I sort of figured that the majority of feedback would eventually start to call for faster time-to-kills. It’s what people are currently used to and feel comfortable with. Unfortunately, a lot of us are here because we don’t like that sort of thing. Not saying either group is right or wrong, but some people are going to be disappointed.
I like long TTK because it doesn’t punish players as much for running around the corner where someone is waiting, and the longer the TTK, the bigger the chance that the more skilled-player will win. It also promotes teamwork better, since there are less quick deaths disrupting coordination. And it just feels better to me. Quick deaths make me feel like the gameflow is never able to build any rhythm, and random chance is more important than team coordination.
Reaction thus far
+1 for first impressions, as the game progresses it will be key that people continue to provide their initial thoughts.
As far as the damage goes, I agree headshots need to be increased.
The playerbase of SD’s previous games; ET, ETQW and Brink. The community, a lot of which has been playing SD’s FPS’ for up to ten years (and FPS’ in up to twenty years or more.)
I played ET and Brink Runeforce, if you check this Enemy Territory clip you will see what increased damage looks like:
I agree with Evil-Doer.
I’m confused, so your agreeing with me, the damage is to low? Because every game in the past had more damage than this one.
We had increased damage early in the pre-alpha with more general damage and more headshot damage. You were largely powerless and unable to fight back against opponents with a tactical edge. It was who sees first, gets the kill guaranteed! A lot of tweaking went into the damage model already, and it went from that to its current form.
A point of the reduced damage is to put a higher emphasis on movement (as a skill). And moving (esp. direct duelling) targets are harder to hit, putting even more emphasis again on aiming. So it’s about aiming and moving together, not just aiming. (And then you have spread which is about howand when you should move and time your shots.) It really substracts nothing, just adds to what the game is about.
[QUOTE=tangoliber;426734]I sort of figured that the majority of feedback would eventually start to call for faster time-to-kills. It’s what people are currently used to and feel comfortable with. Unfortunately, a lot of us are here because we don’t like that sort of thing. Not saying either group is right or wrong, but some people are going to be disappointed.
I like long TTK because it doesn’t punish players as much for running around the corner where someone is waiting, and the longer the TTK, the bigger the chance that the more skilled-player will win. It also promotes teamwork better, since there are less quick deaths disrupting coordination. And it just feels better to me. Quick deaths make me feel like the gameflow is never able to build any rhythm, and random chance is more important than team coordination.[/QUOTE]
+1
Massive fan of long TTK’s, as Anti said you get to develop stories in firefights.
However the current accelerated creep is annoying, so like INF3RN0 I’d like to see creep reduced, or started later, or a combination of both.
There is also the issue that spread whilst strafing is stupidly high.
People aren’t asking for 1 head shot kills or anything though. 4 head shots is too much.
I would pick an increase in sideways/backwards movement speed, reduce the spread, and reduce head shot amount to 3 per kill and maybe body shots down 1 or 2.
The biggest problem for me isn´t to win the 1v1 fights im able to win nearly every one of them but if you have to fight against 2 or 3 enemys its just impossible. You can maybe kill the second one using your secondary weapon but the 3rd one will kill you for sure, even if you are better than him. And that sucks!
i dont see how upping the damages and reducing the RoF would kill any long TTK ?
I mean, it’s two linear parameters, up one and lower the second and you still get the same TTK, except its even more focused on tracking abilities and less on spray and pray, isnt that what we want?
Twitch shot will be rewarded if you can precisely aim at the head quickly when you see an enemy, this first bullet you land can give you an advantage, tracking will be rewarded because 1) if the enemy has better tracking than you he can still manage to take you down in 3 bullets even if you landed the first on his head and 2) because you’ll be able to kill more people per clip as the clip will last longer.
I dont know, for those who know me I’m NOT AT ALL a CoD fan, but still, here it’s like I’m shooting icecream out of my gun, the general feeling of the game is good, pace is good, but the inability to kill is frustrating (yeah yeah I’m not a super duper shot I know, but I can still hold my own and I know how to aim most of the time, but killing should feel more in sync with the pace of the game, here i feel like its artificial long TTK by not rewarding the aiming, thats not how I would’ve seen this game)
Someone talked bout quake here or in another thread, in quake you have to master movement, quick shot (RG, RL prediction) and tracking (LG,PG) in order to be decent, why would DirtyBomb only focus on tracking (with high spread guns, this is somehow a paradox) and situational placement (camp a door and you can effectively kill more than one enemy, but try to break thru by playing fast and aggressive and you usually are dead meat)? Well I think we all have our ideas, but at least if a concensus isnt possible here I would like to be able to try different settings, thats what the prealpha is for IMO, and I’m pretty sure the points of the “higher dmg lower rof” people are not less valid than the others’, at least I dont see them less valid.
[QUOTE=Mustang;426794]+1
Massive fan of long TTK’s, as Anti said you get to develop stories in firefights.
However the current accelerated creep is annoying, so like INF3RN0 I’d like to see creep reduced, or started later, or a combination of both.
There is also the issue that spread whilst strafing is stupidly high.[/QUOTE]
Yea, I agree… I would like less spread/more accuracy while strafing… but more player health/or lower ROF to compensate and preserve the current TTK. I’m fine with a high headshot bonus though… 3 headshots to kill is fine with me.
Yea, losing bullets to spread is never a satisfying feeling. I like long TTK, but its better to keep the guns accurate, and ROF low/ player health high.
I do think that DB should go hardcore into one direction. When you straddle the line, then uninformed players don’t know what the game exactly is. Right now, the general internet commentary on the gameplay videos is that it looks “generic”, and that the guns have no recoil. I think they are confused by the gunplay, because it somewhat looks like what they are familiar with, but not quite. I think the game will have a better perception if it proudly announces what kind of game it is through super-accurate guns, very little strafing penalty, long TTK. That way it is clear that the game is not about realism and immersion, but skill and fun. It would be best if the design decisions regarding the style of gunplay was discussed in a developer commentary.
[QUOTE=solstrife;426695]Hello,
Recently purchased the 120$ pack. Game is very exciting, team oriented and totally up my alley. My biggest issue with the game is the amount of shots needed to kill players. I would love to see way more damage overall especially head shots and grenade damage. Has their been any thoughts to increasing damage? Again this is just my view, the game is great but slightly disheartening when someone is an accurate player and have to get multiple headshots time and time again.[/QUOTE]
frankly speaking it would only be a copy of COD as you describe it. I really like having a good burst fire for 2-3 seconds to kill, it determines who is the best at aiming. Plus if you aim right, it’s really fast to kill someone.
I really like the game as it is right now on this matter.
I fall into that category and the TTK for all of those games is faster than DB is right now. DB has one of the longest TTKs I’ve seen in a none arena game. I don’t want it to be like CoD either but when I get bored playing an FPS and switch to another for the sheer fact that I can frag more people per clip in a shorter time frame I feel their is a problem.
[QUOTE=RasteRayzeR;426893]frankly speaking it would only be a copy of COD as you describe it. I really like having a good burst fire for 2-3 seconds to kill, it determines who is the best at aiming. Plus if you aim right, it’s really fast to kill someone.
I really like the game as it is right now on this matter.[/QUOTE]
Not CoD at all. This setup could be perfect in 1v1 but imagine you vs multiple think you are going to kill a few good players very often solo before they kill you?
I love this game, it is just frustrating when you come up on multiple players barring some precise aiming and a little luck not much of a chance. There is another post with a vote, maybe we should move the convo over there
There’s also a good chance of having high rof weapons with low damage as well, but definitely striking a balance between the two when it comes to weapon variety.
ET had higher overall damage, but ETQW had about the same damage for body shots (and lower RoF), but a 2.5x multiplier for headshots. This made etqw a much more difficult game than both ET and RTCW in terms of the skill curve when it came to securing kills. In most cases anyone who wasn’t able to consistently get headshots would die 99% of the time, however the ammo clip size was quite large and the weapons were very accurate- meaning you could kill around 3 people with one clip of bodyshots vs 5-6 with headshots in one clip. This part becomes highly personal preference, but I greatly enjoyed the segregation in ETQW tracking skill rewards and the ability for a player with superb aim to wipe out an entire team under ideal circumstances of aim/engagement. In most cases however the difficulty to track and pre-fire/extended fire fights would expend a lot of ammo usually bringing the average kill streak of a strong player to around 3-4 max before being forced to reload.