Have you considered any ways of giving the player something to do (even if it is mostly meaningless) during their downtime? Fixed spawn waves for the whole team makes for a better trade off in the overall experience of all players vs satisfying the short attention span. Those who have a really big problem with the traditional spawn wave are more likely to want to play TDM, CTF, or SnD.
spawntimer
Hundopercent
(Hundopercent)
#43
I don’t get the big deal with /kill. It’s been around and used forever. The draw back to /kill is that you are now dead, be it for .5 seconds or 5 seconds doesn’t matter. The enemy team now knows you exact position and roughly how long it’s going to take before you show up to the party.
I’m not really in the mood to reiterate posts but I believe we’ve expressed, multiple times, why spawn waves, not timers, need to occur. I know you’re not in favor of that which is why you keep tip toeing around it but some sort of system needs to be implemented that promotes teamwork and not the exact opposite.
Ashog
(Ashog)
#44
Yes, spectating teammates after being gibbed and after death ghosts have been displayed for some time is really needed. Sometimes you are stucck on your dead body for 20 seconds, which is boring and frustrating. It feels like the game extra-punishes you for dying 
Would be interesting to see devs opinion on that. Anti please?
Samurai
(Samurai.)
#45
Yes this is one of the main features of the game that needs a fair bit of work (the spawn system/spawn timers on HUD) as i think it has one of the biggest impacts on how each game is played, and distinguishes a gap between the good and the bad players.
We really do need a spawn timer on the UI, it is very significant to determining the tactics to employ in almost every situation. It’s the factor that determines whether you should decide to do X or Y in a certain situation depending on which is most beneficial…
1 Example:
X = opportunity to kill a potential planter but know you will die for a full spawn wave of 25s straight after due to further enemies.
Y = self kill letting the planter carry on knowing you will instantly be back to clean up and defuse as you regroup with all your teammates.
Currently without spawn timers being displayed, you have no knowledge to base a tactical decision like that on, and you end up with just a massive disorganized mess of just fragging whatever is infront of you and praying you get lucky and instantly respawn. There’s no thought process or intelligence required by the player right now to make a good/bad decision and be rewarded/punished for it.
I really do feel like the impact of spawn-waves and displaying/using the spawn timer has been massively undermined in it’s effectiveness and importance to this game. It provides organization within the team, intelligent thought process and decision making throughout a game and not to mention it is a necessity for the eSport side of DB.
For those of you who have played comp in the previous games, you will agree that it is essential to know and respond to the spawn wave system, this is one of the most useful and biggest pieces of information you use in a competitive match, pretty much every decision you make revolves around that timer. I just can’t see a long lasting competitive DB without it at all.
Anti
(Anti)
#46
Yes, we definitely want to improve the post-death section somewhat (better info, some POV control). Speccing from other player’s POV at that point might be tough, when incapped you do want to be able to see incoming Medic revives etc before they happen, but maybe after gib it is an option.
iwound
(iwound)
#47
[QUOTE=Ashog;463080]Yes, spectating teammates after being gibbed and after death ghosts have been displayed for some time is really needed. Sometimes you are stucck on your dead body for 20 seconds, which is boring and frustrating. It feels like the game extra-punishes you for dying
Would be interesting to see devs opinion on that. Anti please?[/QUOTE]
agreed. atm these monochrome screens are frustrating. i cant see the damage my molotov is making.
these maybe mood makers but the mood it gives me is :mad:
id like better incapped view. it always starts in opposite direction to action and
takes a few secs to sort out.
also in death give me full colour freecam so i can check out whats happening.
ImageOmega
(ImageOmega)
#48
Quick thought on post death info (I have actually posted this before):
Have the ability to display an info box that shows extra information regarding your last death. This box would include amount done by each enemy to you including shot location. And, how much damage you’ve done to each enemy would be a nice perk. Basically what death ghosts were before the updated versions in a friendly, aesthetically pleasing UI box. Very much an idea from Smite (and Rocket Arena 3).
zeroooo
(zeroooo)
#49
when you are dead (gibbed) you should be able to spec your teammates…
and Anti? why dont you implement a spawntimer with a command in cfg? people who dont want it can switch it off, people who want it can switch it on^^ for me it also doenst have to be beautiful 
just a small time running down on the topright for example^^ thats all, i think this doenst need dat crazy programming skillz^^
Winnie
(Winnie)
#50
[QUOTE=zeroooo;463144]when you are dead (gibbed) you should be able to spec your teammates…
and Anti? why dont you implement a spawntimer with a command in cfg? people who dont want it can switch it off, people who want it can switch it on^^ for me it also doenst have to be beautiful just a small time running down on the topright for example^^ thats all, i think this doenst need dat crazy programming skillz^^[/QUOTE]
I push for that! add the small time in option, everybody will be happy, people who want it and people who don’t.
Humate
(Humate)
#52
Yes, we definitely want to improve the post-death section somewhat (better info, some POV control). Speccing from other player’s POV at that point might be tough, when incapped you do want to be able to see incoming Medic revives etc before they happen, but maybe after gib it is an option.
On gib, pov control would be pretty nice.
Good to see its being considered, I had requested this a while back 
<3
nailzor
(nailzor)
#53
Right, if you are gibbed or have released from corpse then the option to switch between alive teammates would be nice. If no teammates are alive you can not leave the view of your corpse however would be a good restriction.
Then a bit more in depth would be if say 1 teammate is alive and you are spectating his view, he dies and you are stuck on his body - etc. With forced spawn waves (none of this spawn whenever you want stuff) it would be easier to program.
Hundopercent
(Hundopercent)
#54
[QUOTE=Samurai.;463088]I really do feel like the impact of spawn-waves and displaying/using the spawn timer has been massively undermined in it’s effectiveness and importance to this game. It provides organization within the team, intelligent thought process and decision making throughout a game and not to mention it is a necessity for the eSport side of DB.
For those of you who have played comp in the previous games, you will agree that it is essential to know and respond to the spawn wave system, this is one of the most useful and biggest pieces of information you use in a competitive match, pretty much every decision you make revolves around that timer. I just can’t see a long lasting competitive DB without it at all.[/QUOTE]
The spawn timer isn’t as big of an issue as an actual wave. That’s the critical point that needs to be addressed. If they don’t give us timers we’ll just make macros/configs. It’s not like we haven’t done it before. Most important is the wave or whatever system planned. Current system is actually against teamwork which is silly in a team based game.
Hundopercent
(Hundopercent)
#55
[QUOTE=ImageOmega;463139]Quick thought on post death info (I have actually posted this before):
Have the ability to display an info box that shows extra information regarding your last death. This box would include amount done by each enemy to you including shot location. And, how much damage you’ve done to each enemy would be a nice perk. Basically what death ghosts were before the updated versions in a friendly, aesthetically pleasing UI box. Very much an idea from Smite (and Rocket Arena 3).[/QUOTE]
This would be nice. I hate it when I lay into a guy and it feels like I should have killed him but then I die to the back/side and I have no clue what the health is of the target I was shooting at. It would also give us something to relay over chat “X target is at 4%” etc etc.
Anti
(Anti)
#56
Suggestions we’ve had for kill info internally include showing assist damage that contributed to your death as well as allowing you to swap the camera POV between your corpse, your death ghost and the kill ghost. Those would hopefully help fill the death time quite well.
I guess we could maybe (assuming there are no code issues) try doing a first person spec POV of teammates should your corpse be gibbed, but changing POV for what is likely to be a short period, and still showing death info, well the whole thing could start to become a lumpy usability and UI nightmare
nailzor
(nailzor)
#57
I kind of like being in the dark regarding the opposing team - relating to spawn time (and even class/hp). I think it should be the homework of one team to figure out the spawn time of the enemy team to plan their strat and pushes accordingly. IE: You know the enemy team spawns at 15:00, so you plan your push to engage at 14:59 giving anyone that dies the longest spawn possible.
I wish that when you died you had no idea how much HP the person killed you with is left with, that is kinda a common entity in many FPS games in my mind and leaves a good amount of mystery as well. Take a dueling game like Quake, Unreal Tournament, Painkiller, etc - there are sounds or distinguishing characteristics that can signal to you that the enemy is getting weak. In Quake it is the enemy sounds when you hit them, in a game like RtCW/ET it would be the graphic of their helmut being knocked off initially.
Perhaps a bit off topic at this point, but somewhat related to spawn times as well… One team should not be able to see what classes the enemy are from pressing Tab for scoreboard. One team should not be able to see who is dead from the same scoreboard or from GUI of characters at top of screen currently either. I don’t have to keep track of if people are dead or not on the other team, I simply glance to the top of my screen and can gauge how aggressive/defensive I need to play taking everything into account - especially the healthbars.
Does not leave much room for being sneaky with classes or HP - let alone it signals the other team when you spawn so they know where to look.
Kl3ppy
(Kl3ppy)
#58
[QUOTE=nailzor;463247]I kind of like being in the dark regarding the opposing team - relating to spawn time (and even class/hp). I think it should be the homework of one team to figure out the spawn time of the enemy team to plan their strat and pushes accordingly. IE: You know the enemy team spawns at 15:00, so you plan your push to engage at 14:59 giving anyone that dies the longest spawn possible.
[/QUOTE]
I want this too, it gives another tactical option.
Jonny_Hex
(Jonny_Hex)
#59
We’re adding more detailed death info to the UI, which will include the current killer info, along with a simple breakdown of the ‘assisters’ (is that even a word?). Further iterations will break it down to include hit-locations and percentile enemy damage contributions. Dying should be an informative learning experience IMO.
Spawn wave timer for your own team will be added to the HUD very soon, near to the round time clock. ‘Next spawn wave in [##]s’. And probably a bar filling behind or beneath. I might post a couple of UI concepts (when I’m not on a mobile device).
Mustang
(Mustang)
#60
No way, I really like to know, that way I know if I’m getting any better and if they’re low then I don’t feel so bad knowing it was a close fight and I might come off on top next time.
It helps to get a feeling for how the balance of different weapons is also and is a nice compromise to not showing the enemy health bar permanently.