Re: ATI problems (split)

(zenstar) #1

[QUOTE=ilyama999;360704]Who said that I don’t like this game ?
I LIKE THIS GAME !

But it’s unplayable because framerate sucks like I never saw …
And for graphics who sucks too …

I CANT PLAY THIS GAME that’s why my 35 euros are in my ass … :wink:

And next Splash damage game, not for me that’s sure !
Except if it’s free game :)[/QUOTE]

Your graphics issues are ATIs fault. Certain models of ATI have serious bugs with their OpenGL drivers (multiple games have had varying issues recently). Your best bet is to get on the ATI forums and tell them this.
SD can’t rewrite ATI drivers nor do they have any control over those drivers. Complaining about SD here because of an issue out of their hands is kinda unfair. Especially when a whole host of other ATI cards run the game smoothly. It sucks but I think ATI has screwed you out of you 35 euros (and possibly more if you run into any of the other games with ATI problems).

(ilyama999) #2

I’ve got a lot of games and NO ATI ISSUES !

It’s SD fault because it’s like they do the game without considering ATI owners …

They don’t test the game on ATI it’s not possible … Or they are blind…

(tokamak) #3

Okay I need more coffee.

SD can’t rewrite ATI drivers nor do they have any control over those drivers.

What they could do is test the game on ATI cards before releasing it.

(ilyama999) #4

Yes that’s why, for me, it’s completly Splash damage fault …
They dont test the game on ATI video cards, it’s a shame …

Ok ATI drivers sucks but why the other games are fine ?
Why Brink is the only game with framerate issue in my games collection ?

Splash damage doesnt care now, they sell us the game, they got our money …
That’s why the DLC will be free …
They know that nobody will buy it … So it will be free …

Splash damage sucks …

(zenstar) #5

[QUOTE=ilyama999;360726]Yes that’s why, for me, it’s completly Splash damage fault …
They dont test the game on ATI video cards, it’s a shame …

Ok ATI drivers sucks but why the other games are fine ?
Why Brink is the only game with framerate issue in my games collection ?

Splash damage doesnt care now, they sell us the game, they got our money …
That’s why the DLC will be free …
They know that nobody will buy it … So it will be free …

Splash damage sucks …[/QUOTE]

I started writing an actual reply to this but you’re obviously determined to blame SD. Go ahead and believe what you want. It’s not worth the effort.

EDIT:
@ Tok "What they could do is test the game on ATI cards before releasing it. "
Of course they tested with ATI cards. They can’t buy the entire ATI range and test every individual model from 2000 - 2011 to ensure that it’s working with every possible hardware combination. A few ATI models have an issue, not all of them and the only way their issues are going to be solved is with driver patches.

(ilyama999) #6

Yes I blame SD, dont have any problem with my ATI card except with this game …
And when SD developped the game, ATI card was already on the market no ?

And if it’s ATI fault , why SD dont try to do somethng with ATI ?
Why there is no communication from SD about this issue ?

(zenstar) #7

[QUOTE=ilyama999;360734]Yes I blame SD, dont have any problem with my ATI card except with this game …
And when SD developped the game, ATI card was already on the market no ?

And if it’s ATI fault , why SD dont try to do somethng with ATI ?
Why there is no communication from SD about this issue ?[/QUOTE]

I’ve seen issues with various games and ATI recently: Magicka tends to perform badly on ATI cards, Spiral knights had a graphics bug that was exclusive to ATI cards and there were another 2 shooters I came across while looking for something that had ATI specific issues (no I cannot recall tehir names at the moment). Magicka and Spiral Knights both got better after ATI released new drivers for their cards. And a fair number of people started getting better performance in Brink after the new drivers came out.

SD did have meetings with ATI about the issues. They said so on these forums.
SD cannot say anything else about ATI because it’s not in their control. They cannot say anything bad about ATI without risking legal issues.

You only have issues with Brink… what other games do you play (this is a rhetorical question. I don’t actually want to know)? If it’s not latest games that are pushing your drivers then that’s probably why you don’t have issues. Or maybe you’re lucky and don’t play the games that have had issues.

Yes your card was on the market when the game was in development. What does that prove? SD cannot test their game on every single card on the market. They can test a selection and then they have to trust the card manufacturers that they will have stable drivers and similar performance across their vast range of cards.

Alternately SD can buy every single combination of CPU, Motherboard, Sound card, Graphics card, hard drive, usb controller, firewire controller, SATA controller, webcam, mouse, keyboard, joystick, etc… on the market at time of development and then hire 100 technicians to constantly reconfigure all teh machines into every possible permutation and spend 3 million years testing the opening menu.

Reality is this: They did due dilligence on testing ATI cards and the manufacturer is unreliable.

But this isn’t going to convince you that maybe you’re just really unlucky. All you’re going to read out of this is “SD didn’t test with every combination of hardware” and you’ll still draw your same conclusion: “SD did this therefor SD suck”.

And since this has basically gotten to an impass I doubt I’ll be continuing the debate with you unless something really interesting surfaces or work gets extra boring today.

EDIT: Thanks for splitting this whoever did that. I didn’t mean to hijack the original thread or get so off topic.

(ilyama999) #8

All COD, battlefield, counter strike, left 4 dead, crysis 2, crysis, team fortress, gtr evo, gta IV …
No framerate issue on any games… Little issues for other things but not issue who make impossible to play like BRINK …

Ok, so if I underrstand well, this game is dead until I buy a new graphic card …

Good work splash damage … They will never see the color of my money again …

Sorry for my english

(zenstar) #9

[QUOTE=ilyama999;360743]All COD, battlefield, counter strike, left 4 dead, crysis 2, crysis, team fortress, gtr evo, gta IV …
No framerate issue on any games… Little issues for other things but not issue who make impossible to play like BRINK …

Ok, so if I underrstand well, this game is dead until I buy a new graphic card …

Good work splash damage … They will never see the color of my money again …

Sorry for my english[/QUOTE]

Most of those games are running on old engines. The source engine (for example) is an extremely forgiving engine and doesn’t use any of the latest graphics card features, especially when you don’t max out the settings. (counterstrike, left 4 dead and team fortress all use the source engine).
I know Brink is on an old engine too (idTech4) but I’m guessing there have been heavy modifications in the graphics department to handle the customization.

Little issues with some games can be laggy minefields for other games depending on what causes those issues.

If you’re lucky ATI will patch their drivers again soon. Last I heard people were not very happy with the last drivers that went out not so long ago. I hope they do sort things out. It’ll mean more people playing the game.

Your english is fine :slight_smile: . Better than some of the 1st language english speakers I’ve seen on forums.
Just look at failbook.com and you’ll see how terrible some english speakers really are -_-

(.FROST.) #10

Just jumped off the bitching train so I’ll keep this short. G-cards from 2000 hardly run this game, thats a fact everybody is willing to accept. I would assume that most of the average fps gamer has at least a g-card from around 2008 or later. And I’m absolutely not remotely an expert, but I would think it would have helped if they would have just tested g-cards with different GPUs. They wouldn’t have to test the complete line, lets say every 4*** card. That would narrow it down to only a few.

My problems, for example, were completely GPU driven. I had to reduce the GPU clock (-30mhz). Otherwise the game would freeze after 5 minutes(allways!!!). After googeling around I found out, that my GPU was overclocked by nature(g-card bios, I don’t know). You may guess it, at about 30mhz. BUT that didn’t caused trouble in ANY other game. N-E-V-E-R.

(kilL_888) #11

the other thread seems to be deleted now.

so, heres the link i want to show you. third time now…

http://www.splashdamage.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29871

the performance issues are not limited to ati cards. its a general brink problem. its a really high demanding game. core i5 and a decent card should run it properly. just like its pointed out officially in the recommended sys specs here in the forums.

(zenstar) #12

[QUOTE=.FROST.;360755]Just jumped off the bitching train so I’ll keep this short. G-cards from 2000 hardly run this game, thats a fact everybody is willing to accept. I would assume that most of the average fps gamer has at least a g-card from around 2008 or later. And I’m absolutely not remotely an expert, but I would think it would have helped if they would have just tested g-cards with different GPUs. They wouldn’t have to test the complete line, lets say every 4*** card. That would narrow it down to only a few.

My problems, for example, were completely GPU driven. I had to reduce the GPU clock (-30mhz). Otherwise the game would freeze after 5 minutes(allways!!!). After googeling around I found out, that my GPU was overclocked by nature(g-card bios, I don’t know). You may guess it, at about 30mhz. BUT that didn’t caused trouble in ANY other game. N-E-V-E-R.[/QUOTE]

Yeah… i was being overdramatic to make a point. I know cards from 2000 won’t run anything nowadays :slight_smile:

Sometimes this is why I prefer my xbox to my PC. At least I know that my xbox is fully up to spec with any game I buy for it. If only they’d support mouse and keyboard there. As it is I play my shooters on PC.

I never overclock my stuff. I just don’t trust overclocked hardware.

@kilL_888:
I’m assuming that the original issue was more than what you’re pointing out. Since I can play the game just fine on an Nvidia 9800GT on a core2 Duo. Have no idea what my framerate is but it’s smooth enough and pretty enough not to make me go fiddling for performance.
I’m sure there are some optemization issues. They heavily modded the engine and that’ll always going to cause some knockon.

(tokamak) #13

[QUOTE=zenstar;360729]@ Tok "What they could do is test the game on ATI cards before releasing it. "
Of course they tested with ATI cards. They can’t buy the entire ATI range and test every individual model from 2000 - 2011 to ensure that it’s working with every possible hardware combination. A few ATI models have an issue, not all of them and the only way their issues are going to be solved is with driver patches.[/QUOTE]
Steam tells them which are the most popular cards. The first few days were a downright disaster, it’s just ridiculous.

That’s another thing I find completely baffling! What is it about Brink that makes it so demanding? The game doesn’t look better than UT3, a four year old game and UT3 requires far less power.

(zenstar) #14

IMO it looks better than UT3 on PC. No idea about how it looks on other platforms though.

(tokamak) #15

I’m talking PC here. The polycount doesn’t seem any higher and the textures don’t seem any sharper. And it’s not like UT3 was light on the post-processing either.

Naturally both games are vastly different in style, so it’s difficult to compare them. But to me Brink is graphically equal to UT3 at best.

(kilL_888) #16

[QUOTE=tokamak;360770]
That’s another thing I find completely baffling! What is it about Brink that makes it so demanding? The game doesn’t look better than UT3, a four year old game and UT3 requires far less power.[/QUOTE]

i guess carmack gave away some alpha code again… he stated in an interview that the megatexture in idtech4, used by splash damage für etqw was more of an alpha test. same probably applies to the virtual texturing we see in brink, too?!

some of the changes made to the engine cause the problems, thats for sure.

weired thing is that if you run a /devmap and use r_skippostprocess 1, there is no performance difference. so, im sticking with the lightcount as main issue…

(.FROST.) #17

No, it wasn’t overclocked, like someone sells “professionally” pimped cards in the I-net. It was pimped out of the box from Sapphire. All of the 48** Series(4830, 4850, 4870, 4890) have the same GPU I guess, but very different GPU clocks. And Sapphire even overclocked the gpu from the suggested(Wikipedia) 750mhz up to 780mhz. And the funny thing is, Brink only runs when I reduce the clock for EXACTLY 30mhz to 750mhz.

Somehow the game knows the suggested gpu clock. I had to break the overclock seal in the catalyst in order to downgrade my card. I usually don’t play around with cpu and gpu clocks since this can get very expensive very fast. But someone in the forum gave me this hint and it worked. 10 days after the shipping of Brink I could actually play the game longer than 5 mins in a row. Since than I have only minor probs. But sometimes a very low framerate. Sec Tower is definitely the worst.

(Darksider) #18

[QUOTE=ilyama999;360718]I’ve got a lot of games and NO ATI ISSUES !

It’s SD fault because it’s like they do the game without considering ATI owners …

They don’t test the game on ATI it’s not possible … Or they are blind…[/QUOTE]

You have to remember a lot or bascially most of the games are not using OPENGL for rendering, they are using DirectX.

(tokamak) #19

Which doesn’t have these problems.

(zenstar) #20

But has it’s own downsides.
I provide some interesting reading for those who wish to broaden their horizons on DirectX vs OpenGl:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_OpenGL_and_Direct3D