When is Phantom going to be balanced?

(Despaniard) #1

I got Phantom two days after the release by using the double credit limited time thing. He was perfect just the way he was but I knew there was going to be some nerfing so I braced myself for some Katana damage reduction, or armor strength.

Imagine my face when his health was lowered, invisibility (which was fairly poor to begin with) made more like a blur, Katana damage reduced by a greater amount than I expected, the secondary fire on said Katana reduced to a next to useless mutual-agreement attack in which both the attacker and the victim have to stay still for it to work and then my dearly beloved “Chop” augment in my loadout card also being mangled.

So I thought, “Maybe they are joking. What laughs we’ll have when it all goes back to normal.”

…

1 month of brutal gang rape on whatever server I entered and played in as a Phantom. 1 month of telling myself that maybe they had forgotten that Dirty Bomb does not hold your hand. I see plenty of hand holding here. I played plenty of Pre-update Phantom and I was a balanced player. My K-D ratio was average (in fact kind of sucky) but now… I hide my face in shame as both my team and the enemy team comment on my 20 odd deaths vs my 5ish kills.

Now you may think that my strategy is to run up to them and hope for the best. Well, you’d be wrong. That is not how you play the support class. I know my strategies, and I know that until Phantom is fixed he is going to be underpowered.

(GrandMasterFalcor) #2

Lots of threads about discontent with phantom and potential balancing solutions. I’d recommend giving those a read

(Grave_Knight) #3

Not yet but soon.

(Amerika) #4

If you want easy one hit kills while being a bullet sponge tank where people could do nothing about it and want to play as “melee only” you are going to be waiting for a long time I’d wager.

He has really good guns. The Katana is coming to other mercs and doesn’t define him. So, yeah, try to remember that. He might get changed in some ways but he won’t be the rush down tank he was before. And yes, please go read all the other threads discussing this topic as there are some interesting conversations.

(CCP115) #5

I think it’s gotten to the point where it’s been established, by SD, that they don’t want Phantom to be stealthy. They want him to be Rhino’s buddy.

(DMaster2) #6

AHAHAHAH he was broken OP you mean. Sorry but you’ll never see that brainless-to-use Phantom again.

(Killerbee) #7

Half the official forum is phantom threads and how shit he is but they instead opt to give rhino and nader buffs as a way to spit in our face.

I guess they have some “data” that shows phantom is good or something. I’m 90% of the time the only phantom in every game I play daily, I don’t do badly - infact I do really well but that’s only because pretty much 9/10 of the players I play against are not too aware of their surroundings so I get a free ticket to go around and SMG their heads in. The moment I get into a fair fight I either lose really badly or barely come out alive. Every other merc has something going for them that helps them do their job : speed, high health, powerful primaries, special abilities.

What does phantom have? Shitty blurr shield that you can’t use in combat, anyone with a brain can see AND hear along with a reskinned cricket bat (that they are not apparently handing out to everyone).

The ONLY and I do mean ONLY saving grace phantom has right now is that his C94 loadout has both good perks and good weapons. Kek is a fantastic smg, S&W is a great handgun, katana is okay. If the kek got nerfed at all phantom would pretty much become unplayable.

I hope it does not come to this and I really hope they focus on his stealth aspect instead of turning him into a shitty melee character.

(Olipops) #8

I kinda want a refund on my phantom now :confused:

(Kaori1) #9

Lol.

I’m sorry but that made me laugh harder than OP saying he was “perfect” before the great over-nurf of 2015 (which I completely disagree with). His cloak is awful now and simply having a Kek does not make him A) Useful to the team, B ) Unique to any other merc with the same guns, or C) Fun to play.

(facileKennel) #10

@Amerika said:
If you want easy one hit kills while being a bullet sponge tank where people could do nothing about it and want to play as “melee only” you are going to be waiting for a long time I’d wager.

He has really good guns. The Katana is coming to other mercs and doesn’t define him. So, yeah, try to remember that. He might get changed in some ways but he won’t be the rush down tank he was before. And yes, please go read all the other threads discussing this topic as there are some interesting conversations.

Watch the trailer, he completely disappears than stabs someone in the back. Now tell me katana doesnt define him, its way too obvious he was intended to be a melee’er. And they wanted to chance that, that is completely fine. However his stealth needs a serious buff, its completely useless for stealth, they may just aswell rename him to something else because he is not stealth at all. Anyone above level 4 easly notice me even from a very long range, anyone below level 4 just stare at me trying to figure what i am.

(DMaster2) #11

[quote=“facileKennel;69786”]Watch the trailer, he completely disappears than stabs someone in the back. Now tell me katana doesnt define him, its way too obvious he was intended to be a melee’er. And they wanted to chance that, that is completely fine. However his stealth needs a serious buff, its completely useless for stealth, they may just aswell rename him to something else because he is not stealth at all. Anyone above level 4 easly notice me even from a very long range, anyone below level 4 just stare at me trying to figure what i am.
[/quote]
You are focusing on the wrong thing, it’s the cloack the defining trait, not the katana.

(facileKennel) #12

[quote=“cannyEdition;69796”][quote=“facileKennel;69786”]Watch the trailer, he completely disappears than stabs someone in the back. Now tell me katana doesnt define him, its way too obvious he was intended to be a melee’er. And they wanted to chance that, that is completely fine. However his stealth needs a serious buff, its completely useless for stealth, they may just aswell rename him to something else because he is not stealth at all. Anyone above level 4 easly notice me even from a very long range, anyone below level 4 just stare at me trying to figure what i am.
[/quote]
You are focusing on the wrong thing, it’s the cloack the defining trait, not the katana.[/quote]

Is that the reason katana was only avaible to phantom ? Or they specifically used katana on trailer? No. Its both cloak and katana defining him. Problem is, if katana comes to other mercs its going to get a nerf, which will make everything much worser than it already is. If that happens, melee attacks from stealth must deal double damage to make up for that.

(DMaster2) #13

[quote=“facileKennel;69813”]
Is that the reason katana was only avaible to phantom ? Or they specifically used katana on trailer? No. Its both cloak and katana defining him. Problem is, if katana comes to other mercs its going to get a nerf, which will make everything much worser than it already is. If that happens, melee attacks from stealth must deal double damage to make up for that.[/quote]
Devs always said the Katana could end up in other mercs. So i don’t understand your surprise. The Phantom’s skill is the cloack, not the katana.

(facileKennel) #14

[quote=“cannyEdition;69815”][quote=“facileKennel;69813”]
Is that the reason katana was only avaible to phantom ? Or they specifically used katana on trailer? No. Its both cloak and katana defining him. Problem is, if katana comes to other mercs its going to get a nerf, which will make everything much worser than it already is. If that happens, melee attacks from stealth must deal double damage to make up for that.[/quote]
Devs always said the Katana could end up in other mercs. So i don’t understand your surprise. The Phantom’s skill is the cloack, not the katana.[/quote]
Its ok as long as katana still 1 hits. IF katana does not 1 hit , phantom will need an specific buff for that.

Whats worser is, you are actually more detectable with cloak on thanks to massive “im here” sound. Whats the porpuse of having a device that can cloak you if its going to sound like that?

(DMaster2) #15

[quote=“facileKennel;69816”]Its ok as long as katana still 1 hits. IF katana does not 1 hit , phantom will need an specific buff for that.

Whats worser is, you are actually more detectable with cloak on thanks to massive “im here” sound. Whats the porpuse of having a device that can cloak you if its going to sound like that?

[/quote]
Because being undetected and playing the idiot ninja would end up pissing off the rest of the playerbase just like the pre-balance, and for very good reasons?

(facileKennel) #16

[quote=“cannyEdition;69818”][quote=“facileKennel;69816”]Its ok as long as katana still 1 hits. IF katana does not 1 hit , phantom will need an specific buff for that.

Whats worser is, you are actually more detectable with cloak on thanks to massive “im here” sound. Whats the porpuse of having a device that can cloak you if its going to sound like that?

[/quote]
Because being undetected and playing the idiot ninja would end up pissing off the rest of the playerbase just like the pre-balance, and for very good reasons?[/quote]

Because instead of playing like idiot ninja you have to use your brain and manage to get behind enemy ranks, than you have earned the kills. Your comment is funny, look at skyhammer, throw one granade get 5 kills. That is completely intelligent play right? Rhino, get minigun and move your mouse over screen or get proxy and place mines on random places. This game obviously is not about complicated mercs. Its about making intelligent usage of simple mercs.

You are missing the whole point of phantom. He only has 1 skill and its completely pointless.

There are many different ways to balance phantom, such as making him %90 visible for 2 seconds if your crosshair is upon him while he is stealthed, such as making it sound only when he is very close. But giving him a massive alarm and making him %90 visible all the time is not one of them.

He obviously is not meant to go right past enemy ranks, but it should be viable for him to go NEAR enemy ranks. If his cloak is not going to make him stealty than there is no point of having a merc like that all. And there are many ways of increasing his skillcap, making him %90 visible to a person if his crosshair is close to cloaked phantom, making it only sound when he is close , decreasing his hp but giving him a good speed increase to force him to use envioroment as advantage instead of relying on cloak’s armor.

(DMaster2) #17

[quote=“facileKennel;69828”][quote=“cannyEdition;69818”]
Because being undetected and playing the idiot ninja would end up pissing off the rest of the playerbase just like the pre-balance, and for very good reasons?[/quote]

Because instead of playing like idiot ninja you have to use your brain and manage to get behind enemy ranks, than you have earned the kills. Your comment is funny, look at skyhammer, throw one granade get 5 kills. That is completely intelligent play right? Rhino, get minigun and move your mouse over screen or get proxy and place mines on random places. This game obviously is not about complicated mercs. Its about making intelligent usage of simple mercs.

You are missing the whole point of phantom. He only has 1 skill and its completely pointless.

There are many different ways to balance phantom, such as making him %90 visible for 2 seconds if your crosshair is upon him while he is stealthed, such as making it sound only when he is very close. But giving him a massive alarm and making him %90 visible all the time is not one of them.

He obviously is not meant to go right past enemy ranks, but it should be viable for him to go NEAR enemy ranks. If his cloak is not going to make him stealty than there is no point of having a merc like that all. And there are many ways of increasing his skillcap, making him %90 visible to a person if his crosshair is close to cloaked phantom, making it only sound when he is close , decreasing his hp but giving him a good speed increase to force him to use envioroment as advantage instead of relying on cloak’s armor.
[/quote]
Exactly how is it an issue to get behind enemy when you are barely visible and audible? That doesn’t take skill dude, even a brainless monkey could do it. Now it does take skill to actually slip unnoticed behind enemy ranks.
I’m not missing the point of Phantom. His job is to flank the enemy and weaken it, and he got good guns to do so. But people thought they could go Assassin’s Creed with him, and that is not acceptable. People riot to have Phantom nerfed and the devs had to emergency nerf him.
You will never see him as he was (blatantly op and broken), just accept it. Devs might boost his cloak a bit but that is it. The whole melee nerf was his friggin fault if you didn’t know that.

(facileKennel) #18

[quote=“cannyEdition;69879”][quote=“facileKennel;69828”][quote=“cannyEdition;69818”]
Because being undetected and playing the idiot ninja would end up pissing off the rest of the playerbase just like the pre-balance, and for very good reasons?[/quote]

Because instead of playing like idiot ninja you have to use your brain and manage to get behind enemy ranks, than you have earned the kills. Your comment is funny, look at skyhammer, throw one granade get 5 kills. That is completely intelligent play right? Rhino, get minigun and move your mouse over screen or get proxy and place mines on random places. This game obviously is not about complicated mercs. Its about making intelligent usage of simple mercs.

You are missing the whole point of phantom. He only has 1 skill and its completely pointless.

There are many different ways to balance phantom, such as making him %90 visible for 2 seconds if your crosshair is upon him while he is stealthed, such as making it sound only when he is very close. But giving him a massive alarm and making him %90 visible all the time is not one of them.

He obviously is not meant to go right past enemy ranks, but it should be viable for him to go NEAR enemy ranks. If his cloak is not going to make him stealty than there is no point of having a merc like that all. And there are many ways of increasing his skillcap, making him %90 visible to a person if his crosshair is close to cloaked phantom, making it only sound when he is close , decreasing his hp but giving him a good speed increase to force him to use envioroment as advantage instead of relying on cloak’s armor.
[/quote]
Exactly how is it an issue to get behind enemy when you are barely visible and audible? That doesn’t take skill dude, even a brainless monkey could do it. Now it does take skill to actually slip unnoticed behind enemy ranks.
I’m not missing the point of Phantom. His job is to flank the enemy and weaken it, and he got good guns to do so. But people thought they could go Assassin’s Creed with him, and that is not acceptable. People riot to have Phantom nerfed and the devs had to emergency nerf him.
You will never see him as he was (blatantly op and broken), just accept it. Devs might boost his cloak a bit but that is it. The whole melee nerf was his friggin fault if you didn’t know that.[/quote]

I wasnt there when he was op. And i know that he was broken, that doesnt mean they have to nerf him to underground.

Exactly how is it an issue to get behind enemy when you are barely visible and audible?
Its because anyone without sight problems can easily detect him and his sound awares enemies to take care. I can deal with audio , but it needs speed and visibility buff. Currently, the only use of cloak is the armor it gives, it helps me with getting close to enemies without dying. Im still playing sneaky and manage to get behind enemy ranks, but that is not because of the cloak, that is because of the road i follow, which does not work in some maps.

When it comes to his guns, im using HEK currently and i dont like this one at all, i liked his original gun better, the one with beautiful aimsight, perhaps its because aimsight itself. I also made some calculations, HEK falls behind the other SMG in every situation. Bullets to kill - RPM

(reciprocal) #19

@facileKennel said:

Haha, I watched the Scrubs trailer again and you know what?

  1. Phantom is NEVER completely invisible. When he stabs Vassili, the camera PANS towards him and he had a blue outline to him. Otherwise, throughout the entire trailer he is completely visible;
  2. In the trailer, he uses the katana ONCE. All other times, he uses his pistol; and
  3. The only unrealistic thing is he never uses an SMG

I’m willing to debate on the degree of visibility Phantom should have but he cannot have his pre-nerf melee abilities back. Also, he needs to have his buzz at the current sound level so there’s fair warning. It’s about as loud as mines and Rhino spinning up so I think that’s fair.

(facileKennel) #20

Also %20 damage buff perk is not working with right click, which is a huge problem