Overhyping singleplayer?

(Mustkunstn1k) #1

If I am understanding everything correctly then Brink will mainly be a multiplayer only game. I mean similiar to ETQW there is gonna be option to play singleplayer, but still. It’s definetly isn’t the main focus. And it seems to be like they are hyping it up as: “You play it as a regular singleplayer game… then you can invite friends for co-op and then you turn it into multiplayer”. Granted ETQW had pretty smart bots. And all of this is ofcourse in the case when singleplayer is as I actually imagine.

This just seems to be one of the things that reviewers are going to jump @ when Brink releases. I mean I don’t care about their opinion, I’m gonna get Brink either way. But a lot of people do care and reviewer’s are kind of ignorant some times. With Quake Wars many were totally confused - but in Brink SD luckily put the wheel which simplifies things for everybody. Although as I understand Brink still only has the objective mode. Which will definetly disappoint many, specially since there aren’t gonna be mods on the consoles.

:penguin:

(tokamak) #2

Meh, I call it clever framing. The lack of a fulfilling single-player experience is what will hold a lot of people back if you say it’s just solo multiplayer. And that’s not quite the case either, respawn isn’t really a conventional feature in singleplayer shooters but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist, look at Bioshock and Prey.

I hope everyone will be too busy enjoying the game to notice technicalities.

(H0RSE) #3

Competitive FPS Multiplayer gaming isn’t anything new - merging it with single player and co-op is. This is why they focus on these 2 aspects.

SD: We have class-based, team objective multiplayer!
Consumer: pffft, been there done that.
SD: You can also play it exactly the same, single player or co-op!
Consumer: What?!

Having the option to play bot matches with friends alone, makes this game 10x more appealing than most of the top shooters out today or coming out.

(tokamak) #4

Yeah but the objection is that people won’t be getting the traditional single player shooter experience they would expect.

I think people will just lap it up and not be bothered by it.

(H0RSE) #5

[QUOTE=tokamak;249071]Yeah but the objection is that people won’t be getting the traditional single player shooter experience they would expect.

I think people will just lap it up and not be bothered by it.[/QUOTE]
SD has said countless times in interviews (both written and video) and articles that SP and MP are exactly the same - that there isn’t even a separate SP and MP option and that it is always 8v8. Those who are expecting that “traditional SP experience,” have nobody but themselves to blame for their disappointment.

I for one and looking forward to playing bot matches with friends.

(tokamak) #6

Aye, agreed.

(Cankor) #7

[QUOTE=H0RSE;249072]SD has said countless times in interviews (both written and video) and articles that SP and MP are exactly the same - that there isn’t even a separate SP and MP option and that it is always 8v8. Those who are expecting that “traditional SP experience,” have nobody but themselves to blame for their disappointment.

I for one and looking forward to playing bot matches with friends.[/QUOTE]

99 out of 100 people who buy the game will have never read anything about it on forums or otherwise. The point was that they will be expecting something else, so may be disappointed in not getting it. This includes reviewers.

I get that your saying that the something else will still be really good, but people react based on expectations. So I think it’s a valid point, but there’s nothing to be done about it except make it play a little more like a single player shooter when you are in that mode, and I suspect that will be happening with the intro scenes and so forth. So, like you, not worried.

As of course you know, you can play ETQW vs bots with just your friends anytime, you can even jump into the middle of “their” game :slight_smile: There’s nothing really that new there as far as playing vs bots and joining games in progress other than that it started as a “single player” game. It does make you wonder how they transition it: if you are playing on a server from the get go or if there is a server migration thing in effect or even if that part is a server running on your own computer. Maybe add that to your list of questions unless the answer is already out there somewhere?

(H0RSE) #8

99 out of 100 people who buy the game will have never read anything about it on forums or otherwise. The point was that they will be expecting something else, so may be disappointed in not getting it. This includes reviewers.

And like I said, they have nobody but themselves to blame for their disappointment. I’m sure even when they go to buy it at the store, it will explain what Brink is on the back of the box.

As of course you know, you can play ETQW vs bots with just your friends anytime, you can even jump into the middle of “their” game There’s nothing really that new there as far as playing vs bots and joining games in progress other than that it started as a “single player” game.

Sure there is something new:

  1. none of my friends play ETQW, so I can’t play with them anytime.
  2. ETQW is mediocre compared to RTCW and ET, so I never played nearly as much as I played the other
  3. Brink looks a hell of a lot more fun than QW.
  4. the bots in QW are pretty bad.
(BioSnark) #9

But those points are new (and subjective) to you, not new to the market. I was beating up bots with friends in halflife(1) days. If I were the Customer in post 3, “like l4d?” This stuff is good but it’s not new.

(Lanz) #10

As usual I think it comes down to how good the bots will be if single player will be interesting at all. Sure no bots are brighter than a mosquito but it’s how they behave within their limitations that make or break them.

(H0RSE) #11

L4D is not competitive multiplayer, single player and co-op, merged into one. Single player and co-op differ from the competitive multiplyer with special infected. It even has separate single and multiplayer options on the menu.

Hal Life with bots = same thing.

(Mustkunstn1k) #12

On a similiar note. I wonder how the tutorials are gonna be. For most people who aren’t veterans of this kind of objective style gameplay its gonna be confusing. We need more than just voice-overs like in ETQW. I mean I mentioned the objective wheel which makes things easier, but still. Since SP is same as MP it’s not really gonna teach anything. People still need to figure everything out on their own. And even tho I’m fine with that, the average consumer is gonna be hella confused. Even some reviewers since a lot of them couldn’t even grasp ETQW.

(H0RSE) #13

The game will probably ship with that training video that some of us saw. It will also probably be like QW when you first start playing, where the game points out things as you do them and tells you what to do.

(darthmob) #14

I’m looking forward to see what Yahtzee has to say about it in Zero Punctuation. He doesn’t like multiplayer at all.

[QUOTE=Mustkunstn1k;249154]People still need to figure everything out on their own. And even tho I’m fine with that, the average consumer is gonna be hella confused. Even some reviewers since a lot of them couldn’t even grasp ETQW.[/QUOTE]I still remember that it took me more than six hours of gameplay to grasp what the heck it was about. And that after having played ET for years. Don’t blame the people; ETQW has got no learning curve but a learning wall. This is supposed to be very different in Brink and I hope SD gets it right.

(TiN TiN) #15

I don’t think it’s over hyped at all. They’ve only told the backstory behind the Ark and the two sides and not much about the actual story that happens in game, besides a few hints. I’m not expecting anything over the top but something decent and enjoyable.

(H0RSE) #16

Exactly. They haven’t overhyped the single player, since there isn’t a single player per se. All they have been doing is explaining the backstory, and talking about how each faction has a campaign. This is true for anyway you decide to play.

(tokamak) #17

Yes indeed. I think he’s going to feel cheated. But then again, I don’t think the mainstream gamer is such a hardcore single-player as he is.

It makes sense he restricts himself to singleplayer though, the biggest part of his video is ranting about the story, the characters and the plot.

(Mustkunstn1k) #18

[QUOTE=darthmob;249170]I’m looking forward to see what Yahtzee has to say about it in Zero Punctuation. He doesn’t like multiplayer at all.
[/QUOTE]
He not only doesn’t like, but he practically never plays it. And I can kind of see why, he once even explained. No teamwork, screaming 12-year-olds etc. I can see where he is coming from, but he probably should find a decent server on PC and experience it fully.

I don’t think he is gonna say anything nice about the singleplayer since it’s I can imagine it can be pretty boring when compared to online. I have never enjoyed playing with bots personally.

I’m not even quite sure if he is gonna review it. Although it definetly depends of how the hype-train for Brink is doing near the launch. And I really hope that ZeniMax does a fine job with Brink. They gotta keep building the hype and on the month of launch Brink has to be everywhere.

(BioSnark) #19

Your distinction between quake wars and brink is still purely subjective. Any multiplayer game with bots and objectives could advertise this interchangeable singleplayer, coop and multiplayer. The counter strike mod is what I was referring to by “hl days.” Meets all the artificial criteria of this discussion and I played it against bots on a lan.

Again, it’s a fine feature but I do think it’s a bit disingenuous to hype it up as a selling point. As I’ve said since early footage was released, singleplayer gamers (of which I am frequently one) are going to be disappointed if blatantly mp features like obituaries and obviously respawning (as opposed to new) opponents leak over from mp into the solo experience and highlight that the game is built around mp and break immersion.

Obviously, there’s a limit to how much that reality can be papered over but obituaries and enemy player names don’t need to be displayed when there are no human opponents. That’s purely UI. Also, bots (or “AI characters”), particularly enemies, don’t need to look the same each time they respawn. There’s a reason sp opponents usually wear masks and uniforms beyond anything physiological. Brink wouldn’t seem like it needs to resort to that, however.

Brink’s singleplayer experience could be reasonably convincing. It just depends on how far SD is willing to go to implement it.

edit: And yes, since this seems to be in contention, the game is listed as singleplayer and it is mentioned as such in the marketing writeup and 5 key features.

(Cankor) #20

[QUOTE=tokamak;249178]Yes indeed. I think he’s going to feel cheated. But then again, I don’t think the mainstream gamer is such a hardcore single-player as he is.

It makes sense he restricts himself to singleplayer though, the biggest part of his video is ranting about the story, the characters and the plot.[/QUOTE]

Maybe SD will entice him to going online with a double XP bonus, and he will join quick game with VOIP disabled and learn about the joys of multiplayer and never look back. I can see his headline now:

“The game that converted me from a singleplayer only gamer into a dieahard multiplayer enthusiast, BRINK, five out of five stars!” (or whatever he uses to rate games as I’ve never heard of this guy, probably since I rarely play single player games outside of strategy games).