This will be controversial.

(Ragoo) #161

There is only one thing I can say about DarkangelUK vs tokamak

[QUOTE=tokamak;273427]Hush, grown ups are talking now.
[/QUOTE]

(tokamak) #162

Alright, touche.

(DarkangelUK) #163

Did you look that up when Linsov said it then decided you liked it? :slight_smile:

Arguing against being pig-headed is a catch-22 Did you even read my posts? I didn’t bite .You wouldn’t know how often people try me to lure me down that path. I’m sure this particular game has a fancy name and any English or Philosophy student wouldn’t have any trouble pointing it out.

Ah now, I never said I wasn’t pig headed, just classy enough to know when I am.

Oh now I get it, you just want everyone to easily accept each other’s arguments, well tough.

Oh not at all, but open enough to see others point of view, which there’s a severe lack of.

I actually do understand your attitude though. Happens on many boards, people don’t like my aggressive approach regardless of their own take on the matter and just need to distantiate themselves from me so they can still take the same side but not get confused with my militancy.

I’d say it’s more the double standards that gets confused with aggression, I’m guilty of it as well. I expect everyone to see it from my point of view while failing to see it from theirs, that’s where successful debating comes from, not stubborn, unflinching views. I’m working on it… honest.

I’ll take my pig head off now.

(JeP) #164

Seriously ? That was necessary ?

(Ragoo) #165

Yes, now the title actually makes sense : P

(JeP) #166

Good point.

(Herandar) #167

Gotta remember that one the next time I play Scrabble.

(V1cK_dB) #168

So…does anyone know what options are customizable in private matches on console? Anyone? Even the pigheaded ones…

(Humate) #169

And we have a winner.
Although its pretty rare to have a high KPM without a decent ratio imo.

(Weeohhweeohh) #170

I would support overall damage or even damage per minute. If I am a light medic healing my team and shooting my smg/secondary and not getting kills, am I not being a contributing player? I may not get kills, but I’m healing scalpers and dealing a bit of damage.

(Linsolv) #171

I think K/D spread, possibly with revives taken into account for medics, is probably the most useful measure.

(Herandar) #172

We need a baseball statistician to invent a new metric.

(Theomachy) #173

Those are obviously the wrong type of gamer for Brink. Brink is a team-based game. Let them play Call of Duty.

How you can claim to have played 2,0000 hours of RTCW:ET and post something like that is mind-boggling.

Splash Damage never once said nor implied that.

What do you mean there?

I don’t know how you arrived at that conclusion. I suggest you read the water cooler moments the developers are having while playing Brink.

“High-level” Call of Duty players, again, are not going to like Brink. Brink is about teams coming together to win a match. Call of Duty is geared toward “lone wolf” play and, quite frankly, selfishness.

If you’re worried about matchmaking and customizing them, you should get the PC version.

Well, that’s very nice.

If you’d ever played a Splash Damage game, you would never have written that.

I wouldn’t call this a “controversial” post. Poorly researched and thought out, yes. Controversial, no.

(Apples) #174

I suggest ((Kill_per_minute * XP_per_minute)) / Number of Death without gaining xp since the latest spawn)

This way only the stupid death are counted in the metric to lower it, I mean if you just spawned, climbed a hill, shot 3 shot and missed all, then got sniped, it counts as one :slight_smile: But if you spawn, rush in the mass, kill 3 opponents and revive 2, then die, this is not counted. everyone is happy!

Meh just kidding around and will be too hard to implement.

PS : This Tok vs DAUK babbling was awesome, keep’em coming guyz!

@ Tok, I’m a bit disapointed that you spent your time saying that noone shown you the flaws or whatever, I just provided a counter exemple showing that XP is not a good index neither, but you skipped it, I’m sad! Overall it’s indeed less biased than the K/D and we agree on that, but XP/MIN can also be easily biased, as herandar pointed out, let’s make a new metric! that might be the better solution :wink:

Peace

(Humate) #175

This Tok vs DAUK babbling was awesome, keep’em coming guyz!

I agree! Fire up lads.

As for XP being a skill indicator, thats so laughable it doesn’t even warrant a discussion. ^…^oink

(tokamak) #176

Aye Apples, but I already stated it’s not perfect either, I only said it’s the best option (and that there can’t be a better option) there is and that even in a bad xp-distribution system it would be better than K/D because K/D only asses an incredibly small part of the ways you can approach the game. At least xp encompasses more and gets better when the awards turn more accurate.

In a team-deathmatch K/D or kill spread would be the most useful as that’s the only thing that counts. Shattered Horizon awards higher scores for headshots and all, which makes the xp score completely useless as headshots have no further relevance to final score.

I just really dislike to brand everything a fallacy outright. It’s not in line with my ideal where people have the decency to not be fallacious in the first place. However, your posts here are so incredibly full of it that I can’t help to put it any other way.

Really I know all the tricks in the book, what you’re doing is nothing short of an attempt to paint someone in such a way that you can feel satisfied in not having to deal with the person’s points.

Ah now, I never said I wasn’t pig headed, just classy enough to know when I am.

Could you read the post you’re responding to again? It’s like you’re simply imagining what my response might have been.

Oh not at all, but open enough to see others point of view, which there’s a severe lack of.
I’d say it’s more the double standards that gets confused with aggression, I’m guilty of it as well. I expect everyone to see it from my point of view while failing to see it from theirs, that’s where successful debating comes from, not stubborn, unflinching views. I’m working on it… honest.

Telling someone he’s arrogant, close-minded, or pig-headed is just a way of blowing smoke to hide for the lack of reason.

Good debating isn’t striving to get a compromise or a consensus, it’s there to let the most coherent arguments prevail. My views remain unflinching until people actually start poking holes in my reasoning, if they do then I’m all to willing to admit I’m wrong.

(DarkangelUK) #177

Saying it’s blowing smoke is just an easy sidestep… but anyway, back ontopic, i’ll leave you in your own little solipsistic universe.

I wrote this suggestion a while ago when the debate on rank and skill was 1st explored, largely obviously the formula was made up on the spot, but i still believe there are far too many variables and statistics within the game to be ignored that could help more accurately gauge a players overall skill, and going by a single metric that can be easily manipulated, or gives an inaccurate view of what entails skill of the whole game is just silly. Going by XP alone doesn’t show an accurate measure of skill, an XP farming medic can gain high XP within the game without lending to the objective.

(Apples) #178

[QUOTE=DarkangelUK;273798]Saying it’s blowing smoke is just an easy sidestep… but anyway, back ontopic, i’ll leave you in your own little solipsistic universe.

I wrote this suggestion a while ago when the debate on rank and skill was 1st explored, largely obviously the formula was made up on the spot, but i still believe there are far too many variables and statistics within the game to be ignored that could help more accurately gauge a players overall skill, and going by a single metric that can be easily manipulated, or gives an inaccurate view of what entails skill of the whole game is just silly. Going by XP alone doesn’t show an accurate measure of skill, an XP farming medic can gain high XP within the game without lending to the objective.[/QUOTE]

Yup your metric is good I think DA, the only thing that disapoint me a bit is that why in the first place objectives “should” reward more than kills, when it’s obvious (well at least to me) than one cant go with another (speaking for a team here, not individual), as I stated you can have a large amount of objectives by going lemming and be a totally useless POS for your team, well the obj is done, cool, but it usually took way more time than if you cleaned the area first and do the entire obj in one life.

The thing would be to mix up the Kill / xp and obj done alltogether in a non independant probability, its not “you killed or did the obj or gained that much XP” but would be “you killed AND did the obj AND gained xp” in the same set of variable, that would be like you did the objective knowing that you killed 3 guys before, you have more “points” than if you just did the objective alone, that bring complexity in the metric but would be the best solution for an accurate one IMO.

Its probably just a matter of taste and experience here, but I almost never saw a “lemming rush” being more successfull than a “clean it all then do the obj” approach, and I’m only speaking about constructing / hacking here. When you plant lemming style its even worse, because you usually just dye, they defuse and strenghten their defence :slight_smile:

Well there is no perfect solution anyway, as soon as the core game is playable, I dont really mind as I dont give a duck about the stats usually.

Peace

(DarkangelUK) #179

Oh yeah it definitely needs some tweaking to balance the focus on each area and give at least an equal emphasis on each metric. Since writing that, I agree that all areas are important in their own right including killing, which is why I think they all need to be counted and not just rely on one measurement.

(tokamak) #180

If lemming rushing is effective then the solution shouldn’t be sought in xp-distribution. Xp should be awarded to doing the most effective things and not to the way you want to see a player play the game.