No real teamplay possible

(ARES) #1

Voice commands are okay, but I think there is something much better: a headset with headphones and a microphone.

Why “modern” games still use ancient voice commands? Keys need to be assigned for them and the keys need to be pressed. Why not just say to the team “Attack” instead of pushing a key? Besides that, I want to say to my team “I am at enemy base, I need a covert ops to open the door for me!”

With real communication, teamplay will be much better I believe. And real communication is much more interesting to me than pressing keys.

I think all multiplayer games should now support such a “real” communication natively.

(KingJackaL) #2

You think wrong.

All clans DO use voice-comms in clan games ( well, any clan worth playing does ). However, most/all clans STILL use the v-says ingame.

Basically, that’s because you have to press a key to talk, so it’s easier to tap ‘v-2-1’ as it is to tap a key, say ‘I need a medic’ then release the key. The problem being that for the duration of you saying that, one of your fingers is used ( and possibly more, if your comms key requires you to move your hand from your movement keys ). Furthermore, with v-says, once you hit the ‘v-2-1’ ( or whatever ), it does not require your attention for the during of the comms message, AND the comms messages come across in a CONSISTENT form. Good players here the ‘I nee-…’, and already know how it ends by the pitch and timing of the v-say - it’s the same every time.

Sure you can use auto-talk rather than using push-to-talk, but this has the huge disadvantage of then transmitting every ‘F**K, OMG I DONT BELIEVE THAT’ etc etc. And this can be even worse than no comms - you can’t hear relevant details, v-says, OR in-game action while somebody rages up your comms. ( Hence push-to-talk being a good option )

Voice comms do have advantages though, big ones that ensure that they DO get used in every clan game. You can call splits, class changes, mention area’s of weakness in enemy defenses as you find them - things that v-says aren’t flexible enough to do.

However, I patently disagree with your absurd motion that v-says are out of date.

In conclusion - you don’t use voice-comms already? OMG… your clan must be easy to beat :stuck_out_tongue:

(Agrado) #3

You forgot the other huge advantage of the vsays - they show you up on the radar, i.e. v21 makes a big ‘+’ that the medic can see so they can find you. Otherwise you have to spend ages explaining where you are.

(The_Jesus_Zeppelin) #4

my clan uses voice commands for two reasons.

1: they ARE very useful
2: SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM!!!

but they are useful cause somtime on teamspeak four people can say somthing at once and make it increadably unintelligable. but on v says you just hit ~ and your all good.

(ARES) #5

I am not in a clan. I play on public servers, not clan against clan.

What I ask for is that games support the oral communication natively, that no extra software is needed for it.

For things like “Need Medic” and “Need Ammo”, keys could be used since they show the location for medics and field ops.

As a non clan player I want to use oral communication and to know that other people use it too on non clan matches.

Do you think the army has pushbuttons for “need medic” or “need ammo”. I think they use a walky talky and say it instead of pushing a button… Or SWAT: They have a headset and no buttons to press for “BadGuyInFrontOfMe” or “Yippie”.

(Sauron|EFG) #6

Not everyone speaks English, although most people seem to understand voice chats. Based on (admittedly very little) CS experience I also know that I would turn it off on most pub servers because of feedback/distortion/clipping and the simple fact that idiots shouting and cursing at newbies doesn’t add much to the game. :frowning:

It would also make it more expensive to run servers since it increases bandwidth requirements.

(IPvD) #7

Play CS or any half-life mod for a decent length of time and you might want to reconsider. It’s not just about idiots shouting at newbies; there’s a whole world of spam when you open up the mic for any schmoe to use with next to zero accountability; piped audio, random streams of curse words, static, boring monologues. Frankly, I’d rather have everyone in pubs on a level playing field with the v-says than have to suffer the garbage that is integrated voice chat.

(Graballa) #8

Clan comms - I don’t need to press a key to talk, the microphone automatically registers my voice when I speak near the mic.

And yes, it would be quicker just to go ‘v21’ rather than say ‘I need a medic’ as you are highlighted on the map. Teamspeak is for the more complex talks, generally paranoid rants that an engineer possibly got through the guns on Battery etc. Or to decide who’ll go and wander about inside for 5 minutes looking for a rogue engineer perhaps.

Public comms - I think the take up level for people on this would be quite small, and although everyone on your team could hear what you’re saying, it’s unlikely they’d respond. How many times have you written on teamchat that you’re at the fuel dump and need an engineer, and yet no one has responded?

It all boils down to the fact, that teamplay per se isn’t utilised as much on pubbys, so anything that would help this non-existent teamplay is a little useless.

Fair enough for the people that are trying to work as a team, but in my experience that’s few and far between.

(ARES) #9

They could be muted, couldn’t they? The same is possible with key chat.

(evilsock) #10

You shouldn’t need keybinds for a medic or ammo - your team should kinda have that bit sorted out already. How about a footswitch so you can ‘key-up’ when you want to talk? That way at least you can still move around.

(Sick Boy) #11

Voice communication on pubs is THE WORST IDEA EVER.

(Ifurita) #12

Not true. The military in fact has a very regimented system of call signs, codes, and procedures to make sure voice communications is concise and to the point and that people aren’t stepping over one another.

Even if ET had a native voice comms package embedded, I’d be the last one to use it. I simply have no desire to hop into a random soup of voice comms with a bunch of people I don’t know.

There is enough noise in the written communications. Voice comms would make that even worse because you don’t have to do anything to spam the channel. My experience with various public voice channels that have been made available is generally unimpressive.

Even in matchs, the use of voice comms is fairly restricted. We aren’t babbling all the time and even have to watch out not to slip into non-useful converstations during games.

(Ranstaton) #13

My experience with voice chat, such as in CS, has been incredibly amazing. Even for the number of little asses that play CS, you don’t run into too many problems. You actually get team work going where there once was none. I fail to see why everyone is “OMg This WORULD NEVAR WORKSASAD~~!!!#W!@.” You just mute the people you don’t like, or turn it off completely, but saying that you had a bad experience with it before and therefor no one should be allowed to have it is just plain retarded.

(Rippin Kitten) #14

I use voice chat every time I play. The game is much more social when you can talk with people without having to jam away at the keyboard. Its especially true when you’re trying to tell a story, whine about your job, or deliver some fresh smack talk. Sure, we use it for teamwork and coordination and all that jazz. But primarily its a community enhancement tool.

An integrated chat client would be nice since it could handle some aspects a third party app can’t do. Like having a handy way to chat with people just on your team. Most voice apps have programmable hotkeys to do this, but it still requires everyone to first be on the correct channel which can get confusing after a shuffle. Another neat feature would be to do distance effects. So when I shout out “look out, bad guy in that room!” it only goes to the guys I’m travelling with instead of freaking out my entire team.

Really its only a matter of time before voice comm becomes a “standard feature” in games. I would guess the only reason its not in there right now is that devs simply don’t have the resources to add in another whole feature set.

RK

(ARES) #15

Thanks for the support.

It seems to me these ultraconservative critics are like the ones who said decades before: “Movies with sound! How ridiculous. Silent films are better.” Or later the same kind of people said: “Color films are ridiculous. Black and white films are better.”

Today they say: “Voice chat is ridiculous. Pressing keys is better.”

Luckily the future is not determined by conservative people but by innovative ones.

(Sauron|EFG) #16

That’s a bit of an exaggeration, I think most uf us do use voice comms (at least occasionally). And it is great when you play with people that you know, but then a third party program works just as fine as integrated voice comm.

(puubert) #17

Besides that, I want to say to my team “I am at enemy base, I need a covert ops to open the door for me!”

I hate engineers that do that. Sneaking in should never cross your mind until a covert says “I have a uni, meet me somewhere”.

(The_Jesus_Zeppelin) #18

What I ask for is that games support the oral communication natively, that no extra software is needed for it.

thats like asking for problems. it would be useless on a 30 person server. even on a 20 person. everyone would chime in to say somthing and it would just sound horrabile. id just end up being noise.

(ARES) #19

There are solutions for these problems. Some are technical, some are “natural”.

For example everyone could have a time credit of how many seconds he may speak every 5 minutes. If he uses it up, he would be muted until the next 5 minutes start. Thats just one example of a solution.

If you would have told someone 10 years before that there are chat rooms and everyone is anonymous, some people would say it results in constant insulting and ridicoulous talk. But there are solutions, some technical, some are due to a chat “codex”. The same can be true with voice communication in computer games.

(puubert) #20

[quote=“ARES”]

There are solutions for these problems. Some are technical, some are “natural”.

For example everyone could have a time credit of how many seconds he may speak every 5 minutes. If he uses it up, he would be muted until the next 5 minutes start. Thats just one example of a solution.

If you would have told someone 10 years before that there are chat rooms and everyone is anonymous, some people would say it results in constant insulting and ridicoulous talk. But there are solutions, some technical, some are due to a chat “codex”. The same can be true with voice communication in computer games.[/quote]

That solution is idiotic because what if it takes more than your delegated seconds to say what you gotta say? What if you need to tell your team several times in 5 minutes that they are about to plant somewhere. You can’t restrict when people say things.

I think it’s idiotic to have voice comms outside a “serious” gaming environment because people would abuse it. Look at the people who spam vsays, imagine them on a voice comm. I would never use it because I don’t wanna listen to what people have to say. vsays are quick, simple and don’t interfere with the game. I’d be hella pissed if I was trying to tell my team important information and I had to compete with some bitch whining about his job.

Besides, there’s never a real team environment on pubs so why bother? It just opens itself to abuse.