True Combat: Elite - Imminent?

(Fusen) #21

seems like quite a decent game so far, personally I just don’t really like the weapons as they seem abit lotto(even more than cs) :x but that may have something to do with the hitboxes. also any chance there will be a one shot kill sniper rifle?

(Spark) #22

Thank you reyalP, valuable information considering that there is no manual yet. :slight_smile: What I’m still wondering about is mainly:

  • Do the silenced versions of the SMG have any downside to the non-silenced versions?
  • What’s the difference between UMP and the other SMG guns? My guess is that UMP shoots slower and deals more damage, but don’t know about accuracy.
  • If the hitboxes work as in ET, how does it apply to leaning? This is probably hard to figure out.
  • You gave some good information about material penetration, but are there also differences with regards to the material is it just a “can penetrate” / “can’t penetrate” thing? I thought that bullets only go through wood, does it work with all metal materials?

My opinion about the mod: I usually don’t like tactical shooters, but this one is damn addictive. I don’t really have fun on ET publics anymore, so this is a great alternative time waster. :slight_smile: Not sure if I’d ever play it in a clan setting, but it’s not unthinkable. What I like best about the test is its simplicity and sane gameplay decisions, that’s very unusual for free mods. I’m just a little afraid that the simplicity might be more a result of the game being very young. Hopefully the devs will stick to what the game does best and not overload it with features and gimmicks until it becomes a pain to play. I also hope that the devs have the guts to stick to “unpopular” decisions, even if the forums go on a rampage against it (speed, damage, no CTF, etc). :slight_smile: Featuritis was exactly the reason why I could never make myself like any of the TC mods for Q3.

(DG) #23

hadnt played et much in a while tbh

played this for at least 1 hour for each of the past 3 days though :slight_smile:

mostly just missing etpro antilag,maybe etpro IAC, and finding the delays between some actions & being able to shoot a pain.

(bs) #24

Heh Kendle
its a 3D game/mod shown on a 2D screen how can u not aim usin the weapon’s sights even if you are left-handed? :wink:
And No Demolition “ISN’T what TC:E is all about”, as I’ve said over and over this is only a first test release.

Fusen - sniper rifles are 1 shot kill already. (simplified answer)
And like I said before, hitboxes and hit detection need work for certain.

Spark - we strive to make it simple for the players, not too simple ofc but there shouldnt be a steep learning curve involved to start playing. There are differences with regards to the material in the penetration code. Only in the movies do bullets penetrate wood only ;D
Depending on the material and the thickness different guns penetrate differently, eg. u can shoot thru a brickwall w/ more powerfull rifles and so on.

(bani) #25

player movement/control is probably the buggiest part of the mod, it needs a lot of work.
switch to ironsights, wait wait wait wait wait wait wait ok, now you can shoot. :frowning:
moving backwards while using sights is near impossible. you can move backwards faster by strafing at an angle…
prone movement is frustrating and buggy, it keeps kicking you back up to standing position seemingly randomly.
kicks you out of ironsight mode seemingly randomly when moving. :confused:
stows your weapon while sprinting (not a bug i guess, but annoying)
up close shots feel very lotto. unload entire mp5 clip into someones body at point blank range, then get killed by 2 DE rounds.
prone hitboxes fubar for sure…
players get stuck/bounce off each other when near.
no extrapolation -> players warp a lot

good fun despite the bugs.

(Kendle) #26

I can aim fine using IronSights, but not so good shooting from the hip, i.e. up close in a 1-v-1. Take it from me, right-hand drawn guns are not so intuitive for a leftie as left-hand drawn guns, simple as. I take it from your answer guns can’t be drawn left-handed? If so that’s a little disappointing seeing as there’s no crosshair to aim with instead.

Fair enough, I look forward to the full release then.

(SCDS_reyalP) #27

ehm, the whole point of shoot from the hip mode is that it is wildly innaccurate. The gun position has little to do with it. Even in an up close 1v1, you’d have to be lucky to beat someone who is in ironsight mode.

and FWIW, you can adjust the gun position in the options menu, though you cannot make it on the left.

(Kendle) #28

Yeah I know, I’ve had a fair few 1-v-1’s where me and the other guy have been standing 6 feet apart and both completely failed to inflict any damage despite each emptying a clip into each other. (these realism games huh? :moo: )

I guess it’s just hard to “unlearn” the ET way of doing things, besides the delay in going to and from IronSights (not to mention restricted movement and limited FOV) makes it impractical to use sights for close combat. But then I guess that’s the whole point as well.

I had an hour or so on a TC:E server last night and found that sitting and camping certainly pays off, pity the server was in DeathMatch mode most of the time. Even when it rotated to Demolition players were voting back BodyCount. :frowning:

(Loffy) #29

In the army, we individually fired a whole mag (30 rounds) at a full-figure, from the hip, at approx. 10-15 meters distance. The purpose of this exercise was to let us see/understand how un-accurate rapidfire is. I cannot remember in detail, but I think I only got like 4-5 hits, which was kind of average for us all.

EDIT: This picture shows how it felt in the army somedays:

Ah, Dad’s Army. Does anyone remember them? Does that show still re-run, somewhere on the globe? Haven’t seen them on Swedish TV since I was a kid.

(Depth_Charge) #30

Well I got into this last night with the staple gun sounding gun lo!
Much better than CS just dont add any complicated “features” like buying equipment or anything

(bani) #31

selectable body armor would be nice (penalty: slower movement). different weapons penalize your movespeed (eg sniper rifles) so it would be consistent.

and 100% agree TC:E should not have a buy system.

(M8DNephelim) #32

idd
agree with bani here since TC:E is a realism mod. Usually a sniper weares camouflage suited for the enviroment aswell as the rifle wich slows the sniper down wich is you should have a reduction on movespeed (but hey you got deadly rifle instead).
body armor should include sniper camouflage.

and def not a buy system.
I like the TC:E Test version a lot in between my time playing ET and i am looking forward to the Beta version.

(bs) #33

thx for the feedback bani and others.

Some of the stuff is intentional like the switch to ironsights delay, things need to be tweaked ofc but the background to all this is to prevent spammage and keepin things somewhat real.

Q3TC didnt have a a buy system nor will TC:E so dont worry guys :slight_smile: we dont want to copy CS, not intentionally at least. Last time I played CS was like beta 0.6 something…

In the previous versions we had things like selectable body armor and stuff alike, so that might get included into TC:E as well.

Precis Loffy :slight_smile:
Like Loffy and reyalP are saying, “the whole point of shoot from the hip mode is that it is wildly innaccurate”

And “sitting and camping certainly pays off” goes for pretty much most games/mods/gametypes unless u have proper missions and alike. Kendle u even said that the server was in DeathMatch mode most of the time and that sadly is 1 of those gametypes where campin pays off most so that wasnt really unexpected.

-thx

(SCDS_reyalP) #34

An informative post over on the TC:E forums:
original post

and

uh, I forgot, indeed, the mp5sd and aksu74sd use subsonic ammunition that has less muzzle energy (less penetration capabilities), increased distance falloff and reduced damage.

I would say the damage system needs work, as there are clearly situations where you can hit the model and do 0 damage, or get a center of the torso shot with a sniper weapon, and do little or no damage. Hopefully that will get sorted a bit in beta. :banana:

(pgh) #35

www.play.com Loffy! Order them DVD’s!!

(No1_sonuk) #36

Quote:

uh, I forgot, indeed, the mp5sd and aksu74sd use subsonic ammunition that has less muzzle energy (less penetration capabilities), increased distance falloff and reduced damage.

Hmm. Actually, MP5SDs don’t need to use subsonic ammo - The suppression is good enough that standard 9mm has to be used.

From
http://www.hkpro.com/mp5sd.htm

Key to the uniqueness of the SD suppressor is that it is coupled with a barrel that has 30 2.5 mm ports in it to drop supersonic bullets to subsonic velocity for even greater noise reduction. It is often confused, but shooting subsonic bullets in an MP5SD is a definite no-no for what is described in ballistic performance as the world’s most expensive .380. The average reduction in velocity is 200 feet per second. You can thus see why subsonic is not a good idea, apart from the unreliability that you are introducing the gun as well. Supersonic always for the SD, but subsonic is in order for all the other muzzle mounted suppressors marketed by or manufactured for, HK submachine guns.

(ouroboro) #37

the single most important issue with FPS games is accurate hit detection and compensation for differences in connections. etmain does a pretty damn good job of it out of the box, etpro refines it to near perfection. for some reason, this mod seems to have gone backwards from etmain, which is a bit buggy but quite acceptable really. i still play etmain once in a blue moon and i never feel like i’m playing the lottery - in TC:E i do. same as CS:S - horrendous hit detection / lag compensation.

i’m not talking about adjusting to the weapon spread, etc. i do all that preparation alone on a listen server with every game i play. i’m well aware of the weapon characteristics and am perfectly able to compensate for them - this is an issue of borked netcode (somehow).

aside form that it’s mad fun. not to offend anyone in this thread who took issue with different aspects of the gameplay, but please stfu. the things you dislike about TC:E because they are different from ET are called “game features”. this isn’t ET. i had as rough a time adjusting as you (and am still working on it), lots of the aspects of this game annoy me, but i see them for what they are: intentional differences. if you dislike the gamestyle of TC:E, u need to avoid it rather than try to convince the devs to lean more towards the ET way of doing things.

rant over there, but again i have to STRONGLY recommend to the devs that you dedicate as much time as you possibly can to getting the netcode as near perfect as possible. perhaps bani could give you some generalized concepts that he used in etpro, if not actual code snippets. i dare say that accurate detection and lag compensation is even MORE important in this type of game than it is in ET. please, consider this issue even before you consider new game modes, maps, weapons, player skins, etc etc etc.

i would play this mod daily with the 2 existing maps if these issues were addressed. as it stands, i’ll probably not bother with it much until i hear through the grapevine that there has been a major overhaul of those parts of the code. you can wow me with all the maps and modes in the world, but i’m not gonna be inclined to bother with fancy modes and lush environments if the underlying code is unpredictable and unreliable (ever played Vietcong? perfect example. absolutely awesome game rendered unplayable as an online game due to attrocious netcode). this is a shooter, the very genre depends on consistent gameplay in order to develop a personalized tecnique.

as much as ppl love to rag on CS, the fact remains that it’s netcode is superb (from my experience - i’ve heard ppl say it’s horrid but i never understood why they thought so). yes it’s old, ugly, infested with cheats, etc etc, but it rewards accuracy and tactics, as it’s meant to, and that makes it still highly playable after all these years. if you want TC:E to be popular, ppl HAVE to know that if they practice and develop skill in aiming, weapon intimacy, strats, etc, they will be rewarded for their efforts. if they believe that none of that matters because every encounter with an enemy is a coin toss, they won’t likely bother with this game.

to put it another way: if you are on my monitor and i aim at you and pull the trigger, assuming my aim was true, i damn well better land the shot. i, as a client on the server, care nothing about HOW this is accomplished. all that matters is that valid shots register as hits, regardless of lag, or whether or not the other guy thought he was hidden, etc. the ONLY thing that matters is what I saw on MY screen. ETPro antilag does this beautifully - i might think i was safe, but if you still saw me and hit me, i’m dead. yes it can be annoying, but it’s fair accross the board for all connections, and that’s what’s important. i have 3000/256 cable and i STILL declare that a dialup user has as much right to have an enjoyable game as i do, and i deserve exactly ZERO advantage over him simply because i am able to afford/acquire broadband and he’s not.

did i mention this mod is mad fun? :wink: i happen to really like the first 2 maps, kinda remind me of RvS/SoF2 combined. very nice weapon models as well - the pistols look a bit strange and blocky when aiming down the sight, but i realize it’s pretty much accurate, i’m just not used to it yet. oh and i noticed the colt 45 is still there when i did /give all, i assume that was a test model to develop the iron sights animations? anyway, keep up the hard work, it’s appreciated :drink:

(Depth_Charge) #38

Hit detection is fine for me.
The sniper rifle will not kill people in one shot if you shoot them lower than the middle of the chest.

(Loffy) #39

But they might get removed from our gene pool.

(snypercore) #40

Ah, Dad’s Army. Does anyone remember them? Does that show still re-run, somewhere on the globe? Haven’t seen them on Swedish TV since I was a kid.

im in uk and they play DADS ARMY all the time on a channel called uk gold but…their not that godd