s just less satisfying than in ET/ql

(Glottis-3D) #122

[QUOTE=INF3RN0;494065]I think you can get pretty good accuracy in xT, but I don’t think even the best aimers atm have gotten to the highest point of consistency that is possible. Kinda hard to do without an active competitive player base anyway.

@SD why don’t you just go ahead and add a percentage accuracy stat and even a headshot count? Either client side or global, it would do a lot of good imo.[/QUOTE]
this
and this.

(FireWorks) #123

[QUOTE=onYn;494044]I just remember, that back in etqw some good people would have arround 40% accuracy. Considering how laggy the game was, how bad the hitreg was and also that jumping and crouching was done in order to abuse that, I don´t really get it why it´s worse in xt. However, it´s annoying for me but not a reason to not play the game. After all it just adds some gambling into every fight and the chance of hit or miss is the same for everyone.
What really would make me enjoy the game much more tho, would be a higher TTK. Maybe you could even out the higher TTK by decreasing the spread, and by that matter satisfy both, the people who wants higher TTK and who want to have less spread in the game. By doing this, the actual fight time face to face would probably stay the same (faster because of less spread, also slower because higher TTK), but mindless backrapin wouldn´t be as easy any more, while the general gap of skill in aiming would increase. This would of course benefit all kinds of competitive aspects of the game, as well as make the pub play more enjoyable in general. I think someone is much more willing to keep playing when he sees that he is geting outskilled face to face (and also probably notice some improvement with time :)) then when he is being killed in the majority of the time from the back or the side before even realising he is being shot. This will happen of course too with higher TTK but it will give him time to react, run away hide or just turn and shoot back making the game more pleasent.[/QUOTE]

I tend to disagree on the motivational part. Being killed head on and not killing even when having the first strike advantage is a double frustration; more likely to make people leave than stay ("****ty guns!!!"etc > “death feels so rewarding! over and over…”

What you called mindless backrapin there is often perceived as a tactical skill. Be in the right place at the right time.
People on the forums were calling for flanking routes on the maps for different reasons (avoid meatgrinders, static playstyle, etc) but in the end, I personally want to be a bit rewarded when i take risky moves to get in the back of enemies.
That of course at a reasonable level, so no panzer insta multi gib fest, but having at least one sure kill when shooting some guys from the back would be appreciated.

I planned on bringing some anecdotes from +stroyup abuse and failed back raging in pugs but Ill end here.
In the end it comes down to rewarding players for more than just aiming skills. There are many other factors than pure aim (even in a gunfight) and those make a game rich and fun to play.

(onYn) #124

I totally agree. Also being shot from the back, must be punished, because you let someone get behind you. Anyways, I personally feel like the TTK isn´t at the lvl which balances the needs of proper gunfights with benefits from positional advantages properly. I think this could be balanced better, while reducing the general spread at the same time.
I haven´t spend much time playing this game, and also I am not a good amer in general. Still I am able to pull of multiple kills of 3 or more, when I manage to come from behind. I think this should be much harder, and a true highlight. Not something every average guy can do.

(Glottis-3D) #125

agree as well.
you can catch a soldier from the back and he still kills you, if you are bushwacker and sprayed 10+ useless bodyshots.

(trickykungfu) #126

soldiers in general are totally annoying… Combine them with a medic and you have the ubersoldier XD

For a competitive match i would always ban them. A limit of 1 is just not good enough…

(Violator) #127

[QUOTE=krokodealer;494707]agree as well.
you can catch a soldier from the back and he still kills you, if you are bushwacker and sprayed 10+ useless bodyshots.[/QUOTE]

This.

Rhino + medic = unstoppable killing machine. That and the fact that its not possible due to the old bug that a headshot to a soldier from the back gives a ding but only does bodyshot damage causing the above. Only headshots count in this game (unless you are Rhino who can mow down an enemy in 0.5s).

(Evil-Doer) #128

Interesting thread…Looks identical to about five others from a year ago or more…

(INF3RN0) #129

Soldiers are highly kill-able by other mercs lately, much more so than in the past. I think this was a lot in part to spread bloom reduction and larger hitboxes. Some may be much too easy/simple to play and thus limited at the same time in their maximum potential, but I hardly feel like they have near the same impact as in the past. At the moment I only consider Kira’s burst rifle to need serious balancing. Equalizing the player skill to power output ratio on some mercs however is a different story though.

(k1ruaa) #130

Let’s say just one more time that in fight movements left and right are really slow ;< for me it’s also a factor of unpleasant aiming.

(sunshinefats) #131

since I was suckered back into trying the game again recently I felt like commenting…bare in mind, these are just my opinions…
The control in this game, particularly regarding the weapons and aiming, has been “off” for me, consistently, since the first time I played this game. I simply cannot get a consistent aim regardless of any amount of tweaking. I blame the game for this because it doesn’t happen in ANY other fps game. Not like this. This feels broken. And since other people feel that way too, and it doesn’t happen in other games, it’s obviously not my imagination.
So what’s my point? The game is not fun because of this(regardless of what causes it). And no amount of tweaking to ANY other part of the game is going to compensate for this. I wish I could offer some better explanation, or some solution to fix it, but I’m not a coder nor overly technical, and I’m not equipped to try to break apart and analyze the intricacies of this game’s engine. I can only say that it doesn’t seem to work right for me, never has, and that isn’t fun. At all.
That being said, I have considered that maybe it just takes a lot of getting used to. I’ve played other games that it took a while to get comfortable with, and I’m willing to give the benefit of the doubt here on that. Problem is, there’s never anyone playing. Still. So there’s really no way to get comfortable with it, which means there is no way for me to know if that’s a factor or not. But I tend to think that isn’t the issue here.
Anyway, It makes me sad to come back to give the game another chance and see that this is still a big issue after all this time.
I would think that getting the gunplay right would be top priority in an fps game. I guess there’s still time to fix it, but at this point my expectations are so low that any improvement at all is a pleasant surprise lol.

(Mustang) #132

I’d be interested to know if you’re able to narrow down any specifics, for example is it sluggish response time or only when strafing etc., also is hardware setup a contributing factor, for example nVidia/AMD or SLI/Crossfire etc.

(P.S. Welcome back, if only for a short time :D)

(sunshinefats) #133

[QUOTE=Mustang;494833]I’d be interested to know if you’re able to narrow down any specifics, for example is it sluggish response time or only when strafing etc., also is hardware setup a contributing factor, for example nVidia/AMD or SLI/Crossfire etc.

(P.S. Welcome back, if only for a short time :D)[/QUOTE]

Well, I guess I would describe it more as a sensitivity issue…it’s either I can’t keep my crosshair on a player(or their head) because it’s too sensitive, or I can’t get it on the player before they kill me because it isn’t sensitive enough. There doesn’t seem to be any middle ground, it’s always one or the other. It feels like some kind of input lag I guess. Movement doesn’t seem to play any real role in it. Even if I’m standing still I get the weirdness. I’ve tried tweaking various settings and also even tried 3 different mice and a different monitor. I’m running a 760gtx nvidia card(single) and I generally keep my mouse on 600-800dpi depending upon the game. I’ve considered many options that could be on my end and nothing seems to make any difference, so that’s why I tend to think it’s just something with this game itself. The other thing that baffles me about it is that some people seem to have similar issues, while others say it works perfectly fine, so yeah, no idea what the deal is there.
Anyhoo, hopefully I can get a few more games in on the new update and maybe that will help me describe it a little better.

(Mustang) #134

It does help to clarify what you’re experiencing a little.

I presume you have already, but let me just ask if you’ve set “one frame thread lag” to off in the video menu.

Also do you get this in other UE3 games, again I presume not, but it doesn’t hurt to check.

Otherwise I wonder if the inherent input lag is just on the border between some people not noticing at all and others being completely eurghed out by it.

(sunshinefats) #135

Yes, I’ve tried pretty much all the settings mentioned in all the related threads at one point or another. I even did some lengthy reading on google about input lag and the like on the unreal engine in hopes I would find something useful(the only thing I found was that this has always been an issue for some people with the unreal engine-none of the tweaks i found helped at all). As far as other unreal engine games go, I would say that my experience has been that some have a similar issue and some don’t. But that being said, I have always been able to find a way to work it out on the games where I saw something similar, and I can’t ever remember it being bothersome to this extent. As far as perception goes, I will be the first to admit that I am a child of ID, and anything not their engine or based on it, feels weird to me at first. But that’s not the same thing I’m feeling here…I wish it were that easy really. But as always, I’m open to suggestions, so if you come up with something I haven’t yet tried I’ll be more than happy to give it a go. I still hold out hope that they will get things like this worked out at some point.

(INF3RN0) #136
  1. Have you tried using an FPS cfg?
  2. Do you experience the issue standing still and moving your mouse? strafing? shooting? or for all of these?
(Smooth) #137

This is something that will definitely have to evolve over time. Currently we’re doing the best we can with a limited number of public gameplay stats.

Down the line once we have:

[ol]
[li]More Players (more reliable sample sizes) [/li][li]Ranked 5v5 Matchmaking (win% per character)[/li][li]Skill Ratings (grouped player cohorts) [/li][/ol]
then it will be much easier to identify and tweak Merc effectiveness for high-end play and across the board.

(Glottis-3D) #138

[QUOTE=Smooth;494894]This is something that will definitely have to evolve over time. Currently we’re doing the best we can with a limited number of public gameplay stats.

Down the line once we have:

[ol]
[li]More Players (more reliable sample sizes) [/li][li]Ranked 5v5 Matchmaking (win% per character)[/li][li]Skill Ratings (grouped player cohorts) [/li][/ol]
then it will be much easier to identify and tweak Merc effectiveness for high-end play and across the board.[/QUOTE]

and how about:

  1. 1v1 small shooting map and servers (more precise shooting data, that is not influenced by objects, backrape, abilities. only shooting. a lot of shooting)
(Smooth) #139

[QUOTE=krokodealer;494896]and how about:

  1. 1v1 small shooting map and servers (more precise shooting data, that is not influenced by objects, backrape, abilities. only shooting. a lot of shooting)[/QUOTE]

Mercs are not intended to be balanced for 1vs1 combat, they’re meant to balanced for what they bring to at 5vs5 Stopwatch Match as a whole package.

Balancing individual elements in isolation won’t achieve that.

(INF3RN0) #140

[QUOTE=Smooth;494901]Mercs are not intended to be balanced for 1vs1 combat, they’re meant to balanced for what they bring to at 5vs5 Stopwatch Match as a whole package.

Balancing individual elements in isolation won’t achieve that.[/QUOTE]

This is very true, was gonna point that out. I’m assuming you’ll likely be cross-referencing player stats within a similar time frame and see if there’s any large discrepancies? I also hope that you identify inherently limited mercs/weapons as well, where you might find the skill becomes negligable to power output.