PC vs XBOX vs PS3

(Terminator514) #21

Shadowrun was sweet, cross-platform play in one of it’s rare appearances.

(General Techniq) #22

[QUOTE=Nexolate;366460]Neither of the articles you link explain why they found X360 players stomping PC players, plus I’ve been seeing articles that say the complete opposite ever since the X360 was released.

Example:

Regards,
Nexo[/QUOTE]
LOL.

  1. I didn’t link two articles. I linked one article and one video (video from the DEVELOPER explaining quite A LOT). Did you seriously just comment about those links without even clicking them both?

  2. YOUR kotaku.com link = Hewlett Packard (HP) executive full of BS from July 2010 just like the other link in nephandys post. That’s what scrubby little game review sites do. They post bogus comments as journalistic relevance in Fox News style in order to get hits. His comments were as stupid as the comments from the Microsoft executive who said that “it is impossible” to stabilize 256 players in a single FPS match over PSN.

[QUOTE=General Techniq;366442]

LOL. You like to post links? OKAY!!! :):wink::D:cool:
Here ya go http://n4g.com/news/43443/controller-balancing-console-vs-pc-gaming-and-how-shadowrun-did-it
and again http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9iSzLaI9fw
Now, why don’t you try linking to a source that isn’t referenced from an already admittedly (by said person) uninformed comment from a troll of an executive from HP from July 2010 (Shadowrun was released three years BEFORE then in 2007), that claims first-hand knowledge of PC gamers owning Console gamers in Shadowrun. It never happened. Never even came close to happening, LOL.
[/QUOTE] :slight_smile:

(wolfnemesis75) #23

[QUOTE=General Techniq;366464]Microsoft pretty much screwed that game over. It was a wonder that it sold any copies at all, really. I’m guessing a lot of studios learned a lesson from FASA’s failure in partnering up with $soft in such a way.

Not just what they did with the server hosting, but also how they scheduled the Halo 3 beta and the launch of Shadowrun on top of each other. Nearly the entire FPS playerbase for the 360 had their attention on the Halo 3 beta leading up to the Shadowrun release and were in no way interested in trying Shadowrun. Seemed like 4/4 xbox360 players that I met on Shadowrun during the first weeks only grabbed the game because of word-of-mouth (friendlist) and had never heard of Shadowrun the week before.

I’m guessing that a lot of the fault for Shadowrun’s poor sales was pawned off onto the cross-platform concept by some shady $soft executives trying to save their jobs and/or get rid of competing associates.
Think, if you were a supporter of charging the PC players a premium fee to host their own servers (that you didn’t provide), what would you do when the PC sales barely broke 10k during that year?
What if you were part of the management group that said it would be OK to slash the developing single player campaign from the game to cut costs, and release the game with so few maps?
The cross-platform gameplay was already going against core principles at $soft’s gaming division, and was likely a sensitive and unfairly scrutinized subject throughout development among the higher-ups… couple that with the fact that opposers had egg on their face when the developers revealed that the OPPOSITE of their objections was a reality, and you have a situation were some individuals might have been relishing the chance to sink the cross-platform concept at earliest convenience. Also… crap… I’m rambling, AGAIN! :mad:[/QUOTE]You made me go watch this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paqHb1818D8&playnext=1&list=PLE8BD4A1D8417795AVery very interesting.

(Nexolate) #24

Of couse I looked at them both, why would I write such an in depth comment if I didn’t even look at what you typed?

Also do I have to transcribe exactly what they said in the video? All he said is that they “had to do a lot to make the PC experience fair” and that they “have constant grudge matches back at the studio”. Neither of which explains why they found what they did.

As for the Kotaku link, well I trust it a lot more than I trust your N4G article and 30-second interview snippet. From GameTrailers no less, who are only good for their namesake, nothing more.

Regards,
Nexo

(Nexolate) #25

Of couse I looked at them both, why would I write such an in depth comment if I didn’t even look at what you typed?

Also do I have to transcribe exactly what they said in the video? All he said is that they had to “do a lot to make the PC experience fair” and that they “have constant grudge matches back at the studio”. Neither of which explains why they found what they did.

As for the Kotaku link, well I trust it a lot more than I trust your N4G article and 30-second interview snippet. From GameTrailers no less, who are only good for their namesake, nothing more.

Regards,
Nexo

(General Techniq) #26

[QUOTE=Nexolate;366484]Of couse I looked at them both, why would I write such an in depth comment if I didn’t even look at what you typed?

Also do I have to transcribe exactly what they said in the video? All he said is that they had to “do a lot to make the PC experience fair” and that they “have constant grudge matches back at the studio”. Neither of which explains why they found what they did.

As for the Kotaku link, well I trust it a lot more than I trust your N4G article and 30-second interview snippet. From GameTrailers no less, who are only good for their namesake, nothing more.

Regards,
Nexo[/QUOTE]First of all. The “they” you are talking about in the video… THEY are the DEVELOPERS of the game.
That’s that… END of subject.

Kotaku can, as always, eat a genitalia, ESPECIALLY when they weren’t even REPORTING it as FACT but as UNCONFIRMED RUMOR and nothing more. That story died within the week, like all bogus stories that roll through the gaming blogoshpere every other week.

Here’s some links about a BOGUS/FAKE/SHADY/NONSENSE Kotaku.com article posted just two weeks after the article you linked to. JUST TWO WEEKS LATER.

“durr, it was on kotaku so me say true, even though kotaku never really say it true though, durr”
Be gullible if you want. It’s your choice to be stupid, and I want stop you.
I’m not your daddy, so it’s no hair off my back. :cool:

(Nexolate) #27

Christ talking to you is painful. Didn’t anyone ever teach you any respect?

Ok, they’re the developers. So? Does that automatically mean they had perfect testing and are therefore 100% correct in this regard? Of course not. That just means that they’ve tried it in some form. They could have brought in the worst players on the face of the planet for all we know.

As for the whole Kotaku thing, that was the first article I found on the subject. Personally I don’t read Kotaku that often, but I certainly hear people referencing it a lot more than N4G.

Here’s some more links on the subject:-

IGN’s playtesting which explains their experiences:

The original blog where you can see that the author founded VoodooPC and is currently working at Microsoft:
http://www.rahulsood.com/2010/07/console-gamers-get-killed-against-pc.html

Wouldn’t you know it; like I suggested, you weren’t telling us something about the game. Like how it uses a similar system to Brink in that weapons aren’t always accurate. With that kind of system I can certainly imagine X360 players standing a fairer chance against PC players.

Regards,
Nexo

EDIT: Also note how IGN’s experiences say that the games were more like 50-50 than complete decimation, which is what I’d expect regardless of how the game operates.

(coolstory) #28

[QUOTE=General Techniq;366469]That is not according to the article, and I don’t ask you to believe. Your belief isn’t needed for something to be true.

Also, you have my GT for xbox and have had it all this time. Still no word from you. You also have my PSN, and still no word. You can either show some balls and COME PLAY ME, or you can stfu and continue to ride your scrubby little platform elitism knowing that I don’t have a worthy FPS PC yet (will have it by end of this month, my current system slows to 4 frames-per-second in firefights on Brink.).

Pussy out? Cool story troll. :)[/QUOTE]

Lol…I dont have any console atm…but u have a pc…we can do quakelive. It also has controller support.

any day now.

(General Techniq) #29

First of all, this whole thing is all sourced from Rahul Sood (the founder of VoodooPC, former CTO for Hewlett Packard gaming, and current $soft employee).

HE WAS NOT, I repeat, WAS NOT speaking about Shadowrun. Furthermore, he was talking out of his ass, and pretty much giving his blog viewers 3rd-hand inaccurate info that he himself didn’t even hold as complete fact. END OF STORY… once, again. That is kotaku’s one and only source, and they SLANTED the story to make it appear as if he spoke about Shadowrun which he did not.

All of this might have very well been based in fact, at the time. HOWEVER, it had absolutely nothing to do with the 360 vs PC experience on Shadowrun. END of story.

5 years from now, I’ll likely see myself on some forum for some other c-ranked developer, having another clueless BSer trying to re-write FPS history; this time by trying to tell me how Brink failed because it was a lonewolf shooter (wtf) that was filled with the voices of annoying racist kids,
and he will link me to a Kotaku article from July 2013 that talks about how they heard that Splash Damage failed with Brink because they explored a policy of online-only gameplay and the game was unplayable at all due to lag and no players shortly after release and annoying kids that couldn’t be muted always trolled the chat when you entered rooms. I’ll find myself once again fighting frustration, as I try to educate the scrub in facts like “brink had public VOIP off by default in standard multiplayer modes”, just to have the scrub say “nananana it was on kotaku(or whatever) me no listen to you nanana”. LOL.

(Nexolate) #30

I never said it was about Shadowrun. I just linked it as an example of similar articles I’ve seen which state the complete opposite to the article which you linked. Besides, what facts do you have that he was “talking out of his a**” aside from your opinion? None. He was just one dude who actually had connections to the industry that probably revealed something that wasn’t strictly supposed to be talked about.

Besides, you want to talk about people blindly believing what they’re told? What about you, who linked me to a 30 second YouTube clip and argued with “THEY are the DEVELOPERS of the game. That’s that… END of subject.”

Not to mention your disrespectful attitude. That’s fighting frustration.

Regards,
Nexo

(General Techniq) #31

[QUOTE=Nexolate;366494]
Ok, they’re the developers. So? Does that automatically mean they had perfect testing and are therefore 100% correct in this regard? [/QUOTE]Yes, it does, actually.

Don’t be a sore-butt. I never even touched on WHY the 360 players stomped the PC players. Nor did I care to. That’s not what my post was about.
Someone posted that PC players destroyed 360 players on Shadowrun, which I knew to be completely untrue and rather opposite of reality, so I spoke up on it… and rightly so.

If you’re interested in not talking out of your ass for two seconds, I guess I’d be willing to give you one or two reasons why/how the PC players’ kb/m advantage was neutralized. It’s was all quite simple and, as I’ve said many times over the years, very hilarious. I spoke no fiction on any of this.

(General Techniq) #32

[QUOTE=Nexolate;366501]
Besides, you want to talk about people blindly believing what they’re told? What about you, who linked me to a 30 second YouTube clip and argued with “THEY are the DEVELOPERS of the game. That’s that… END of subject.”[/QUOTE]
LOL. That link wasn’t for me. It was for YOU… the BELIEVER of kotaku and articles titled RUMOR. Rational people don’t usually question 1st-hand accounts from original sources in support of 3rd-hand accounts titled “Rumor” or listed as “I heard from…”. Go figure :slight_smile:

I was there, I don’t need the developers to tell me what I already went through. It was freaking hilarious! :cool:

I gotta admit. Even I expected to easily own with the kb/m over the console players, but the game was just too well balanced. They didn’t even have to handicap the KBM controls, and I wouldn’t object to anyone saying that we had a tiny bit of auto-aim help on PC because it sure felt like it. :slight_smile:

(coolstory) #33

First of all I doubt any good PC players or top PC teams played shadowrun. And the reason why console players even had a chance to beat PC players was cause the developers nerfed the PC mouse control scheme in an effort to balance the playing field between Analog and Mouse users. Even worse, to better even out the playing field, developers went the extra mile in giving analog users aim assist while the PC players get nothing.

You’re delusional if you think someone with good with a controller can beat someone decent with a m/kb setup.

(General Techniq) #34

[QUOTE=coolstory;366507]First of all I doubt any good PC players or top PC teams played shadowrun. [/QUOTE]That might very well be true. Same could be said of console players, also.
However, I believe it to be more true about PC players.

Rest of your post really isn’t worth a response. Still…
I’ve never attempted to make an argument that console controllers is better for FPS gaming than the kb/m. That would be ridiculous, the kb/m is better than most all controllers for FPS gaming (analog/mouse combo controllers are getting better).
Nor, have I ever tried to claim that console or PC players are fundamentally more skilled than one or the other.

Consoles attract more players and WAY more casual FPS gamers. That is the one and only credible determining factor in the differences in fundamental skill between the platforms.

Most all genuine hardcore FPS gaming vets are ALL multi-platformed, in my eyes. Any players perpetuating PC or console elitism is little more than a scrub in my eyes. :cool:

Hopefully, during the next generation of consoles, we will see mouse based controllers be supported by the console manufacturers. Hopefully.

(sereNADE) #35

There have been instances of games being developed to run cross-platform between pc and consoles or between the consoles themselves for demonstration purposes. While being implemented in a patch after the fact seems unlikely and wholly unnecessary it’s not to say there was not a window of opportunity way back when for BRINK to allow it. If you want to know why cross platform doesn’t happen often it has much to do with $ and that’s before and after any technical issue.

Adding 2cents about kbm vs sticks… Wouldn’t make much a difference with BRINK anyway. You don’t have to be very good with either to land the smg on an opponent. There are definitely games where need for precision would pull ahead for KBM but BRINK just is not that game and I don’t know any console players excited for raw input shock rifle/rail insta gib matches.

(BioSnark) #36

@certain people in this thread: Did you have your quake live duel yet? kthx. Also, aside from ut3 ps3, there are numerous pc games that support a controller so why don’t you go have at it and cut the repetitive chatter about it.

(DeadEye) #37

It’s always funny to see people argue about Shadowrun and the cross platform debate when they never really experienced it. There were two different modes of PC gaming, M/K and using a controller on the PC. I knew several people who decided because Shadowrun is so cheap these days to get it on PC and play with a controller on it, let me tell you… These people went from being average, to amazing, just by turning their PC on. I was playing once with Vintage, an MLG Shadowrun Pro from 07 who was a decent troll in the first year of the game, but became a pretty big joke in the later years. One day I was playing with him, and he was getting destroyed. The next game he switched to his PC, came in and did a 180, carrying against the people who had been destroying him before. Now imagine someone had the extra machining power of the PC, with the precision of the M/K.

Let me be the first to say, if you think cross platform between console/PC shows any amount of skill vs skill, you’re completely wrong. The machine gives you the advantage, not the talent behind it.

One other thing I have to say though, is that… I have **** on so many PC kids who thought they were good, just because I was so much better than them and out-thought them in every situation. One of the best PC gamers, on the best PC team(1080), was named Bugspray. Well Bugspray quit Shadowrun when he realized he wouldn’t be able to play cross platform in money tournaments once MLG found out it was completely unbalanced… so for a few months he decided to stop playing and trash all of our forums with stuff like “console gamers are dumb, look at this video of PC gaming from the 90s, this is real skill” and such. Well, he decided he was going to come back and play for fun in one of the tournaments that would let PC players come back… I destroyed him so bad in a troll(him) vs elf(me) battle, when he was completely built(AMGs, tele, wired, katana/rifle) and I had tele/rifle… that he quit the game again and didn’t play another private ever again.

Another example is eXt, who was one of the people involved with Shadowrun(pretty sure he designed the elf). He knew the ins and outs of the game, and because of his intelligence he was able to be on the #1 team, teaming with 2GRE and Walshy for a MLG tournament. They destroyed because of his knowledge of the game, but a few months later he came back and played in an online tournament, and got worked because A. Everyone now knew all the secrets that no one but him knew when the game came out and B. because he had to play on xbox, and without his PC being able to give him the advantage, and without knowing secrets others didn’t know… He wasn’t good, and couldn’t compete.’

My main thing to emphasize here, is that cross platform will take a LONG time to perfect to be completely balanced. IMO consoles take more skill because it’s more about your knowledge and talent, rather than your machine. It’s more like climbing a mountain with no oxygen or tools, while PC gaming you’re basically taking a helicopter to the peak.

(iezza) #38

Wait. hes got my face.

ENEMY FANBOY SPOTTED!

THAT TROLL YOU FOUND? DISARMED!

Supply thread post FIREWALLED!

BACK ON TOPIC!

(Monolith) #39

I’d like to point out one small thing that has already been said before: Xbox 360 users were given aim assist for Shadowrun. But what has not been said is that the aim assist combined with smartlink gave console users a supreme advantage. If you are unfamiliar with the shadowrun system then you don’t know that a smartlink is quite simply a mechanical implant to assist you aiming at targets.

To think about it in brink terms, imagine if there was a power in the game that let you stay locked on targets once you had your cursor over him. It does not matter if he jumps, moves behind you or tries to duck; no matter where he moves the game will keep your gun locked right on him. Would kind of ruin the game for light classes right?

Well guess what, people did in fact get butthurt when you used an extra level of aim assist while playing shadowrun. Now before you gripe about smartlink bear in mind that I’ve been playing the rpg for almost 10 years before I picked up a copy of shadowrun on the Xbox. Except for a few pure magic based characters, I’ve never known anyone to make a character without smartlink (because not having it makes you gimp).

People did get downright pissed at me for running EV & smartlink all the time… as it was the natural counter to all the teleport builds. Go wherever you like I still see you. Not only do I see you before you see me, my gun locks on automatically. Typically I’ve emptied half my clip into an enemy before they have started shooting back. If you buy smoke then my team will catch you because smoke lowers your magic regeneration (not to mention everyone has gust anyway).

Some people will kick you out of the room for using smartlink because they think it’s noobish. They also get mad when someone kills them in .4 seconds as they are trying to teleport through a wall (over and over and over again). The same people will also get angry when you hit EV every time it cycles (oh if you aren’t aware EV lets you see people through walls by pressing a button).

(wolfnemesis75) #40

Shadowrun needs a re-release on xbox live arcade or something. Miss-timing may have done it in a bit. Just saying. It obviously has a cult following for sure.