SPAWN AREAS

GoblinZeroIce · 2004-08-06 08:31:24 UTC

I dont kno if it has been covered for i am lazy, so im gonna ask here. Can anyone give me a complete guide on spawn points, dos and donts, and the scripting, and whta i need to put in for my map to be tested, i have been experimenting with the editor and i cannot get a simple thing to work, i have great mapping skillz and i think my map is really awsome, i just cant get spawn points to work. PLZ HELP! im really frustaighted

SoulRebel · 2004-08-06 11:32:24 UTC

i hope i can explain…

first you need to know which entities a spawn needs and the script do enable the spawn ingame

and the script:

game_manager
{
	spawn
	{
...

//<team (1=Allies, 0=Axis)> 
		// Set start spawnpoints
		wait 500
		setautospawn "Allied Spawn" 1
		setautospawn "Axis Spawn" 0
		//setautospawn "Flag" 0
....
	}
}
// ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
// ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
flag_spawns 
{ 
   spawn 
   { 
   } 
} 

flag_wobj 
{ 
   spawn 
   { 
   } 
} 

flag_flag
{ 
   spawn 
   { 
      accum 0 set 0   // Who has the flag: 0-Axis, 1-Allied 
   } 

   trigger allied_capture 
   { 
      accum 0 abort_if_equal 1 // do Allies own flag? 

      trigger game_manager flag_flagblue 

      setstate flag_spawns default 
      setstate flag_wobj default 
      alertentity flag_wobj 
      alertentity flag_spawns 
      setautospawn "Flag" 1
      setautospawn "Axis Spawn" 0 
      accum 0 set 1
   } 

   trigger axis_capture 
   { 
        accum 0 abort_if_equal 0 // do Axis own flag? 

        trigger game_manager flag_flagred 

	setstate flag_spawns default 
	setstate flag_wobj default 
	alertentity flag_wobj 
	alertentity flag_spawns 
	setautospawn "Flag" 0
	setautospawn "Allied Spawn" 1
	accum 0 set 0
   } 
}

in the gamemanager you set the default spawnpoint of your map:
(remember <team (1=Allies, 0=Axis)> )

setautospawn "Allied Spawn" 1
setautospawn "Axis Spawn" 0

these are just some “team_CTF_bluespawn” and a “team_WOLF_objective” called “description: Allied Spawn”
(i think its case-sensitive)
and on the other side the axis have a “team_WOLF_objective” called “description: Axis Spawn”

the difference to a “flag-span” is the “team_WOLF_checkpoint” entity.
this entity toggles when is touched


...
trigger axis_capture 
   { 
        accum 0 abort_if_equal 0 // do Axis own flag? 

        trigger game_manager flag_flagred 

	setstate flag_spawns default 
	setstate flag_wobj default 
	alertentity flag_wobj 
	alertentity flag_spawns 
	setautospawn "Flag" 0
	setautospawn "Allied Spawn" 1
	accum 0 set 0
   }
...

short, in the line you set the new default spawn:
setautospawn “Flag” 0 -> 0 =Axis
setautospawn “Allied Spawn” 1 -> 1 = Allied

lg…gerald

(i’m not a native speaker, so i hope my english can be understood)

GoblinZeroIce · 2004-08-06 15:38:57 UTC

how do i do single start areas?

GoblinZeroIce · 2004-08-06 15:57:48 UTC

now i have a new problem, when i go in game it gets to the load screen, then leaves and says “REload something, SUPER.bsp not founf in etmain/maps” but its there, and i only hit compile once, what to do?

nUllSkillZ · 2004-08-06 16:53:14 UTC

Do you mean with “single start areas” non captural spawn points?

If so all you need are “team_CTF_redspawn” 's, “team_CTF_bluespawn” 's and for each team a “team_WOLF_objective”.
You will need a “team_CTF_xspawn” for each player.
So if you want to do a 6 vs 6 map add 6 “team_CTF_redspawn” 's and 6 “team_CTF_bluespawn” 's.

You can manage the spawn direction by typing N while a “team_CTF_xspawn” is selected
And then choosing one of the No.'s 0, 45, 90, …
Choose “invulnerable” and “startactive” (has to be done for each “tema_CTF_xspawn”).

Then you have to add a “team_WOLF_objective” entity to each spawn area.
Choose “default_axis” for the “team_WOLF_objective” near the “team_CTF_redspawn” 's and “default_allies” for the “team_WOLF_objective” near the “team_CTF_bluespawn”.
Add the following key / value pair:
key: description
value: Axis Spawn or Allied Spawn

The value of the description key is up to you.

Orange · 2004-08-06 18:35:24 UTC

team_CTF_xspawn for each player? are you sure about this?
I’ve read that if you’ll place a team_WOLF_objective near two or more spawn points it will select a spawn point each team and spawn the player there, but I’ve never heared that you need to have a spawn for each player…

SCDS_reyalP · 2004-08-06 22:00:49 UTC

Yes, bad things will happen if there are less acive spawnpoints than there are players.

GoblinZeroIce · 2004-08-07 05:15:28 UTC

i have a new error after i did the spawns RE_LOAD"i dunno rest" then “couldnt find Test.bsp” but all files are in right directory, what to do?

Malverik · 2004-08-07 20:56:23 UTC

Do you mean with “single start areas” non captural spawn points?

If so all you need are “team_CTF_redspawn” 's, “team_CTF_bluespawn” 's and for each team a “team_WOLF_objective”.
You will need a “team_CTF_xspawn” for each player.
So if you want to do a 6 vs 6 map add 6 “team_CTF_redspawn” 's and 6 “team_CTF_bluespawn” 's.

You can manage the spawn direction by typing N while a “team_CTF_xspawn” is selected
And then choosing one of the No.'s 0, 45, 90, …
Choose “invulnerable” and “startactive” (has to be done for each “tema_CTF_xspawn”).

Then you have to add a “team_WOLF_objective” entity to each spawn area.
Choose “default_axis” for the “team_WOLF_objective” near the “team_CTF_redspawn” 's and “default_allies” for the “team_WOLF_objective” near the “team_CTF_bluespawn”.
Add the following key / value pair:
key: description
value: Axis Spawn or Allied Spawn

The value of the description key is up to you.

how does that work? how can the team_WOLF_objective know what it is the team_CTF_xspawns around it that must be used? Does it work by proximity?

G0-Gerbil · 2004-08-08 23:56:00 UTC

Yeah it does work by proximity. You just have to make sure that if spawnpoints are toggleable you toggle the team_WOLF_objective in the same way at the same time, otherwise you’ll have people clicking on a flag and the game having to choose from spawn points miles away which gets very confusing.

The main issue with spawnpoints, and something that REALLY pisses me off, is, bar console / binds, once you’ve manually selected a spawn location, you can’t revert to default. This is a huge issue on maps with multiple spawn points to choose from that also have new ones that spring up later (eg battery, you select the east beach and then the flag is captured - you still spawn on the beach).

Malverik · 2004-08-09 03:00:20 UTC

The main issue with spawnpoints, and something that REALLY pisses me off, is, bar console / binds, once you’ve manually selected a spawn location, you can’t revert to default. This is a huge issue on maps with multiple spawn points to choose from that also have new ones that spring up later (eg battery, you select the east beach and then the flag is captured - you still spawn on the beach).

The game designers probably thought about that too. Unless there was a button “Go with Default Spawn” there is no way you can know if the player wants to force a spawn or go with the flow.
Just tought of something, if on battery you decide to spawn on east beach, then when your team captures the bunker you select it as spawn. If your team looses the bunker, do you fall back into following the default spawns (west beach)? Maybe there is some crazy scripting and entity workaround so that when a player clicks on a flag on your map he goes to default spawn! A man can dream…

G0-Gerbil · 2004-08-09 05:42:46 UTC

Nah, if you have west bunker selected and it’s lost, the game will simply try to spawn you as close to it as possible. In this case, it’s probably the east beach, but I do have an issue in Helmsdeep where if you’ve clicked your axis spawn to the caves compost and it’s lost, if enough people respawn all at once you can be forced into the south valley because it’s technically closer than the fort spawns. Pisser.

I seem to recall I played on some mod where if you clicked on a flag, the first click set it as your spawn, and a second click would reset you to default spawns, but sometimes I think I imagine things

And there should have been a damn ‘use default spawn’ button, huge issue, even on the official maps - take radar. Allies select side spawn and it’s lost, and you can be forced to spawn in the start place rather than forward bunker. Again, closer as the crow flies, but further as the solider sprints!

SCDS_reyalP · 2004-08-09 09:05:19 UTC

bind x setspawnpt 0

How hard is it ?

G0-Gerbil · 2004-08-09 14:11:28 UTC

Not hard for someone who knows.
How many people who play ET even know what a bind is?
There’s a large number of players and servers who haven’t even patched yet and it’s virtually unplayable without it.
Ignorance is everywhere in ET, and the only saving grace is that many of the people who won’t know about this kind of stuff probably won’t even know you CAN set your spawnpoint.

But my point is simply that game developers should NEVER make players have to resort to things like binds for essential in-game activities.
I mean, imagine if they’d forced you to have to use binds to change class. Wouldn’t that seem incredibly thoughtless? Well, I see no different.
Don’t forget RTCW had this functionality, it was actively (and presumably deliberately) removed.

_UBC_McNite · 2004-08-09 14:27:52 UTC

@ goblin: nothing personal goblin but i think ppl with questions like yours shouldn’t get any answer cuz its obvious they d prefer others to do their map completely…

@ spawns: Well its actually pretty easy to force spawns as the game goes on… you only need some lines like this:

setstate “spawnbox2_wobj” default
setstate “spawnbox2” default (these 2 need a setstate invisible at their spawn)

setautospawn “spawnname2” 1 (for allies)

setstate “spawnbox1_wobj” invisible
setstate “spawnbox1” invisible (now the flag disappears and spawning is impossible there)

So for battery you’d need this:

flagcaptured_allied (i think the command is wrong but i m at work so i can’t look it up properly, but you know what i mean)

setautospawn flag
setstate "beachspawn_wobj" invisible (for both of them of course)
setstate "beachspawn" invisible

flagcaptured_axis

setstate "beachspawn_wobj" default
setstate "beachspawn" default (makes them visible again)
setautospawn "beachspawnname"

The problem is (and this might be y u DON’T have forced spawns on beach) when a cov gets kinky with axis pants you need the beach spawn at the path up to the command post for a respawn with some players… going all the distance from the bunkerflag would make a fast change of tactics and a rush at back door impossible… so forced spawns can only be recommended when they don’t narrow your choice of tactics.

@ Gerbil: I couldn’t do a remake of mp_TheRiver without forced spawns… costed me 3 days and a lot of hair to work this out. Now it works fine in my map… wanna have a look at it?
edit: YEA my first serious contribution to this forum

G0-Gerbil · 2004-08-09 14:43:56 UTC

Erm, thanks, I kinda didn’t need a spawn scripting refresher
We all know you can use autospawns, and that’s the problem - once you’ve stopped using them bar a bind there’s no way of getting back to them.

If you are referring to simply never having alternate spawns, then you don’t need to use autospawn, just toggle the darned spawnpoints themselves and you have no option but to spawn properly. In fact, you could probably remove the team_WOLF_objectives too.
But limiting spawns in this way is a pretty damn tough way around the issue. Imagine Battery, Radar, Railgun etc without alternative spawns, they’d have been a joke. It’s a feature that’s semi-crippled to many players out there - to the point that I am indeed thinking long and hard about removing many instances of alternative spawn choices in my maps.

_UBC_McNite · 2004-08-09 14:53:59 UTC

@ semi-crippling players… uhm well if they can’t work out how to use a command map by clicking on flags… no comment I played pretty well for a year without using a spawnscript (won’t miss it now that i made one for my needs)

I don’t see your point now:
When u have forward spawn that need some forcing (radar: road bunker) u use setautospawn, and that s fine.
If you build up the command post and spawn there before flag is taken/secured, and the command post is destroyed, you spawn back at the house even when the flag is up. That’s BS, right, but you could easily go around that with the method I just mentioned.

For everything else where you want alternate spawnpoints and you want to keep them open, there is no use for a forced spawn because you want to keep it open and let the players decide where they spawn (eg Battery, Railgun etc).

Lets just say with opening the game to more intricate tactics around spawning it becomes… uhm tricky for the beginner (and the will-ever-stay-noob’s)

edit: yea maybe i was a bit over-enthusiastic with the scripting above :bump:

Malverik · 2004-08-09 15:14:11 UTC

When u have forward spawn that need some forcing (radar: road bunker) u use setautospawn, and that s fine.
If you build up the command post and spawn there before flag is taken/secured, and the command post is destroyed, you spawn back at the house even when the flag is up. That’s BS, right, but you could easily go around that with the method I just mentioned.

For everything else where you want alternate spawnpoints and you want to keep them open, there is no use for a forced spawn because you want to keep it open and let the players decide where they spawn (eg Battery, Railgun etc).

Lets just say with opening the game to more intricate tactics around spawning it becomes… uhm tricky for the beginner (and the will-ever-stay-noob’s)

Somehow I see how this can make sense, but that only applies to Radar because the initial spawn has pretty much no advantages over the other spawns. If you look at it from the other way, if you set your spawn to the forwaerd bunker u captured, if the command post is built and the axis capture the bunker afterward, you cant decide force the player to spawn at the villa or at the cp because you dont know if he wants to go for obj or get the bunker back.
Also, I dont know if you tried the maps like 1944_beach and 1944_huertzgen where there are spawn points you cant go back to, but its pretty annoying!

_UBC_McNite · 2004-08-09 15:23:59 UTC

On Radar all I would change is: if the road bunker is secured, the spawn in the villa should be disabled.
On all the other standard-maps you don’t need anything like this.

Caen is an example where the spawn should be forced and a recapturable flag is a mistake imo… after the tank is repaired or over the bridge it should be impossible for axis to recapture the flag. But its no map where you need to choose spawns manually for tactics.

Venice_rc2 is a bit messy with the spawns… but with good players in your team u can use the flags to your advantage, so I wouldnt trade less flexibility for a forced spawn so beginners and noobs spawn right. (Now that I wrote it: on maps like venice there is no “right” imo)

G0-Gerbil · 2004-08-09 15:47:09 UTC

That’s BS, right, but you could easily go around that with the method I just mentioned.
How? The only methods mentioned so far are either using binds (about as non-n00b-friendly as it gets) or setting the autospawn (which won’t work) or disabling the initial spawns (not a good idea, spawncamping is rather prevelant in ET and alternative spawns are nice).

Basically, the system is crap, and none of you lot will convince me otherwise, because it IS broken by not being able to do it within the limbo screen, only by bind. You can’t have the desired effect through scripting if you intend to have alternative spawns and new ones created further on in a map.

Of course, the other point is: ‘Why am I complaining?’ It is how it is and it ain’t gonna change Just wanted to let off steam about it really, only reason I carried on is because people say there are easy workarounds, but they are wrong. 1 line of text might be simple when shown, but you need to know to look for it and what to do with it in the first place - THAT’S the n00b issue that renders a bind virtually useless