The developers need to talk about brink.

(mxdirector) #1

Hear me out. Don’t assume I am some antagonistic forum user out to insult splash damages pass work and a game which I am sure many of the people here loved.

A few years ago I saw a post mortem on deus ex in

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTWvsGA77T4

It was absolutely fascinating to see what their intentions were with a game which I still consider awful. I now understand what they were trying to do. They talk indepth about the problems with their design, what they should have done differently how they misinterpreted issues.

In fact in every walk of life we are expected to think through our mistakes and learn from them.

As of right now, I have little to no faith in splash damage. I need to know that they understand the problems with brink. I’m sure there are many more who feel the same way.

This isn’t some witch hunt, I don’t expect you to stand up and apologies, cry in shame and for your family to turn their backs on you, Brink wasn’t that bad. But I would be interested in seeing the devs talking about the feedback from brink and what they would have done differently given hind sight.

I am not sure if this message comes across as rude or insulting, that is not my intention. I am simply bringing a froward a solution to a very real problem, and that is that brink tainted splash damage.

(Kebyh) #2

Interesting video on Deus ex indeed.

I don’t think Splash Damage realise that a lot of us got really really disapointed by Brink and that is the reason why, personally, i won’t put any money into DB right now. But yeah a post mortem would be nice…or even a simple “btw sorry about Brink” :slight_smile:

(mxdirector) #3

[QUOTE=Kebyh;423019]Interesting video on Deus ex indeed.

I don’t think Splash Damage realise that a lot of us got really really disapointed by Brink and that is the reason why, personally, i won’t put any money into DB right now. But yeah a post mortem would be nice…or even a simple “btw sorry about Brink” :)[/QUOTE]
I don’t think they need to say sorry

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=9u0EL_u4nvw#t=13s

They really have nothing to apologise for. They didn’t make anything that offended anyone, no one died from texture pop in. They made a game which alot of people actually liked, alot more were a little disappointed by it. They just need to proof that they understand the faults in their previous game, that is all I am asking for.

(INF3RN0) #4

Key thing your all missing. “From the creators of W:ET and ETQW” There’s that apology sirs :wink:.

(Rex) #5

Damn right, and even involving the community is a big step to shape DB to a great game.

(rookie1) #6

This ^^ ^^ and
sh** happend ! …and they have to look forward …I Bought Brink and that wont stop me from supporting SD but i understand ppl that are nervous about the next SD game

(Dthy) #7

If anything, having one failure is better as they now know what doesn’t work/isn’t expected.

(TwwIX) #8

Admitting your own failures requires integrity.

(SockDog) #9

There is some explanation through their actions.
Early player access
Echo
PC only
F2P
Etc

This is clearly not what happened with Brink. Interest aside lamenting and talking about the past isn’t going to touch on actually showing, through actions, what they are doing to correct those mistakes.

(Kl3ppy) #10

SD learned from their mistakes and let the community join in an early phase. They use Echo to find weaknesses and change them to make the game overall better. I have high hopes and I’m looking forward to join the party :slight_smile:

(potty200) #11

Not going to stick up for anyone here as it took people too long to fix bugs on brink. BUT, everyone learns from mistakes made and brink was somewhat of a failure. I personally loved the game and thought it had potential even with the bugs. But with no community behind the game it flopped. The only way this game is going to succeed is if a community is built and can help drive this project forward. It is going to be free to play so it isn’t going to take much to make a community. I guess they will have perks you can buy to fund the project, similar to League of Ledgends system and at the same time the game doesn’t become buy to win.

(Ruben0s) #12

People should stop talking about Brink… I try to forget that game. It reminds me of that year that I did three horrible pre-orders, with Brink being the biggest disappointment.

(mxdirector) #13

[QUOTE=SockDog;423107]There is some explanation through their actions.
Early player access
Echo
PC only
F2P
Etc

This is clearly not what happened with Brink. Interest aside lamenting and talking about the past isn’t going to touch on actually showing, through actions, what they are doing to correct those mistakes.[/QUOTE]
Not really. You listed a bunch of good concepts. Wasn’t that brink’s problem that it had a bunch of good concepts, but failed to deliver on them?

The bottom line is unless they confront the issue at hand, the whole of dirty bomb’s development will be tainted with brink and it will be constantly brought up.

(Exedore) #14

Looking at actions since is indeed the path to tread, and if you have issues with those actions we’re in a position to address those concerns openly and honestly.

Ultimately all that matters is what you decide when you’ve played the game, and with patience you’ll be able to do that with no cost to yourselves other than a bit of time.

(SockDog) #15

These aren’t gameplay concepts they actual things which are different to how Brink was developed. I also forgot to list that this is a total SD project with no external influence. They are very real and very different. Yes, I agree that it doesn’t mean the game will be good but you can’t say there is no evidence of SD doing things differently and IMO doing so directly in relation to the things that DIDN’T happen during Brink’s development.

(Mustang) #16

Brink didn’t have community alpha, beta, demo, free to play, etc.

Dirty Bomb is the complete opposite, it’s marketed as “shaped by gamers”, with all that Brink lacked in that regard.

If you don’t want to pledge your allegiance to the Makron with cold hard cash, then just sit tight until open beta and give it a try then.

Closed alpha/beta is for those that really want to see SD succeed and hence supported by our pledge and feedback or those that really really just can’t wait and are willing to pay for the privilege of early access.

I see no reason to “address the Brink issue”, the whole development of DB seems to me to be completely different.

If DB ends up as 25% what the community wants, 25% what SD wants and 50% what we both want then to me this would be a win.

(mxdirector) #17

[QUOTE=Exedore;423194]Looking at actions since is indeed the path to tread, and if you have issues with those actions we’re in a position to address those concerns openly and honestly.

Ultimately all that matters is what you decide when you’ve played the game, and with patience you’ll be able to do that with no cost to yourselves other than a bit of time.[/QUOTE]
The problem with that, is that I currently have no interest in playing this game and I will not be interested unless I know that you guys understand all the problems with brink. I’m sure you have all got together multiple times at work or at the pub and discussed brink to death.

An example. One issue for me about brink was that the world was dull. The art style was quirky and fun, and yet every single character was dull and lifeless. The world and the story didn’t contrast with the art direction.
So when I see dirty bomb, I see nothing in the game so far that says that you have inserted alot of that personality that was desperately needed in brink. Admittedly it’s still early days, and it’s nice to see london in that state.

I could be completely mistaken and the game could be oozing with comedy and drama, but I have no faith that it will. So unless the dev team speaks up and admits that was a problem I see no reason to get excited about jumping in to the dirty bomb mythology.
Just for a comparison, we have seen less of cyberpunk 2077, but I am alot more excited about that story and world because they had an intriguing trailer and the devs have proven they can do this in the past.

That’s just an example to do with the story, but similar things can be said about almost every aspect of the game.

I get it, I’m just one bloke, out of millions of potential customers, Why would you care if I’m not particular interested in dirty bomb. If you suspect that brink will be brought up time and time again in a negative light, I am purposing a method to confront that in a way that I believe would satisfy the majority of your customers. People who loved brink will see that dirty bomb will be even better, people who were disappointed will be glad to hear that there will be no constant reminders about the command posts. Even the people new to the games will benefit, they will understand that here is a company that thrive on criticism and value feedback.

I want to see dirty bomb succeed, I want to see Splash damage succeed. But you need to give me and the others who were disappointed in brink a bit of faith in this new franchise.

(Kendle) #18

I wonder how easy it is for SD to talk about Brink? For a start, it’s someone else’s game (as in owned by someone else), so to bad mouth it, even tho’ they made it, might be considered the wrong thing for a game developer to do.

(DarkangelUK) #19

The fact that everything that’s happening just now is the complete opposite of how Brink was handled, doesn’t convince you that they’ve listened and taken things on board?

(stealth6) #20

[QUOTE=mxdirector;423232]The problem with that, is that I currently have no interest in playing this game and I will not be interested unless I know that you guys understand all the problems with brink. I’m sure you have all got together multiple times at work or at the pub and discussed brink to death.

An example. One issue for me about brink was that the world was dull. The art style was quirky and fun, and yet every single character was dull and lifeless. The world and the story didn’t contrast with the art direction.
So when I see dirty bomb, I see nothing in the game so far that says that you have inserted alot of that personality that was desperately needed in brink. Admittedly it’s still early days, and it’s nice to see london in that state.

I could be completely mistaken and the game could be oozing with comedy and drama, but I have no faith that it will. So unless the dev team speaks up and admits that was a problem I see no reason to get excited about jumping in to the dirty bomb mythology.
Just for a comparison, we have seen less of cyberpunk 2077, but I am alot more excited about that story and world because they had an intriguing trailer and the devs have proven they can do this in the past.[/QUOTE]

That’s a pretty unforgiving attitude. You would try cyberpunk since they haven’t slipped up yet (and pay)? SD have also released other titles…
Also I don’t see a point in them admitting to anything. Do you believe the ads on TV that say “Are you tired of bending over and using our old product. Well buy the new and improved version with a longer handle!”. You’d probably still be skeptical, and rightly so.

What would be the harm in getting off your high horse, downloading a free game and giving it a shot? Doesn’t really sound like you have anything to loose. Worst case scenario your assumptions are confirmed and you can stop supporting SD and we can all go on our merry way. (what happened to the days when people played games for fun lol :D)