Why lots of testers complain about bad aim?

(spookify) #21

I am not asking for zero spread just what feels right and playable…

(warbie) #22


and let’s get rid of ironsights while we’re at it.

(INF3RN0) #23

I thought all of the stat dumps we’ve gotten from SD are proof enough that some people are consistently aiming better than others? At a certain point I get the feeling that the complaining won’t stop until some players see themselves in the top stats, which is kind of ridiculous. The gap could be larger sure, but the better aimers are already doing better so I don’t understand what you’d expect to change???

(shaftz0r) #24

the fact that he had that pic saved basically proves that point. also looking at the time played makes me cringe

(warbie) #25

It’s because when I’m shooting in XT I’m not enjoying it. If I load up ET, despite getting even more owned by the guys who’ve been playing it religiously for over a decade, it feels like I have a decent level of control over the weapon. Like it’s working for me. The better movement and more clearly defined maps plays some part in that, but mostly it’s the mechanics.

We have shed loads of games that require learning to control the spread and recoil of various weapons (or 50% skill, 50% spam, depending on how you look at it). BF has pretty much taken that concept and made an entire spam based game around it. That’s fine - but it’s far away from what I want in a fast paced arcady shooter. RTCW and ET owe their greatness as much to Quake gameplay as they do classes/objectives. XT is doing away with the Quake half which is why it feels like half a game.

(INF3RN0) #26

My honest opinion here is that I think the game should have a wider skill gap, but I also think that the majority of complaints I hear are the commonly reoccurring ones I see in every game. A player is good at another game they have played for years- being “pro status” at it at some point or whatever- and consider it the most skillful, complete, etc game ever. This game involves a lot of different variables to perform well, because well… it’s different? Sadly PC performance is probably near the top of the list. Realistically though it’s very normal for some people to have a hard time translating their skill sets into another game. It doesn’t mean the blame entirely falls on the game. When someone tries to claim that everyone doing well in xT are a bunch of bad aimers shooting at the body for example, it just comes across as a bunch of broken egos that simply hate the fact that they aren’t doing well. How can I let myself agree with that?

(Rex) #27

(INF3RN0) #28

I agree, but I was simply saying that increasing the skill gap won’t change who is doing well vs who isn’t.

(spookify) #29

Is there a gap? I do not see a very large gap. Chump should have a 3:1 to 4:1 KD every map if there was a gap. Sure you have your fun players that are going 3 - 13 but the majority of the other players have very similar stats statistically speaking. There are many reasons this could be OP soldiers and testing different classes but if you try to go all out and rage faces everyone will go what Soldiers and Arty? And when everyone does that some of the better players stick out but its not a glaring stat. The high spread rewards the worst players and hurts the more skilled players. This could be for a combination of thing such at the high skilled player trying to roll heads but the spread is missing the small headshot hitbox. While the noob is shooting your belt and the spread has more hits because it can hit the body high and low rather then missing shots hit. Now you could say well if this person is so skilled why not aim for the neck but you still run into the same problem and the chest isnt as wide as the neck so a few shots could be missed side to side due to spread.

I feel the solider might be just about right but Bush, Stocker, Phoenix, Saw all take more shots to kill some like Phoenix take 7ish HS.

It was stated earlier by that if an equally skilled Fragger vs and equally skilled Saw the Fragger would win. All of us agree for the most part on that. But what about an above after SAW and Mid Level Fragger? Saw comes around the corner popping headshot while the Fragger is belt level…

(warbie) #30

That’s not where I’m coming from, or suspect that many of the people on this forum are either. Take TF2 - wildly different from RTCW and ET, but it has considerably more of what I thought was great about those games than XT does. It’s not about making a carbon copy game that fits like a glove, rather giving us the fast, fluid action and teamplay that we’ve had in previous games and that’s missing in nearly everything current.

(Rex) #31

So basically no good players are in here and all just aim at the body. It’s not the games fault that they can’t hit as they do in other games, but only theirselves failing to translate their gaming skills into a new game?

(spookify) #32

Why wouldnt it? The top players would break off from the mid to high/mid players. You would have that wow factor in a fire fight that we are currently missing.

(Rex) #33

I agree. There is a big difference if you win an infight with 90HP or 10HP left. Whereas the top player would win with 90 and the med player with around 50. Both won the fight, but one did it even better. That’s the whole point.

(spookify) #34

Correct right now we dont have that control. (Because of Spread)

Again I use this example because I could feel it in game.

This is hard to explain but Before Phoenix was nerfed with more spread and recoil in a fire fight I could know or feel my bullets. I could know how many bullets it would take to kill someone and the time of the length of the fire fight and around when they should kill me. The biggest thing is I would know if I messed up my tracking or twitch reflect when in the fire fight and know if I didnt correct my next bullet I would lose the fight. What was also nice about knowing your gun was that you could anticipate your next opponent and know the split second or bullet that kills your currnt bad guy and move or lead the next enemy that is coming. Right now I have no idea when someone is going to die. It feels like blind luck.

(INF3RN0) #35

The point your missing is I am very simply saying… if 50% say the game won’t let them hit anything, and 10% have much higher accuracy, kpm, dpm, etc. Who am I supposed to believe? Increasing the skill gap won’t make that 50% better than the 10% already doing better. The only time bad aim applies is maybe in the case of the mercs that don’t involve much skill, like fragger/shotguns.

If we want a higher skill gap then that’s fine by me, but to when people say that the game makes bad aimers perform consistently better than better aimers is complete nonsense.

(BMXer) #36

Besides the obvious lack of populated servers, I gotta say, the spread and feel of gunfights in the current state do not make me want to play xT. The shooting feels so incredibly unrewarding atm. I’m sure there is more to it than just the stupid spread, but its what stands out as the most annoying thing to me.

(INF3RN0) #37

[QUOTE=spookify;488473]

This is hard to explain but Before Phoenix was nerfed with more spread and recoil in a fire fight I could know or feel my bullets.[/QUOTE]

I can never tell if your just letting the phoenix “nerf”, (which may have been more of a balance than a nerf) get the better of you. If I remember correctly about the same players were listed in the Sawbonez stats, however phoenix stats were generally higher. Perhaps they should have just buffed Sawbonez to match Phoneix, but one would expect the top player stats to be fairly identical on both? Did you save the Sawbonez stats dump? It would make it a more valid argument as a nerf if the stats differentiation between the two was very minor.

(montheponies) #38

I don’t think spread is anything like as bad as is being made out. I also feel that in a straight 1v1 I consistently lose against the better player. I have on occassion got more of a feeling of an entire clip just going missing in action, but have put that down to the vagaries of the netcode.

To be honest most of what I’m hearing sounds a lot like wannabe pros wanting to be able to take out 4 or 5 in a row and bitching because the game doesnt let them stroke their ego enough.

Maps are my number one complaint, not spread.

(Rex) #39

But bad aimers can close up to a point where better aim doesn’t stand out that much. See my example with the HP above.

You’re not the only one who thinks like this.

[QUOTE=montheponies;488477]
To be honest most of what I’m hearing sounds a lot like wannabe pros wanting to be able to take out 4 or 5 in a row and bitching because the game doesnt let them stroke their ego enough. [/QUOTE]

That’s exactly what this game lacks of. By the way, what you call ‘bitching’ is constructive feedback with is necessary to get the game on the right track. Or would you also call complaining about map issues as ‘bitching’? :rolleyes:

(shaftz0r) #40

[QUOTE=montheponies;488477]I don’t think spread is anything like as bad as is being made out. I also feel that in a straight 1v1 I consistently lose against the better player. I have on occassion got more of a feeling of an entire clip just going missing in action, but have put that down to the vagaries of the netcode.

Maps are my number one complaint, not spread.[/QUOTE]

^ this. also unveven fps, and audio sync/hitsounds are throwing people off a lot more than anything else.

maps.