The Future Of Dirty Bomb - Community Survey RESULTS

(Chris Mullins) #61

[quote=“p4v;141044”][quote=“RazielWarmonic;140849”][quote=“flease;140743”]
Can’t make a great tutorial right now?
You (Dirty Bomb) have a Youtube channel, record some video explaining fundamentals, like @kAndyREW PSA videos, is an example, and point new user there thought the in game UI.

Sometimes a Twitch stream where you @RazielWarmonic and @stayfreshshoe explain game mechanics, tips, tricks, basic skills, whatever could help new player, could be a good thing.

[/quote]

We do kind of have a “down and dirty” overview of the game:

But I understand what you’re saying. It’s definitely something I’ll look into (no promises, though!)[/quote]

YT tutorials from the official channel linked in the game menu is a great idea. Btw, that newbie is planting a bomb behind the console! :stuck_out_tongue: [/quote]

We are looking at giving out tutorial in-game a bit of a makeover to help with this. For the time being we’ll just need your help to inform those both in game and with awesome video content :slight_smile:

(KorpKyuuSama) #62

PUBLIC PARTY MATCH-MAKING

Lets ruin even more the balance in games!! YAY!!

(DMaster2) #63

[quote=“KokoroBreaker;141047”]PUBLIC PARTY MATCH-MAKING

Lets ruin even more the balance in games!! YAY!![/quote]
Agree, people have wrong prio. Then when devs will make the mistake of adding it in casual people will complain because stomping. Serves them right.

(SzGamer227) #64

I honestly just want party matchmaking so I can be in the same matches as my friends. I would have absolutely no craps to give if members of a party were split up for the sake of team balance.

(DMaster2) #65

You can already do that, join a server with 2 empty spots.

(Faraleth) #66

@DMaster2 there is a delay between you joining a server, and your friend being able to click “join game”. There have been plenty of times that I’ve gone to join a server with something like 8/12 people on it, yet it’s full by the time my friend is able to join.

(bontsa) #67

It is indeed tedious to join a game with group of 2 or more people. But sadly, what majority of the people requesting party matchmaking want, are to be on SAME team with their buddies, ultimately leading in stomps when wrong type of peeps abuse the system.

Funniest fellas are those who make thread on forum here and there first about bad balance, and then in next thread demand with as many exclamation marks as possible that they must be able to play with buddies on same team.

I really need a time machine to see when was the turning point in gaming that playing WITH friends suddenly excluded healthy competition and playing against them. Like, aren’t consoles practically splitscreen 1v1’s too. And least I had my best childhood memories from playing Crash Bash, racing games etc.etc. against my schoolmates. Also best wrestling matches when they were the only ones I could take on. Bullies were 2 scary and big :<

(watsyurdeal) #68

People need to stop trying to make pubs so serious, competitive mode is the serious format, you should be encouraging Splash to improve on it rather than force 8v8 pubs to be balanced, which is a fucking joke.

(DMaster2) #69

Personally i want to be able to jump in a casual match in casual mode with a decently balanced teams. I don’t want to join competitive because i don’t have a clan, nor a mic nor i have any interest in either (and matches last forever). And in casual with party matchmaking it’s going to be imbalanced as hell. Keep casual obj out of that party garbage and do what you want with the rest.

(bontsa) #70

Personally i want to be able to jump in a casual match in casual mode with a decently balanced teams. I don’t want to join competitive because i don’t have a clan, nor a mic nor i have any interest in either (and matches last forever). And in casual with party matchmaking it’s going to be imbalanced as hell. Keep casual obj out of that party garbage and do what you want with the rest.[/quote]

I think Watsyurdeal’s point is making such chaotic enviroment (maps are extremely linear, designed 5v5 in mind), people dropping in and out, skills ranging from “how-to-WASD” to peeps whose hand and eyesight functions locate in same part of the brain with fullcontrollll, will be more easily said than done balanced. No program will be able to keep up with changing factors in such mayhem, so pub balance in any game cannot be guaranteed.

However yes, SD and Nexon have tools at their disposal to change balance to better direction. Incencitive for people to switch teams (without counting result as loss) in numberly inbalance, better hidden ELO, fixing bugs like 13/14 players-fullserver- bug, so forth and so forth. There is room for improvement, it is just utterly impossible to have completely balanced games always in public setting.

(DMaster2) #71

[quote=“bontsa;141380”]
I think Watsyurdeal’s point is making such chaotic enviroment (maps are extremely linear, designed 5v5 in mind), people dropping in and out, skills ranging from “how-to-WASD” to peeps whose hand and eyesight functions locate in same part of the brain with fullcontrollll, will be more easily said than done balanced. No program will be able to keep up with changing factors in such mayhem, so pub balance in any game cannot be guaranteed.

However yes, SD and Nexon have tools at their disposal to change balance to better direction. Incencitive for people to switch teams (without counting result as loss) in numberly inbalance, better hidden ELO, fixing bugs like 13/14 players-fullserver- bug, so forth and so forth. There is room for improvement, it is just utterly impossible to have completely balanced games always in public setting.[/quote]
Right now casual is fine. I hardly see any match that is heavily imbalanced (aka spawnkill). Unlike stopwatch and execution (a lot of 7-0, 7-1 and 7-2). So yeah, do party matchmaking there and in casual and leave obj to people that want to play in a fairly balanced environment.

(watsyurdeal) #72

Personally i want to be able to jump in a casual match in casual mode with a decently balanced teams. I don’t want to join competitive because i don’t have a clan, nor a mic nor i have any interest in either (and matches last forever). And in casual with party matchmaking it’s going to be imbalanced as hell. Keep casual obj out of that party garbage and do what you want with the rest.[/quote]

So in other words you want balanced games?

Well guess what, Objective is inherently imbalanced because the vast majority of the maps in this game are Defender sided, in that Defenders have the easiest time compared to the Attackers. At most they have to prevent a repair, prevent a plant, defuse, destroy the EV, and prevent delivery of objectives, all of which comes down to DM and positioning, super easy peasy stuff.

Stopwatch is balanced in that both teams have a shot at winning, since you switch sides and play it out to see what happens.

Next, 8v8 is absolute garbage because the maps are too damn small to house that many players and it’s a real steep task to kill as many of the enemy team as you can and handle the objective before the next spawn wave, whereas with 5 players per team this is a lot more manageable, I myself on occasion can get double or triple kills pretty easily, so it opens up room for my team to get the bomb down and do their thing.

And of course, finally, Pubs will never be decently balanced because the whole point of Casual play is a drop in drop out environment where anyone can come in and play for a bit with no real need to dedicate time. So, if you want a properly balanced match that lasts a maximum of 30 mins at a time, then push for a better Ranked mode, then after that, push for Domination, so we could get a game mode that’s faster than Stopwatch, but still fits Dirty Bomb’s style.

The way I imagine it is this.

  • Three control points
  • Each point you are holding increases how many points your team gets per second or each capture gives you a spawn wave.
  • If a team captures all 3 points, the opposing team will stop spawning until they catch a point. If they are all killed the round ends. This is called a Shutout, first to 2 shutouts wins.

Very very raw idea of it, but I think you get the point.

There is absolutely NO reason to force Pub play to be so serious, if you want to get serious, get serious about Ranked. Stop trying to turn an apple into an orange.

(DMaster2) #73

Maybe we have two different concepts of balance. My concept is that the game isn’t onesided (spawnkill pretty much), and even if one side is favoured because map at least the game is fought over and fun. Yes i like 8vs8 with fairly balanced teams a lot, in fact i pretty much only play objective except for the daily rewards and sometimes the stopwatch quest.
I would really dislike to see so many imbalanced games (see spawnkilling again) like stopwatch or execution. Or even worse MM.

(Tanker_Ray) #74

@Watsyurdeal

I can’t understand why so many forum guys like you don’t really want to care about pub balance.

Normal players like @DMaster2 @Ford_Prefect who doesn’t care about competing, or being a pro takes the most part of the population, not the one who plays comp. Games like League of Legends does punish you for leaving the pubs, which has the highest population of pub players including playing even against the A.I. bots, and that means other games does take pubs seriously.

Also, the only balancing point for new players is Max level 5 room, and as soon as they become level 6, then they have to face all of those skilled players in pubs. If pub is not taken serious, then why does your stat page counts every stats you get while playing pubs?

Everybody deserves serious fun&balanced games in pubs, even it isn’t Ranked. Why do you even try to win at pubs since it isn’t taken seriously??

There is absolutely NO reason to force Pub players to suffer with unbalance, stomping

(uWotm8-AU) #75

@ThunderPro

Cmon mate.

Actions speak louder than words.

Just 2 days ago I joined a lobby where yourself, XP, Chaika and others (You were all level 35+) were spawn camping 2 <level 10 guys.

(bontsa) #76

@ThunderPro I can talk only of my own part, but by no means I, and I can safely assume many others sharing the opinion like this, want to force public setting to be riddled with inbalance and stomping. What I am rather saying, is that it’s so bloody tough job with no clear, straight forward silver bullet- solution. It’s rather bundle of issues, ranging from lousy tutorial to today’s prevalent mindset in gaming (not only one title’s or generations fault, but term “CoD-kid” does kind of fit here).

Bad matches happen, that’s a fact. Lobby creating mechanics can merely reduce the possibility of those, never get fully rid of them. Giving players proper tools to reduce happened inbalance only work if used. Teaching players the basics of the game only works if given enough time for it and done correctly. Getting people’s mindset to start thinking what is faulty on their part and cease blaming every external factor instead… That’s the toughest nut to crack.

What I find interesting though is that you rather punish people leaving pubs, yet still talk about the importance of having fun. If I am not having fun and decide it’s best for my sanity to quit and go do the laundry etc. I should be punished? I just didn’t want to get annoyed more, and annoying people around me because of that, I think it’s fair to say it’s best for everyone that I leave. I have a hobby that is of emergency duty- nature, so I might have to suddenly leave the public match even if everything was going nice’n’smooth. If punishes were a thing, I can assure you no one in my position would be bothered to hop in a game when not knowing if next alarm is in 5, 50 or 500 minutes away.

(B_Montiel) #77

Pub matchmaking is a thing, but in the meantime, that’s in my opinion something that won’t improve the game on the long run. And what stumbles me is that many people are asking for a more active clan/competitive scene at the same time.

The biggest drawback with the current system is that there’s no community servers. Everytime I get into the game with friends, I have two options : go for ranked mm and get rekt by elites/shred some random silvers OR find a random server that will inevitably get unbalanced if the server automatically stacks us. There’s no meeting points for experienced players. Min level 10 servers make no difference now. Give us some community servers so we can properly gather. First, it’ll prevent random pub stomps as well as not forcing us to go on mm with little expectations of having a cool game.

Public matchmaking, well, regarding the current numbers of players, the current ranked mm situation where you need to sit almost 10 min to get a game… If people want it, ok, but that’s not going to help in any way. And Stompings are still bound to happen, as the public mm will surely use a similar system the lobby scramble already employs. It does not truly help.

Dirty Bomb currently lacks a sufficient playerbase to get into those systems. Volvo’s systems are only efficient because they’re working with a totally different scale. And in my opinion, this cannot be transposed here. The old recipe with a server browser and community servers will always have my voice for public games and clan training related stuff.

(MarsRover) #78

3k concurrent players is plenty for a decently accurate public MM, if we had one.

Current setup - server browser without community servers - is the worst of both worlds. Massive skill gaps between players on a random “EU Objective Server 7v7 16”. Leavers that aren’t quickly replaced by other people, etc.

I want Quick Join that is a real public MM plus separate community servers. Want a quick game with players around your skill level? Click Quick Join. Rented community servers support the game financially and, you know, build community :slight_smile:

(watsyurdeal) #79

[quote=“ThunderPro;142201”]@Watsyurdeal

I can’t understand why so many forum guys like you don’t really want to care about pub balance.

Normal players like @DMaster2 @Ford_Prefect who doesn’t care about competing, or being a pro takes the most part of the population, not the one who plays comp. Games like League of Legends does punish you for leaving the pubs, which has the highest population of pub players including playing even against the A.I. bots, and that means other games does take pubs seriously.

Also, the only balancing point for new players is Max level 5 room, and as soon as they become level 6, then they have to face all of those skilled players in pubs. If pub is not taken serious, then why does your stat page counts every stats you get while playing pubs?

Everybody deserves serious fun&balanced games in pubs, even it isn’t Ranked. Why do you even try to win at pubs since it isn’t taken seriously??

There is absolutely NO reason to force Pub players to suffer with unbalance, stomping[/quote]

Because as I have said countless times matchmaking doesn’t fix the core problem of people not knowing how to play. You can shuffle them 5 times in a single game and you’ll still have the 25% or so of the people who know what they’re doing carrying but on different teams, while the rest are just fodder.

You guys seem to think balancing is as simple as mixing it up, but really it comes to down to assuring all the variables you can handle as a developer are taken care off.

We have matchmaking in a sense that teams are sorted based on ELO, then all we’d need is a shuffle in case there is a 8v6, 7v5, etc.

What we desperately need, is a better tutorial to teach people all the roles and what they’re about. People need to understand the role of Engineers, Assault, and Recon, and have a Medic that’s easier to pick up and play than Aura.

At least this way it comes down to what the players can control, their aim, their comms, their pushes, etc. At that point the devs have done all they can besides blocking off the high level folk from playing with the rest the players. Which is a question of at what point do we stop holding people’s hand before they are faced with a real challenge? And why do the people who spent their time playing have to be punished for enjoying the game enough to get that high up?

(Szakalot) #80

[quote=“Watsyurdeal;142272”]
snip [/quote]

the main problem with unbalanced games is that the skill-shuffle is badly implemented. It doesnt happen when the server is full (and will stay full) If a vote goes through early into a map, with full teams on both sides, more often then not the game is pretty well balanced.

Another problem is the huge skill variety between players. If ill join a non -minlvl10 server mid-game, im almost certain to swing the balance of the map in my team’s favour. not because im so amazing or whatever, but because the other players really REALLY suck by comparison.

Community servers solve both issues, plus they siphon the good players away from the poor newbies.

Imagine ETpro players being mixed in randomly with ETmain and ETshrub; thats what we are getting now pretty much.