Somehow I feel that loadouts..

(GatoCommodore) #21

@Sairdontis said:
@GatoCommodore I agree with your many points though I won’t assume that SD will simply remove every loadout someone complains about. Remember they are free of Nexon now and have more flexability creatively.

Human nature also requires there to be a “best” though this is often (99.9%) simply opinion and a construct of of perception. “Best” is the person who takes what they have and still managing to come out on top. All the “best” mentality does for loadouts is gives a excuse to bring down (or attempt to) another player for not playing your opinion of what is best.

Loadouts unlike mercs in this game are numerous and allow for different playstyles and in this we agree. I do not think that the game will breakdown to where we are all playing the same merc with the same guns as this would remove a major marketing point for SD to promote the game and remove many players who would not enjoy this game (This is not a Blizzard game afterall ).

The main approach that would work the most would be for players to quite issuing the “best” loadouts as the only way to play the game. Understandable for a team wanting to have a balance of merc types, but please allow a player to have their own creativity to chose their own loadouts.

currently on Gen 2 SD printed out only the best loadouts

it would be great tho if the customization reverts back to the main design where you can costumize each weapon skin and uniforms

(OwynTyler) #22

@Sairdontis said:
The thing is that I have seen many destroy people with a basic loadout (what you get with the purchase of a merc with no augments and the basic weapons for that merc) so obviously these “superior” loadouts are not required for victory.

“hurr durr people can kill other people with kitchen knives, why would you need AGM-176 Griffin, lightweight precision-guided munition, Air-to-ground missiles”

OP, are you OK?

(Szakalot) #23

@GatoCommodore double time is a very potent loadout, especially for hit-n-run mercs like phoenix,aura,phantom

(Sairdontis) #24

@OwynTyler I am sorry that you need a special loadout to win. And yes I am fine, thank you for asking.

(GatoCommodore) #25

@Szakalot said:
@GatoCommodore double time is a very potent loadout, especially for hit-n-run mercs like phoenix,aura,phantom

yea i used it on my Aura and proxy because speed for flanking, but i never used it on phantom or even other mercs (except kira because her katana loadout)

it feels underwhelming to me.

but like what i said earlier

currently on Gen 2 SD printed out only the best loadouts

(Noir) #26

@Sorotia said:
Some guns are just plain superior to others…if they would fix that. (Like my beloved SMG-9 is left in the dust while the Hoch got a uneeded and some say OP buff)

But still doesn’t stop me from sporting my favorite Nader loadout every now and then.

I agree with the Hochfir part. It has been buff too much. But please do NOT touch SMG-9. At least do not touch how it feels.

(watsyurdeal) #27

Only thing I would change on the SMG 9 is the fire rate and damage, if only to keep the dps the same but buff the raw damage of the gun.

(bgyoshi) #28

@hurgya said:

It really makes a difference on medics. Literally every supportive augment makes a noticable difference. It seems, the Devs thought “Support abilities won’t bother anybody, let’s make them even more OP” . Not like I’m sad about this as a Medic main.

As an old timey “played every medic a ton been there done that” medic main both with and without “god tier” augments for them, I’ll have to completely disagree.

Never once in the past 18 months has a potent packs or an improved revive or unshakeable Aura ever improved my game play or made it harder for me to take down other medics. You could tell me that augments don’t exist and I would believe you, because they’re effects are unnoticeable at this point.

There was a time when a less experienced me would do better with certain augments. But at this point I’ve developed enough experience that smart play, picking your battles right, and using a primary that’s comfortable is all that matters for me.

(Szakalot) #29

@bgyoshi said:

@hurgya said:

It really makes a difference on medics. Literally every supportive augment makes a noticable difference. It seems, the Devs thought “Support abilities won’t bother anybody, let’s make them even more OP” . Not like I’m sad about this as a Medic main.

As an old timey “played every medic a ton been there done that” medic main both with and without “god tier” augments for them, I’ll have to completely disagree.

Never once in the past 18 months has a potent packs or an improved revive or unshakeable Aura ever improved my game play or made it harder for me to take down other medics. You could tell me that augments don’t exist and I would believe you, because they’re effects are unnoticeable at this point.

There was a time when a less experienced me would do better with certain augments. But at this point I’ve developed enough experience that smart play, picking your battles right, and using a primary that’s comfortable is all that matters for me.

meh, if two teams of equal skill fight each other, the one with 30% more revive hp, faster hp regen, that one more medpack, etc. will win.

Even 1% advantage translates to a win, eventually. It cannot be argued that the aug’s don’t make a difference. The fact that you don’t notice is not a good argument, though it is testament to good game design.

(bgyoshi) #30

@Szakalot said:

meh, if two teams of equal skill fight each other, the one with 30% more revive hp, faster hp regen, that one more medpack, etc. will win.

Even 1% advantage translates to a win, eventually. It cannot be argued that the aug’s don’t make a difference. The fact that you don’t notice is not a good argument, though it is testament to good game design.

But that’s pretty much what I’m saying. Unless you’re at the very top tier of pro play, teams aren’t going to be so even in skill that the augments will make a difference. There will always be players having a bad game, players just dominantly better than everyone else, and players that are inconsistently good and bad (as is natural). Those differences have far more impact on the outcome of the match than a small buff to your med packs or revive or HP.

It’s certainly a testament to good game design, but it just makes me laugh when players talk about load out cards that are somehow better than even a default load out purely on the virtue of mixing and matching augments. Unless you’re a top tier pro, the augments aren’t going to matter.

(Szakalot) #31

the advantage is significant, whatever the skill level. Sure, top tier players will use the correct loadouts to a bigger advantage, but stuff like faster reload or explosives resistance, they all matter. Sure it is difficult to assess their significance on a super chaotic pub, but it definitely matters. A bronze team will on average win more against lead, no matter the skill tier.

(Sorotia) #32

@DefaultSettings said:

@Sorotia said:
Some guns are just plain superior to others…if they would fix that. (Like my beloved SMG-9 is left in the dust while the Hoch got a uneeded and some say OP buff)

But still doesn’t stop me from sporting my favorite Nader loadout every now and then.

I agree with the Hochfir part. It has been buff too much. But please do NOT touch SMG-9. At least do not touch how it feels.

But the SMG is just so meh right now…it is bottom or near bottom in just about every weapon statistic…she deserves a buff.

(bgyoshi) #33

@Szakalot said:
the advantage is significant, whatever the skill level. Sure, top tier players will use the correct loadouts to a bigger advantage, but stuff like faster reload or explosives resistance, they all matter. Sure it is difficult to assess their significance on a super chaotic pub, but it definitely matters. A bronze team will on average win more against lead, no matter the skill tier.

I’m willing to lay down literally $4m as a bet that a team with bronze cards and 35% accuracy will lose against the same team of default cards and 45% accuracy.

You can think of augments as like… tools. Sure, you can use the same golf clubs that a pro uses, but that won’t help you shoot a 68 if your mechanics are bad. You could give a pro golfer used clubs from a shooting range and they would still beat you hands down.

(BloodySin) #34

Except this isn’t a game for the “elite.” Not if Splash Damage expects it to grow, at least. It’s a game for as much of the “masses” as it can bring in, a game for regular people to have fun playing. Using extreme examples is irrelevant, since they aren’t the base line you use for overall balance or for what’s useful. Otherwise they might re-brand it to Dirty Elitists already.

(Your worst knifemare.) #35

A wise man once said “Augments never guarentee victory, but they do help.”

(Szakalot) #36

sure, 45 vs 35 is a huge difference. I was referring to same skill tiers so 25 vs 25, or 35vs35 etc

(Noir) #37

@Sorotia said:

@DefaultSettings said:

@Sorotia said:
Some guns are just plain superior to others…if they would fix that. (Like my beloved SMG-9 is left in the dust while the Hoch got a uneeded and some say OP buff)

But still doesn’t stop me from sporting my favorite Nader loadout every now and then.

I agree with the Hochfir part. It has been buff too much. But please do NOT touch SMG-9. At least do not touch how it feels.

But the SMG is just so meh right now…it is bottom or near bottom in just about every weapon statistic…she deserves a buff.

Yes, I know. Still, it’s the one I perform better cause it’s SO accurate.

(GatoCommodore) #38

@DefaultSettings said:

@Sorotia said:

@DefaultSettings said:

@Sorotia said:
Some guns are just plain superior to others…if they would fix that. (Like my beloved SMG-9 is left in the dust while the Hoch got a uneeded and some say OP buff)

But still doesn’t stop me from sporting my favorite Nader loadout every now and then.

I agree with the Hochfir part. It has been buff too much. But please do NOT touch SMG-9. At least do not touch how it feels.

But the SMG is just so meh right now…it is bottom or near bottom in just about every weapon statistic…she deserves a buff.

Yes, I know. Still, it’s the one I perform better cause it’s SO accurate.

id rather use hochfir if the merc has it but sawbonez dont have hochfir so i choose SMG-9

(bgyoshi) #39

@Szakalot said:
sure, 45 vs 35 is a huge difference. I was referring to same skill tiers so 25 vs 25, or 35vs35 etc

And I’m saying there’s no such thing as 25 vs 25 or 35 vs 35. You won’t ever find perfectly balanced skill on opposing teams until you’re at the top level of play. It will always be 25 vs 35 or 15 vs 20 or 35 vs 40 etc etc etc

(Szakalot) #40

i dont see how that makes sense. there will always be disparities between the two teams, and individual skill level.
I would argue that by sheer numbers its actually a lot easier for a newbie to find someone at exactly their skill level. assuming of course skill is quantifiable, like in our %acc example