SMG-9

(GatoCommodore) #21

[quote=“Sorotia;209979”][quote=“JJMAJR;209424”]Hochfir was terrible.

Sure, it was good because it’s accurate and granted a lot of mobility, but it’s not as good as having a Blishlock. Blishlock has better burst damage and killed more dangerous targets faster than the Hochfir ever could.

Plus, it had better range, and being able to dodge shots is less important unless we are talking about taking down a sniper.

In that respect, it’s better to go Fletcher/Blishlock, Kira, or Aura/Blishlock if one doesn’t want to snipe. Blishlock has the same mobility after all.

At least with the recent buff the Hochfir could compete against the Blishlock in SMG range fights.[/quote]

“sighs”

Why do people judge everything on damage or DPS?

The Hoch has laser accuracy…if you lock on someones head and have decent control you can peg your target with headshots easy.

Yadda Yadda

[/quote]

SD please make my gold SMG-9 Bushwhacker Great Again.

(JJMAJR) #22

[spoiler][quote=“Sorotia;209979”]“sighs”

Why do people judge everything on damage or DPS?[/quote]
Because sometimes damage and DPS wins fights. Hochfir with 100% accuracy pre-buff doesn’t work against Blishlock. And it’s not because the Blishlock’s OP. It’s because the Hochfir’s only role is to allow new players to learn how to shoot heads, while the Blishlock’s niche was “weak but good augments and range”.

[quote=“Sorotia;209979”]The Hoch has laser accuracy…if you lock on someones head and have decent control you can peg your target with headshots easy.

It amazes me how some people just judge weapons by word of mouth.

Lots of people said the Blish sucks…even after changes were made…now all the sudden it’s a decent weapon…but people said it sucked…now it’s decent…and it’s been a while since it has gone through any major changes.

Just because someone told you the Hoch sucks doesn’t mean it does.

Before the change…the Hoch had it’s own…it’s own niche…now it’s just flat out superior to the SMG-9.

The Blish was a slow firing but heavy damaging
The Crot was a good all around gun
The Kek was similar to the Crot but it had a little less damage but it had faster fire rate
The SMG was accurate while slower but with decent damage
The Hoch was fast with low damage

Now the Hoch’s speed negates the SMG…its speed and accuracy both blow the SMG out of the water…

Other than damage itself the Hoch outclasses the SMG-9 in every way…from fire rate, to accuracy, reload time, and even have the same range.[/quote]
Well, I guess it would be a good idea to change the Hochfir’s reload speed to reflect its current usefulness. Especially considering the SMG-9’s position as the slowest reload speed on a low-tier SMG.

Well, that’s a statement about the SMG-9 and not the Hochfir, isn’t it?

Seriously? You seem to act like you’re a pub scrub coming from your arguments involving Proxy. You complain about the mines when there’s the fact that they have almost no use in a competitive scene other than detecting players. You seem to care more about the pub scene than competitive.[/spoiler]

I have an idea for changes to the SMG-9 so people would pick it up for its augments, especially compared to the Crotzni.

Damage: 15
Fire Delay: 0.12
Reload Speed: 1.4s

This way it’s pretty much guaranteed that the SMG-9 would have higher DPS against the Hochfir, and a shorter TTK against Sky, but wouldn’t make the Hochfir so weak that it can’t be used at all.

Heck, it’s strong enough to shred the Blishlock’s TTK against Sky, considering that it takes 0.48s for these stats vs. 0.6s for the Blishlock.

Actually, these stats are insane. The only thing that prevents the Blishlock from being garbage is the stronger TTK against merc health that isn’t a multiple of 30. It’s competitive even against the KEK-10 and the Crotz.

And I think it’s a good idea to increase the Hochfir’s reload delay to 1.9s.
I hope I don’t break the game with this suggestion, like the devs did with a suggestion for Phantom.

(Sorotia) #23

Trouble is people keep gauging weapons by DPS…well you know what…even the lowest DPS machine gun only takes but a split second to kill someone with headshots.

People say the Blish sucks because it has low DPS…well it will still kill you just about as fast as any other gun.

Problem is the SMG doesn’t have any kind of niche at all…it’s kinda like the worst of all worlds.

The Blish does more damage, almost every other one shoots faster, every other one relaods faster, and almost every other besides the blish has a equal or larger clip.

It’s just a flat out inferior gun…and instead of giving it a buff…they give the gun used mostly by the pub scrub favorite a buff.

(Dysfnal) #24

What makes the blish good is it’s upfront damage, it being the heaviest hitting and slowest firing of the smgs, on top of being the most accurate fired over time, makes it excell at quick damage, and lackluster in extended firefights (where I think the burst rifles should be, but that’s a discussion for another day)

(Sorotia) #25

The Blish has its place…but the SMG doesn’t…it just flat out under performs in any role compared to any of the other machine guns.

Just amazes me sometimes the favoritism some things are shown while some things they don’t give a damn about and will gladly nerf even if there are more powerful thing more deserving of a nerf or they will buff things that don’t need a buff as much as other things that need one more.

I swear between this and the snails-pace development…it’s like the want the game to die a slow painful death.

(BananaSlug) #26

dont say that hochfir shoudnt get nerf, it should because its ridiculous how the weapon plays

it needed improvement, but not shit like that

(Tanker_Ray) #27

It is true SMG-9 is much weaker than Crotzni, but it never means it’s trash.

SMG-9 has 2nd best bullet per spread in-game, just right beneath the MP5.

It’s accuracy and Ironsight is just pure perfect.

But it’s also true that SMG-9 has bit slower reload speed, so damn normal range of 18m, and nothing more.

Slight increase of RPM to make the gun’s DPS to 126 might be handy, but excluding another accuracy buff, I can’t think of other buffs.

(Sorotia) #28

[quote=“BananaSlug;211099”]dont say that hochfir shoudnt get nerf, it should because its ridiculous how the weapon plays

it needed improvement, but not @$!# like that[/quote]

Gotta keep the Proxy scrubs happy…

(GatoCommodore) #29

[quote=“Sorotia;212897”][quote=“BananaSlug;211099”]dont say that hochfir shoudnt get nerf, it should because its ridiculous how the weapon plays

it needed improvement, but not @$!# like that[/quote]

Gotta keep the Proxy scrubs happy…[/quote]

Hurr i cant kill thunder fast enough with hochfir! Hurr!

thats basically scrubs writing feedback. Saw some of my friends write like that.

(JJMAJR) #30

Can we please stop saying “Hochfir OP because SMG-9 is useless now”?

I mean with the Hochfir being the way it was before it can’t even compete against the blishlock in the former’s ideal range. The blishlock, which is supposed to be “worse stats for good perks” ends up out-performing the Hochfir in close range. Do you really think that’s a good thing?

If you want to nerf something, try reload/weapon-swap speed or something.

Please stop derailing the thread by redirecting us to a picture of Proxy’s bo obs. They’re too small.

(GatoCommodore) #31

[quote=“JJMAJR;212997”]Can we please stop saying “Hochfir OP because SMG-9 is useless now”?

I mean with the Hochfir being the way it was before it can’t even compete against the blishlock in the former’s ideal range. The blishlock, which is supposed to be “worse stats for good perks” ends up out-performing the Hochfir in close range. Do you really think that’s a good thing?

If you want to nerf something, try reload/weapon-swap speed or something.

Please stop derailing the thread by redirecting us to a picture of Proxy’s bo obs. They’re too small.[/quote]

Blish was more of a more aiming better agument gun.

but we can see in the Phoenix that hes having the best augemnt in hochfir loadout.

sooo…

(JJMAJR) #32

And Phoenix’s augment-heavy build got nerfed recently compared to his other cards.
Nader with the Hochfir before couldn’t pull weight against Fletcher with the Blishlock despite both weapons being of the same tier and Nader having 10 more HP.

The same applies to the SMG-9.

(GatoCommodore) #33

[quote=“JJMAJR;213028”]And Phoenix’s augment-heavy build got nerfed recently compared to his other cards.
Nader with the Hochfir before couldn’t pull weight against Fletcher with the Blishlock despite both weapons being of the same tier and Nader having 10 more HP.

The same applies to the SMG-9.[/quote]

the potent packs+extra area are still there…
which one was the nerfed one?

(JJMAJR) #34

[quote=“sweetColumn;213045”][quote=“JJMAJR;213028”]And Phoenix’s augment-heavy build got nerfed recently compared to his other cards.
Nader with the Hochfir before couldn’t pull weight against Fletcher with the Blishlock despite both weapons being of the same tier and Nader having 10 more HP.

The same applies to the SMG-9.[/quote]

the potent packs+extra area are still there…
which one was the nerfed one?[/quote]

Potent packs + Healing reach?
If you really think that’s the good one you’re tripping. I was talking Potent packs + Extra supplies.

Nonetheless Potent packs received a nerf, so it’s not as effective as before. I think Phoenix himself was buffed too so his healing stayed close to the same on that build but everything else isn’t so bad.

(Sorotia) #35

[quote=“JJMAJR;212997”]Can we please stop saying “Hochfir OP because SMG-9 is useless now”?

I mean with the Hochfir being the way it was before it can’t even compete against the blishlock in the former’s ideal range. The blishlock, which is supposed to be “worse stats for good perks” ends up out-performing the Hochfir in close range. Do you really think that’s a good thing?

If you want to nerf something, try reload/weapon-swap speed or something.

Please stop derailing the thread by redirecting us to a picture of Proxy’s bo obs. They’re too small.[/quote]

Maybe it doesn’t need to dominate all of the other machine guns? Because you know…Proxy doesn’t have mines to fall back on…Nader doesn’t have her grenade gun…right?

(Sorotia) #36

[quote=“JJMAJR;213028”]And Phoenix’s augment-heavy build got nerfed recently compared to his other cards.
Nader with the Hochfir before couldn’t pull weight against Fletcher with the Blishlock despite both weapons being of the same tier and Nader having 10 more HP.

The same applies to the SMG-9.[/quote]

Oh wow…yeah you’re right…how could I not see it?

Because one gun in one scenario couldn’t win…means the gun needed a big buff! Man do I feel foolish…talk about egg on my face! :confused:

Who gives a damn if she couldn’t win in one scenario? That justifies the gun being OP?

(JJMAJR) #37

The mines are easily avoided if you have half a brain, a spotter, and good ping. All three should be present in the competitive scene so Proxy’s not some dominating POS that needs nerfing.

And Nader? She’s an assault and can’t kill shit with the Hoch in her hands before.

[quote=“Sorotia;213702”]Oh wow…yeah you’re right…how could I not see it?

Because one gun in one scenario couldn’t win…means the gun needed a big buff! Man do I feel foolish…talk about egg on my face! :confused:

Who gives a damn if she couldn’t win in one scenario? That justifies the gun being OP?[/quote]
Who has the Hochfir by the way?
Phoenix, Nader, and Proxy.
Who has the Blishlock?
Bushwhacker, Aura, Sawbonez, Fletcher, and Phantom.
What examples could I give that shows Blishlock > Hochfir without appearing biased?

I used Nader as an example here for a reason. Phantom, Bushwhacker, and Sawbonez would have a similar result as Fletcher.

Get your head out of your ass.

(GatoCommodore) #38

Blish is assault rifle tier class IMO.

(Sorotia) #39

The mines are easily avoided if you have half a brain, a spotter, and good ping. All three should be present in the competitive scene so Proxy’s not some dominating POS that needs nerfing.

And Nader? She’s an assault and can’t kill @$!# with the Hoch in her hands before.

[quote=“Sorotia;213702”]Oh wow…yeah you’re right…how could I not see it?

Because one gun in one scenario couldn’t win…means the gun needed a big buff! Man do I feel foolish…talk about egg on my face! :confused:

Who gives a damn if she couldn’t win in one scenario? That justifies the gun being OP?[/quote]
Who has the Hochfir by the way?
Phoenix, Nader, and Proxy.
Who has the Blishlock?
Bushwhacker, Aura, Sawbonez, Fletcher, and Phantom.
What examples could I give that shows Blishlock > Hochfir without appearing biased?

I used Nader as an example here for a reason. Phantom, Bushwhacker, and Sawbonez would have a similar result as Fletcher.

Get your head out of your ass.[/quote]

Yeah and? Who actually uses the Blishlock often? Aura and Fletcher…because it’s the only alternative to shotgun.

I almost never see Bush, Saw, or Phantom with it…Bush usually has the Kek, Saw the Crotch, and Phantom the Kek or Crotch. People don’t like the Blish so don’t go and pretend like all 5 of those mercs are always running around with it.

You know you can do more with a mine then just lay it down and hope someone trips over it…you can actually aim your grenade gun at people instead of just firing wildly in a panic.

But I guess that is to much to ask from pub scrubs like you who need their gun to be OP to get kills…

(JJMAJR) #40

I use the Blishlock on a regular basis, and I don’t pretend it’s good or played all the time.

I however would say that the Blishlock was better than the Hochfir before the buff.

Don’t pub scrubs like you complain about Proxy rushes and pizza toss bombs?

Or Stoker molotovs, how about that?

The Proxy mine is pretty much a Stoker molotov, and they’re both countered the same way. At least Stoker denies an area. Proxy just has damage.