Phantom all but a fun merc / lacking an identity

(Lumi) #1

First of all I’d like to say that I was on holiday for the 5 past last weeks and I’ve completely skipped the part where Phantom supposedly used to be OP. So I have no clue of how he was back then, I never got to play him as such.

As he got available in the rotation now I went ahead and tried him. Verdict: he sucks big time. I can’t figure out what the purpose of the merc is at all. He is meant to be a close quarters merc but his HP don’t allow him to take sustained fire. I mean I kept on dying time after time with just a few shots.

The shield is useless in its current state, although many people say it’s OP because it ads health to phantom. I say no. Because when the shield is on you cannot attack or you’ll lose it, going automatically to your original 110HP, worse, the shields mechanic forces you to be always second to shoot and by the time you decide to and lose your shield, as your bullets start leaving your weapon’s cannon, you already have some from your oponent hitting you. Hence in effect it might even be better to not use the shield, unless you want to go for a melee kill.

The shield should give you that extra health to cross the distance remaining between you and your enemies, wrong as they can backpedal faster than I can run after them. Finally, the shield even shuts off when using melee. Why not leave it on? That would redirect the merc to a completely melee direction and give that edge that the new melee balances have atrociously removed.

As said before I wasn’t there when he was supposedly OP, but by now everyone should know that new mercs are going to be called OP as people don’t know any counters. Just like now almost nobody falls for Nader’s martyrdom, I feel like phantom is no threat whatsoever. There is no reason for his cloak as it is so visible that to not be seen one has to be out of the enemies’ field of view. And that way I can sneak past with any merc, no need for a cloak.

In the end, I’m just sad I never witnessed the original Phantom and just realized that he’s no fun to play at all. All other mercs make me smile and I never ever got frustrated through the merc I was playing, maybe I was playing bad, or the connection sucks or that teammate didn’t do something right, but the mercs I use always provide what they intend to. Phantom just doesn’t.

(Ardez1) #2

Use phantom to flank, not to rush headfirst into an enemy. You can easily get off the first shots if you get behind them.

Focus on gunplay, not as much on melee. He is a very strong merc for exploiting the flanks of an enemy team. Use the shield as extra health when crossing open spaces, not as much for invisibility(as he is fairly visible with it active).

(ghostBase) #3

Well, he IS no fun to play at all, and his current concept is underdeveloped and ultimately broken. SD should rework or just outright remove him from the game as quick as possible.

May I advertise myself?
http://forums.dirtybomb.nexon.net/discussion/15088/phantom-the-fragile-assassin-rework-concept

(Lumi) #4

[quote=“Ardez;57232”]Use phantom to flank, not to rush headfirst into an enemy. You can easily get off the first shots if you get behind them.

Focus on gunplay, not as much on melee. He is a very strong merc for exploiting the flanks of an enemy team. Use the shield as extra health when crossing open spaces, not as much for invisibility(as he is fairly visible with it active).[/quote]

But that is my point, why flank specifically with phantom? I already flank with other mercs, that doesn’t make him special. There are also many other mercs with SMG’s to go around and with a useful ability.

And why cross open spaces if I should flank? A bit contradictory there… And if I want extra HP, I have Rhino or Fragger, no need for a situational HP increase.

My point is really just to have every merc being fun to play and besides arty (who is a reduced form of skyhammer imo) they all have their atractiveness, the katana exclusiveness of Phantom is just not my cup of tea…

(Lumi) #5

[quote=“ghostBase;57233”]Well, he IS no fun to play at all, and his current concept is underdeveloped and ultimately broken. SD should rework or just outright remove him from the game as quick as possible.

May I advertise myself?
http://forums.dirtybomb.nexon.net/discussion/15088/phantom-the-fragile-assassin-rework-concept[/quote]

What you propose in your thread could be one way to improve him indeed.

(Amerika) #6

He’s not a melee only merc. He has some of the best guns in the game. And using his cloak/shield to cross areas to head towards flanking routes + using it to get a leg up in gun fights is pretty amazing. For example, the street is locked down on Chapel. You use your cload/shield to cross and take no permanent damage while crossing (even if spotted) while heading to flank. That’s a huge advantage. Same with opening a gun fight by making them shoot first and wasting half a mag before you fire back.

I honestly can’t figure out why sooooooooooo many people are trying to treat him as if he doesn’t have guns and don’t use his shield for anything other than charging people to melee them (and then being mad when they die).

(Lumi) #7

[quote=“Amerika;57263”]He’s not a melee only merc. He has some of the best guns in the game. And using his cloak/shield to cross areas to head towards flanking routes + using it to get a leg up in gun fights is pretty amazing. For example, the street is locked down on Chapel. You use your cload/shield to cross and take no permanent damage while crossing (even if spotted) while heading to flank. That’s a huge advantage. Same with opening a gun fight by making them shoot first and wasting half a mag before you fire back.

I honestly can’t figure out why sooooooooooo many people are trying to treat him as if he doesn’t have guns and don’t use his shield for anything other than charging people to melee them (and then being mad when they die).[/quote]

I can just as well cross chapel with any other merc and not get damage and if using any merc above 110HP I can even aford to take some damage. Now how exactly is it fun to think: hey I’ll play phantom now, because I feel in a mood to have a slight edge when crossing an open space… Yeah… right… That sounds soo much like fun…

Now regarding us expecting Phantom to be a melee merc, it’s simply because he was advertised as such! Why else make him the only merc with the possibility to wield the katana? Unless the devs wanted to give him exclusivity to the most complicated to use melee weapon and hence totally not make him a melee merc.

Also, reagarding his weapons, I repeat: other mercs have the same. If I want a 110HP merc with crozny or blishlock I have plenty of other mercs to go by.

I would fin him much more fun to play if he would have no shield but a 100% invisibility that last 30s with 30sec of cooldown. This way one could quickly arrive in the enemy’s back and then start shooting or cutting. It would give a clear and fun utility to the merc. Right now he’s just as good at flanking as any other merc.

(Ardez1) #8

Two quick things.

How is the katana a hard to use melee weapon?
and
The katana is only currently exclusive to Phantom. Other mercs will be getting access to it in the future.

(Amerika) #9

How was he advertised as a melee only merc? I don’t remember that. I do remember him being advertised as a merc with a Katana and better melee than other mercs. Which he has. They also gave him a couple of the best guns in the game.

(watsyurdeal) #10

[quote=“Lumi;57242”]
But that is my point, why flank specifically with phantom? I already flank with other mercs, that doesn’t make him special. There are also many other mercs with SMG’s to go around and with a useful ability. [/quote]

Pretty much sums it up for me

I feel like if the cloak doesn’t fool try hards or competitive players, then it’s not worth using, and whatever Splash has to do to get it to that level, I’ll roll with it. I’d rather the merc be useful rather than just fun to play outside a serious environment.

(Amerika) #11

You both completely ignored the advantages I pointed out with flanking using Phantom compared to other mercs. Willfully ignoring the obvious advantages in an effort to get something buffed doesn’t work very well.

(Gi.Am) #12

I agree. The big problem is that phantom kinda lost his job. The nerf to his invisibility means that average and above players will spot you across bridge or chapel, while you travel with walk speed. Sure you get an advantage standing still but that is not much better than a skyhammer sitting in a corner (and skyhammer doesn’t make a noise doing it).
Can you go 4-1 5-1 with him sure you can, but I wager the guys that do that (and I’m not one of them). Do the same with any other merc (cause they have in general good aim/positioning) Other Mercs have an impact by using their abilites, indiscriminate of their shooting skills.

Problem with Phantom is that he is heavily advertised as melee/backstabbing closerange Merc.
He is holding the Katana in every promo art if you select his profile you get quite often a soundbit along those lines “People call me a backstabber, I can stab you from the front no problem”. And that role would make sense he is a recon after all meant to pick out high value targets only difference is his designated range is close/near mid combat.
I expect him to be just as good when it comes to killing as other recons actually since he has no spotter ability he ought to be more deadly. Vassili can insta gibshot players from a far Phantom can kill as quickly as every other Merc (same guns like the rest and the katana only makes superficially more damage than a stilnoto) considering stuff like airstrikes and grenades he is quite a bit worse in that department.

Now I don’t say bring back the old phantom he was not that great either he had similar problems as he has now (only less pronounced), while steamrolling new players in a bad way. Personaly I hope that future buffs give him a clear use case / job. Heck even a Merc as situational as Rhino has a well communicated niche, where he shines.

(Lumi) #13

I never wrote “only”. And he might have a slight melee advantage but that alone doesn’t make the merc fun to me. And again, those guns I can find with other mercs. It’s not a selling argument I’m afraid.

(Lumi) #14

[quote=“Ardez;57309”]Two quick things.

How is the katana a hard to use melee weapon?
and
The katana is only currently exclusive to Phantom. Other mercs will be getting access to it in the future.[/quote]

Well not hard, but it surely isn’t as straight forward as it used to be, since the rotation nerf. What I meant by that is that the katana is at a mobility disadvantage to other melee weapons which ultimately removes it from the top position, it is now just one option amongst the other melee options, which in turns renders Phantom uniteresting to use and not as special.

By scaling movement freedom with damage of melee weapon they turn them into a matter of preference rather than one sticking out as the best which in turn makes it so that no weapon is better and hence “the” dedicated melee weapon. The katana lost it’s edge and with it so did Phantom’s appeal.

(Lumi) #15

There is no advantage. If one is not in a position to be seen then one doesn’t need a cloak/shield and if one is, then one isn’t really flanking. That’s just approaching from the front but a little on the side.

(Lumi) #16

[quote=“Gi.Am;57353”]

Now I don’t say bring back the old phantom he was not that great either he had similar problems as he has now (only less pronounced), while steamrolling new players in a bad way. Personaly I hope that future buffs give him a clear use case / job. Heck even a Merc as situational as Rhino has a well communicated niche, where he shines.[/quote]

This is exactly what I mean! Phantom is missing his identity. It’s not really about buffing or nerfing.

(KattiValk) #17

Actually, another thing that could work to make Phantom’s ability actually useful is have it stay on when he’s engaging, but fuzz out big time so not even the greenest of the greens can miss him (basically his shield has a purpose in combat now and not just GTFOing). As it stands, it’s basically impossible to engage a decent team because you can’t reliably engage multiple targets that know what they’re doing currently even with the tactical advantage.

(BushDweller) #18

How to win with phantom

  1. Go invisible

  2. Walk up to someone

  3. Headshot them, getting you a 10 bullet advantage on your opponent, before they could react.

(Lumi) #19

[quote=“BushDweller;57427”]How to win with phantom

  1. Go invisible

  2. Walk up to someone

  3. Headshot them, getting you a 10 bullet advantage on your opponent, before they could react.[/quote]

Completely besides my point. It’s not about how to win. It’s about what makes him special.

(BushDweller) #20

[quote=“Lumi;57531”][quote=“BushDweller;57427”]How to win with phantom

  1. Go invisible

  2. Walk up to someone

  3. Headshot them, getting you a 10 bullet advantage on your opponent, before they could react.[/quote]

Completely besides my point. It’s not about how to win. It’s about what makes him special.[/quote]

What do you mean what makes him special…?

He was never advertised as a melee elite ninja tank.

“I’m like a shark… on land… with a gun”

He was advertised for stealing a high tech armor suit that could make him less visible. Which it surely does, people don’t notice you if you wall jump over them whilst cloaking. You can still do what he used to do, just not ridiculously easy as it used to be