What do you think about the new crafting/dusting system?

(Merci1ess) #41

[quote=“Dox;194038”][quote=“Xyfurion;194021”]3/84 people (who voted) genuinely like this system. Does that tell you something, Splash Damage?

I have recycled all my leads and bronzes, and some other cards I deem useless. Not going to use those fragments unless they fix it. They are literally SO MANY WAYS to fix it, which have already been suggested. We still haven’t heard word that they have been taking our suggestions or anything of that sort.[/quote]

Well it’s the weekend for them, so I assume tomorrow we might hear something if we hear anything at all.[/quote]

Lookin’ into my crystal ball right now and I see Splash Damage’s responses to questions right here. Just give me a second here… Hmmmmm… something along the lines of “Soon”, “I’ll write that down” and “Working as intended”. Perhaps a “Dead sea amounts of salt” in there somewhere… That’s all I see besides some laughing and other absolutely irrelevant shit.

(The_N00Ba) #42

For me some of the prices are skewed a little high. System wise it is not that bad but I don’t think it meets the desire of people who enjoy more set structure and goals. Free spirits though have got to be having a blast. plus it feels more complicated than it needs to be. I can run with it though for now. i do think Splash Damage needs to address some of the issues with those of you who are “not happy” to say the least. I am confident Raz tried to provide them with the best information possible on people’s “unhappiness”. I suggest though you got to give them a little time. They are sailing into a major shit storm. :smiley: we have all been then I think.

(Runeforce) #43

Would be nice if the choices were not so fringie. While I neither DESPISE, nor LOVE the new system, I do think it’s a lot more convenient and thus a bit better. It’s also nice that it is tilted a bit in favor of veterans like me, although a lot of you, for some reason, seem to think otherwise.

(blonk) #44

I like some things, dislike others. The problem I always had before was I didn’t have enough trading stock to trade up to the next level and wasn’t willing to go buy a bajillion cases to get there, so was letting it creep up naturally. This new system removes that, which is nice because I can just throw credits in and get cards out.

From a business standpoint it also makes sense that it runs this way - credits are the sink of this game, and this makes the route to drain them more obvious and accessible. The initial outset of gold/cobalt cards is scary though. I don’t really see myself trading up to those much.

(Vectarrio) #45

I think they should make recycling give credits in addition to fragments for more valuable cards.
It would make silver and gold cards less useless, cuz you would get some of your credits back for recycling a gold card you crafted (or got via a case), for example.

(LifeupOmega) #46

This is incredibly stupid. You clearly can’t tell the difference between concurrent players and average-over-time.

Look at audience over 2 weeks for a better idea of our playerbase. Concurrent just gives you every day players.

(SaulWolfden) #47

The main problem I have is the credit pricing, mostly on Gold and Cobalt, it just seems far too high. Gold is almost the price of a 30k merc, and cobalt is the price of a 50k merc. Should at least be more difference in the pricing there imo.

(yenku) #48

Not good not good.

Since the new update, I just did realize that going for a skin other than bronze, is not a “pleasure” anymore.
As lot of you already said, with Trade ups, at least we had a chance to get some good silver/gold card in our road to cobalts. Now honestly we are f…ed.

I did welcome this new update with great hope and I’ve been disappointed.
I can’t comment about the work on execution maps, I don’t play execution.

I don’t think we are asking too much as players, as members of this community.
I’m not a new player nor I’m one of those founders, but I did build my inventory and I spent not so little money on this game.

Sorry to say this but I really feel like developers/nexon/all really do not care about community voice.
I perfectly know this game is free to play and devs need to make money to work, ok, give us a fucking good reason to spend money on this game.

The new system COULD be good. You just had keep that Trade up / Trade in aside.
Since the update I’m crafting just bronze, I’m looking for some particular bronze card and I would have liked to being able to trade up my useless bronze to silver instead of recycle them.

If I was looking for silver (which I like too) I would have some silver to trade up for Gold. Just the old system, but with the new system too we can have 2 options to make our way to our desired Loadout card.

Give us user OPTIONS

If I had a way to BUY, with money, for a reasonable price, a Cobalt Fragment Loadout card, the one I want, not a RNG one, you would have my money.
I’m really not able to see what’s could be wrong with that.
Is it just because Cobal Loadouts will have a value ? We don’t even have a trade markets and don’t even know when and IF we’ll have one.

Dirty Bomb is my MAIN and ONLY fps, I would be more than happy to buy something I want on a game I spend most of my gaming time.

There is not way in this world I would grind hours and hours and pray RNGesus for a miracle.
I could do this just once, and by mistake, but not twice.
This way you are not keeping people play this game, you’re just looking for new players that will then leave when they’ll understand how things work.

My opinion of course, I may have expressed myself badly since English in not my main lang.
Looking ahead to hear from you all. If you think I’m wrong about something, please let me know. Thanks you all.

(Eox) #49

So I should either love it with passion, hate it from the bottom of my heart or totally don’t care about it ? No in between ? :confused:

Honestly, that system would have been fine with just a tweak on craftintg cost values (and maybe gold card recycle too). Reduce the credit cost and much more people would be happy.

(Hunterwclf) #50

So I did some math.

Keep in mind those values are based of Lead Cards and might be incorrect when applied to higher tier loadouts.

Trading up VS Crafting system

Trading up :

3 Lead Cards + 500 Credits = 1 random Iron Card for a Merc of your choice
3 Iron Cards + 1000 Credits = 1 random Bronze Card for a Merc of your choice
4 Bronze Cards + 2000 Credits = 1 random Silver Card for a Merc of your choice
4 Silver Cards + 4000 Credits = 1 random Gold Card for a Merc of your choice
6 Gold Cards + 10000 Credits = 1 random Cobalt Card for a Merc of your choice

From Lead to Cobalt :
Iron card = (Lead)3 + 500c
Bronze card = (3 Lead +500c) * 3 + 1 000c = 9 Lead + 2 500c
Silver card = (9 Lead + 2 500c) * 4 + 2 000c = 36 Lead + 12 000c
Gold card = (36 Lead + 12 000c) 4 + 4 000c = 144 Lead + 52 000c
Cobalt card = (144 Lead + 52 000c) * 6 + 10 000 = 864 Lead + 322 000c


Crafting :
45 fragments + 500 Credits = 1 random Iron Card for a Merc of your choice
165 fragments + 1 500 Credits = 1 random Bronze Card for a Merc of your choice
700 fragments + 5 000 Credits = 1 random Silver Card for a Merc of your choice
2 500 fragments + 25 000 Credits = 1 random Gold Card for a Merc of your choice
20 000 fragments + 50 000 Credits = 1 random Cobalt Card for a Merc of your choice

Recycling :
Lead = 15 Fragments
Iron = 45 Fragments
Bronze = 135 Fragments
Silver = 540 Fragments
Gold = 2 150 Fragments
Cobalt = 13 000 Fragments.

864 Lead = 12 960 Fragments
1 334 Lead = 2010 Fragments

Trade up Lead to Cobalt Cost : 864 Lead + 322 000c
Recycling Lead to Cobalt Cost : 1 334 Lead + 50 000c

Based of these values, the new system costs far less money but will need more loadout cards. Sounds fair to me !

(Exavidos) #51

One of the things I dislike about the new system is the fact that it takes away the small satisfaction when you did a tradeup and you got an loadout you wanted. And a lot of game make use of this feeling. Lets say I have a lot of bronze cards so I traded them up to 10 silver cards. 2 of them I liked, the other 8 are meh, so I am still happy that I got 2 good loadout cards and I use the other 8 as tradeup material for gold cards.

Now I could still trying to get an silver for 700 fragments, but if I do not like em I can only scrap it for 540 fragments, so it’s like I just lost 160 fragments.

(Xyfurion) #52

@Hunterwolf

You don’t understand. This crafting system removed any sense of progression in this game. So instead of going from Lead to Iron, Iron to Bronze…(you get the point)… and getting some cards you would actually like and use along the way, you (in essence) only get one card in the end. By crafting, you would recycle your cards, then craft a single cobalt card. By Trading Up, you would trade up to the next rarity multiple times and you will most like get a card you would like to use along the way (and discover cards/guns you didn’t know you liked - that happened to me with the Stark AR). This system removed the fun out of making new cards.

Furthermore, this completely devalues Bronze, Silver, and Gold cards. How? Because people don’t need to craft these cards. They can just trade up to a cobalt while saving money and loadout cards. If they do craft anything other than a cobalt, they will need even more cards and credits to craft a cobalt.

(Xyfurion) #53

[quote=“Eox;194130”]So I should either love it with passion, hate it from the bottom of my heart or totally don’t care about it ? No in between ? :confused:

Honestly, that system would have been fine with just a tweak on craftintg cost values (and maybe gold card recycle too). Reduce the credit cost and much more people would be happy.[/quote]

lol yea I messed up a bit. I guess “I don’t care” was meant to be middle ground.

(Ptiloui) #54

This is incredibly stupid. You clearly can’t tell the difference between concurrent players and average-over-time.

Look at audience over 2 weeks for a better idea of our playerbase. Concurrent just gives you every day players.[/quote]

So, if i understand, in the last 2 weeks, over 170k players played Dirty Bomb, while only 3k~4k players were playing everyday at the same time. Am i right ?

If i understand it all, i was totally wrong and the player base is bigger than i thought.
BUT, compared to the 5.000.000 players that tried it, it is clearly ridiculous.

(LifeupOmega) #55

F2P games never retain their entire playerbase over the course of the game’s life, also some of that population, not much mind you, but some, also includes smurf accounts for players who want to for whatever reason.

Keeping in mind that this game is doing pretty well for a niche f2p title, I wouldn’t say it’s actually too bad.

(Hunterwclf) #56

[quote=“Xyfurion;194188”]@Hunterwolf

You don’t understand. This crafting system removed any sense of progression in this game. So instead of going from Lead to Iron, Iron to Bronze…(you get the point)… and getting some cards you would actually like and use along the way, you (in essence) only get one card in the end. By crafting, you would recycle your cards, then craft a single cobalt card. By Trading Up, you would trade up to the next rarity multiple times and you will most like get a card you would like to use along the way (and discover cards/guns you didn’t know you liked - that happened to me with the Stark AR). This system removed the fun out of making new cards.

Furthermore, this completely devalues Bronze, Silver, and Gold cards. How? Because people don’t need to craft these cards. They can just trade up to a cobalt while saving money and loadout cards. If they do craft anything other than a cobalt, they will need even more cards and credits to craft a cobalt. [/quote]

I do understand, and I agree. It removed an opportunity for players to get out of their comfort zone and try new stuff.

But I believe an easier way to get rid of cards, make it easier to manage with a new currency and a less RNG based crafting with the addition of weapon packs is the way to go.

Cases still drop, and people can still try new gear. But even if it’s not there yet, the addition of trading will make people go for the card they want, because it’ll be what they get.

(straightforwardMacadamia) #57

I think it’s alright. Thought the older one was alright as well.

(Terminal_6) #58

So because I like have “the best” of everything, this new system has kind of destroyed any meaningful progression by way of loadout cards. My ideal “end-game” is one or two favorite loadouts for every merc in any Cobalt skin. When I have that, my progression is done with DB. Probably never going to get that far, but that’s besides the point.

To put it succinctly: because I personally value Cobalt cards above other rarities, the new system puts me in a constant trade-in cycle where I grind fragments and credits to until I can pay up front for a 1/9 desirable Cobalt card. In the previous system, I at least had reason to make Gold and Silver cards as progression to Cobalt, and I would keep them unless I had the same loadout in a higher rarity. Now I don’t make Gold or Silver cards as a by-product of the Cobalt refining process, and see no reason to make them otherwise.

I grind to Cobalt. Get desirable card? Keep it, grind to desirable card again. Undesirable card? Grind 7K frags then recycle undesirable for remaining 13K. Hopefully made 50K credits along the way. Repeat.

(doxjq) #59

[quote=“Hunterwolf;194143”]
Trade up Lead to Cobalt Cost : 864 Lead + 322 000c
Recycling Lead to Cobalt Cost : 1 334 Lead + 50 000c

Based of these values, the new system costs far less money but will need more loadout cards. Sounds fair to me ![/quote]

The problem with this as many others have pointed out, is that this only works on paper and the values are based off one single trade.

Yeah sure, there is no argument at all that if you do one cobalt trade and get the perfect card you were after first pop then voila, you’ve hit the jackpot and you’re much better off. The new system is great in this respect. But what if you don’t?

Recycling cobalts and then crafting a new cobalt (or “trading in”) now is twice as expensive. You still have to recycle two cobalts to craft a new cobalt (the same as the old trade in system) but every time you do this, you pay 50,000 credits instead of 24,000 under the old system. So if someone is targetting a specific card (very likely, you know we all do it) and has to do multiple trades, the fees start to back up. I mean be realistic here. The odds of getting the perfect cobalt straight away are very slim, so it’s only fair to assume multiple trades will be done.

Then there is also the double fees we pay. Lets say you have 24 silvers, and you recycle them and craft 6 golds. This will now cost you 150,000 credits. Under the old system you could have done this for 24,000 credits because the old system charged you the silver to gold fee only, and the new system charges you as if you were paying all the fees coming up from lead with every single trade you ever make.

Now lets assume you don’t like any of those 6 golds, and you want to recycle them and make a cobalt. Oh wait you can’t, because it now takes 9.3 golds to make a cobalt instead of the old 6. Lets also not forget that even if you obtain another 4 golds to make the trade, you’re going to have to pay 50,000 credits to obtain the cobalt because once again, the fee you pay assumes you’re coming from lead not gold. Under the old system, you could have used those 6 golds and obtained a cobalt for a measly 10,000 credits.

Then there is also the fact that working out value from leads only is flawed, because not every case we open is a lead. We do obtain irons, bronze, silver, gold and cobalt. Even if they are rarer, we do get them from time to time. Me personally, I would say I get at least one bronze every 20 or so cases, so working out the values of cobalts through leads only is a really naive way for anyone to work out the true value, because no one is going to get 864 leads from 864 cases.

Lets also not forget elite cases as I just explained in another thread. Even elite cases now hold less value imo. Under the old system at least if I got 10 silvers I could trade them up to 2 golds for a cheap 8000 credits and still have 2 silvers left over. If I buy elite cases now and get 10 silvers and want to trade them up to gold, I have to pay 50,000 credits because it is charging me for all the fees I would have had coming from lead once again, even though I am paying a lot of REAL money to obtain a higher rarity guaranteed. How is this fair? So in my opinion, the odds of receiving a gold or cobalt in an elite case should be boosted or the price of elite cases should drop, since silvers and golds now hold less value for trading and cost more to trade. You simply get less for your money with elite cases now, unless you actually manage to obtain 10 cobalts from 10 elite cases, which is a real problem if you ask me because elite cases were already way overpriced.

To sum up, the new system is great if you are just looking at obtaining a cobalt for the sake of obtaining any cobalt, but that’s about it. Trading in, trading up, elite cases, everything else is going to work out more expensive in the long run, and unless you manage to get the perfect cobalt trade every time you’re going to end up paying more.

Don’t even get me started on the lack of progression now either. Everyone knows that story well enough.

(doxjq) #60

@Xyfurion maybe this explains it better. The other thread was a little meh hah.