Merc's To Under Powered Or To OP

(Hardru) #1

Phantom have gotten nerfed I can see that he is more visible now, and if you hit him with a bullet or melee he gets visible. The part where you hit him and he turns visible is cool enough but that he is so visible is not cool now everyone can see him before it was just hard to see him so think they should make him less Visible and more invisible.

For Phoenix, I really think he should be nerfed a bit. not that he is to op or anything but he could use a nerf. I think that when he is self reviving instead of getting full health he gets 50 or 75% back just to balance him more out.

For Proxy. Her Mines could have a bigger explosion range if you ask me. because she is kind a under powered if every time she place a mine it doesn’t kill a player witch is often. I don’t if there is a spacial Technic to it but when a skyhammer without problems can survive a mine form proxy there something wrong if you ask me.

For Rhino. He… Got… To… Much… Health… Yeah okay that is Rhinos thing but still Rhino is some what to OP. And I play with that says the same thing he is to OP sadly. I think that if you could some of his health, maybe nerf his minigun a bit or make him slower just something to get him nerfed. Because I don’t wont to take all the fun out of Rhino just want to nerf him a bit that’s all.

For Vassili. Okay so maybe it is possible to increase Vassili’s damage because he is somewhat under powered not like Phantom but still, it could also be that one shot from Vassili means death. but can see how OP that would be in a long run so yeah, maybe some more damage to Vassili.

For Sawbonez. Op his medic packs when he is using them on him self because the only thing they are doing at the moment is making his regen starts. I think that when he is taking a medic pack he is gain 15-30 HP and then the regen, just so he also can do something for himself.

So yeah that was basically it thanks for reading this and hopefully there would be done something. /)

(cornJester) #2

Phoenix if anything could use a buff. When you charge a heal and switch it should put it on 50% cooldown. Other than that he is perfectly balanced. If you have an issue with him reviving to full health just gib him and he wont revive at all.

He needs to have full health on revive so IF he manages to pull it off he’s a threat. He shouldn’t have to waste his one healing pulse to heal himself after a revive.

Rhino is fine. His whole point is having a lot of health. You want to nerf him for the sake of nerfing him it sounds like because you can’t decide on what needs to be done. Do you even know how to deal with him? He is very vulnerable to headshots and explosives, stay at a distance from him and take advantage of his slow speed. Rhino is only OP when there’s several working together.

One shot from Vassili IS death… If he gets a headshot. It sounds like you want body shots to instakill… Just no… He at least requires some skill right now, as he should. He’s plenty fine, some would say he even needs a nerf to his instagibs.

(Hardru) #3

Hey mate Phoenix is not OP but he could still use a nerf and it just don’t get full health and it sounds on you that he needs full health, my main merc is Sawbonez a medic class and when I revive players I have only time to give them 35-50% so yeah. And the things that have been opped on Phoenix, I really don’t care about I only see his self revive is a bit to strong when he gets op with full health that’s all

and Rhino is hard to take out I know and lower his health would just be sad but his minigun is more or less the must powerful weapon in the game that’s why I want to give the advice that he just should have some kind a nerf on his minigun. And also remember not all got explosives and at the same time if I’m up agents Rhino and I’m only going for his head he would still win because of his mini gun

And now for Vassili yeah I know Vassili is a 30k merc and yeah you should also be skilled to play with Vassili but just make his weapon a bit more powerful if you try to headshot Rhino he would not die and that’s is where I’m going but sure they do not need to touch Vassili he is still a 30k merc. But he should not be nerf they can keep as he is or they could op him both ways is fine for me. And remember I said that Vassili should not be able to one shot when he makes a body shot that would be to OP in a long run just op his damage a little

(Rosenkreuz) #4

I don’t see a need for any merc to be nerfed. The only merc that might need a buff is Redeye. Not a stat buff, just a change in the weaponry available to him, a better sight on the Grandeur, and a fix for the Kukri. Phantom doesn’t really need a buff so much as he needs to be rethought. He functions just fine, but his function isn’t necessarily a function another merc couldn’t fill and/or do it better than Phantom can.

(krashek) #5

Phantom is pain in the ass anyway, visible or not.

Phoenix should not get a full health when revived too.

If you move over the mine fast enough, you dont get killed. Thats the point, so no changes here.

Rhino is a tank, leave him be :wink:

As a sniper i dissagree about one shot kill for Vasili. Let it stay this way.

(Grave_Knight) #6

Oh look, another post by a guy who doesn’t actually know what he’s talking about. I use to main Proxy (I kind of still do but I’ve been playing around with the other engineers) and even I say that the explosive size is fine.

(sentimentalDime) #7

I agree, even though getting killed by a Proxy mine is the biggest pain in the ass, it’s her ability for Christ’s sake. It is also easily avoiding as most people who play Proxy are rather bad at placing the mines out of sight.

(terminal) #8

Phantom is significantly less visible when you walk or stand still. If you don’t get hit by bullets or melee you don’t get revealed, Surprise!

Phoenix doesn’t get his entire health back, he gets 80 on a full charge.

Skyhammers can’t survive from a proximity mine unless you place your mines in really bad places. (I would like a sound reduction augment for mines though)

Lmfao. Rhino might be the weakest merc in the game right now. Huge spread on minigun, slow, only 50 more HP than Fragger which has far better weapons and a much better ability.

No.

Sawbonez’s self healing is a lot less efficient than healing others. It is indeed basically making his regen start, but if you want to think about it this way; he trades early-regen for actual abilities.

(cornJester) #9

Phoenix already has a SUPER long cooldown on his self revive… You say he is not OP but you want to nerf him anyways. I think that is honestly ridiculous and would lead to his self revive being near worthless. If you allow Phoenix to self revive it’s your own fault and he can’t just keep doing it. If he revives with less than full health he is too vulnerable for it to be effective, he will either be gunned down right away and waste his cooldown or have to waste his healing pulse so when he picks up allies he can’t heal them right away.

You want to compare him to Sawbonez? Saw has medpacks that he can throw whenever, wherever, willy nilly. Phoenix cannot do that with his healing pulse unless he gives a tiny pulse, even then it’s a 5 second cooldown. He cannot be expected to have to waste that on himself every time he gets up.

Phoenix is MEANT to be able to revive and then pick others back up, however you are comparing his revive with reviving others as Sawbonez and that isn’t fair. Phoenix has just as much time and ability to revive others as Saw does. For one it takes longer to self revive than it does to revive someone else, you can’t pick and choose how much to revive with or how long. It is extremely easy for anyone to instagib you while doing this.

It only has a use when you do it behind cover or when you are with a group and if you manage to pull this off the whole point is you need to be a threat that is capable of reviving the others. Otherwise everyone will just play Sawbonez, he’s the better medic in other regards.

(Grave_Knight) #10

I agree, even though getting killed by a Proxy mine is the biggest pain in the ass, it’s her ability for Christ’s sake. It is also easily avoiding as most people who play Proxy are rather bad at placing the mines out of sight.[/quote]

Oh, jeez, I know what you mean. Watched someone keep dropping them right in front of doors so anyone coming by can see them long before they do any damage. What’s funny is they were in locations I like to drop mines so there were nice places to hide them.

(Hardru) #11

Phantom: Okay I know that Phantom get visible when you shoot at him that is also okay, but the new update made his invisible effect more dark witch makes him easy to see/spot

Phoenix: Remember what I am saying his cooldown is fine. It’s the fact the he is self reviving with full health there is a problem okay.

Proxy: Yeah… maybe I’m just bad at placing the mines.

Rhino: I know he is a tank and yeah maybe I’m just bad at counter him but still he is power full a lot to say there is 4 mercs who is good at taking him out Fletcher, Nader, Fragger and Proxy

Vassili: I say it again VASSILI SHOULD NOT BE ABLE TO ONE SHOT WHEN BODY SHOOTING THAT WOULD BE TOO OP… Just increase his damage that’s or do so that every time he hits in the head the player die because rhino is the only merc that would not die from a Vassili’s headshot

Redeye: I don’t play Redeye so I don’t know where he is good or not but don’t think changing his weapons would do any thing he is a calls witch use assault sniper rifles so yeah but what do I know right hehe.

And hey I play many of these merc’s and I for the must part knows how to counter them. but else that was all.

(3N1GM4) #12

Honestly, sounds like the OP hasn’t played much competitive play.

Almost everyone plays phantom incorrectly IMHO. He is not meant to run off and leave everyone behind like some super spy. The best I’ve seen is when he hangs back with the medics and when a firefight erupts, he cloaks and goes in during the mayhem. People generally don’t see the barely visible guy when they’re jumping around trying to kill each other. This leaves them extremely open to the katana.

Phoenix is fine. I originally thought it was a bit ridiculous to have self revive, “mobile aura” and paddles, but he needs the high health when he revives so he can either a) heal his team mates or b) fight. Again, like phantom, he’s best played where people will hopefully be able to defend him as he comes back. He can effectively fill the role of having two medics with the self revive.

Rhino… He’s fine. His second “ability” is health… He should be able to take more.

Truth :frowning:

3 rhinos, bush and aura + horrible loadouts on our team = wrecking crew :frowning: got rolled hard on trainyard (think other maps would be better). But so goes public play lol.

Vassili in the hands of a competent player is extremely deadly and a pain with the insta-gib. (See My thoughts on rhino)

(Hardru) #13

Phoenix doesn’t need full health when he self revive he just need 75% of his health right now all medic classes got one thing that makes them spacial but Phoenix got 2 and it would not be the biggest change in the world to change the health he is gained when self revived.

And yeah I agree on the Rhino part that he is a tank sure but like you say when facing 3 of him and a Aura your team doesn’t really stand a chance because everyone can play Rhino… I think.

And yeah there is other ways of playing Phantom I know. But that is not what I’m Talking about, I’m saying that before the update his cloak effect were a blur, now it is like a moving shadow just walking around, because they have changed the blur effect out with a transparent black color thing.
And just kind a off topic here, Phantoms character design are where you just walk for yourself and kill people and you can also see that in the scrubs trailer where he goes alone and takes Vassili out.

For Vassili. I KNOW THAT IN A GOOD PLAYERS HANDS VASSILI ARE INSANE GOOD. But what I meant were that Vassili can not take Rhino out in one shot, not even in the head unless that some other dude have damaged him enough, but when he is on full health no.

(cornJester) #14

[quote=“Hardru;94297”]Phoenix doesn’t need full health when he self revive he just need 75% of his health right now all medic classes got one thing that makes them spacial but Phoenix got 2 and it would not be the biggest change in the world to change the health he is gained when self revived.
[/quote]
I’ve already explained why he does need full health when he revives himself. Sparks has small med packs that instant heal and the revive gun. Sawbonez has large medpacks that start a regen and defibs. Aura has a healing station and defibs. Every medic has one thing at least that is unique to them, Sparks has two as well.

So even if you were correct about him being the only one to have two things the other mercs do not it still makes no sense in arguing about balance. Nader has a grenade launcher and martyrdom, does that mean her martyrdom needs to be nerfed because she has one more thing than Fragger?

(Hardru) #15

Cornjester Would you like to listen for a moment. There are 3 kind of support classes. There are engineers, medics and ammo dealers. In the medic class there are 4 merc’s. Sawbonez, Aura, Sparks and of cause Phoenix. All of them got abilities that makes them unique. And like I have said, (many times time now,) I got no problem’s with Phoenixes self revive, but for some reason do you keep say over and over that he needs full health, and no he doesn’t. Merc’s there are not medic don’t need full health for they do not have those kind a abilities. So why does Phoenix need full health. And it is not like that Phoenix only can self revive and get 20% hp no that would not be fair. That’s why I say give him 75% hp when he self revive because that would make people think more when they are playing Phoenix. when Phoenix first got free to play nearly no one were playing him as a medic, more like a assault. that is why I want him nerfed so people will play him more as a medic.
I once play on a team with 4 Phoenixes, and no one, and I mean NO ONE, played him as a medic and they were around the lvl. 8-14. So can you see now why I want him nerfed.

(cornJester) #16

[quote=“Hardru;94306”]Cornjester Would you like to listen for a moment. There are 3 kind of support classes. There are engineers, medics and ammo dealers. In the medic class there are 4 merc’s. Sawbonez, Aura, Sparks and of cause Phoenix. All of them got abilities that makes them unique. And like I have said, (many times time now,) I got no problem’s with Phoenixes self revive, but for some reason do you keep say over and over that he needs full health, and no he doesn’t. Merc’s there are not medic don’t need full health for they do not have those kind a abilities. So why does Phoenix need full health. And it is not like that Phoenix only can self revive and get 20% hp no that would not be fair. That’s why I say give him 75% hp when he self revive because that would make people think more when they are playing Phoenix. when Phoenix first got free to play nearly no one were playing him as a medic, more like a assault. that is why I want him nerfed so people will play him more as a medic.
I once play on a team with 4 Phoenixes, and no one, and I mean NO ONE, played him as a medic and they were around the lvl. 8-14. So can you see now why I want him nerfed.[/quote]
Hardru, I have listened, now listen to me. I play Phoenix as a medic. Phoenix lets me do something that other medics cannot and this provides a unique gameplay mechanic. What I am talking about is I can push in with a wave, get downed and get back up to save my team under fire, if and only if the enemy is stupid enough to ignore me.

I recently helped win a match on Chapel where I got downed behind the rock while my team was pushing in for the objective, I was able to self revive and under fire I managed to revive my team mates. Had I had less health this would have been less viable. I would have had to waste my only healing pulse and not be able to heal my buddies after I got them up.

Often times Phoenix needs to get right back into the fray when self reviving. However you seriously need to stop comparing it to regular revives. Self revive takes a fair amount of seconds to go off, regular revives can be quick or charged for the majority of health back if not full health. He can be gibbed easily during this time and if he wastes his only self revive it goes on a full minute of cooldown. That’s way too long for it to not be as effective as possible if he pulls it off.

In short just gib Phoenix and you render his self revive useless but don’t say that you need to nerf a merc because of the way some people play him. Bad medics will be bad medics no matter what and you will have selfish Sawbonez, Sniper sparks, hoppy shotgun Aura and assault Phoenix forever.

EDIT: Clearly you do have a problem with his self revive as you keep asking for a nerf, so that part is pretty much a lie.

(Hardru) #17

[quote=“cornJester;94314”][quote=“Hardru;94306”]Cornjester Would you like to listen for a moment. There are 3 kind of support classes. There are engineers, medics and ammo dealers. In the medic class there are 4 merc’s. Sawbonez, Aura, Sparks and of cause Phoenix. All of them got abilities that makes them unique. And like I have said, (many times time now,) I got no problem’s with Phoenixes self revive, but for some reason do you keep say over and over that he needs full health, and no he doesn’t. Merc’s there are not medic don’t need full health for they do not have those kind a abilities. So why does Phoenix need full health. And it is not like that Phoenix only can self revive and get 20% hp no that would not be fair. That’s why I say give him 75% hp when he self revive because that would make people think more when they are playing Phoenix. when Phoenix first got free to play nearly no one were playing him as a medic, more like a assault. that is why I want him nerfed so people will play him more as a medic.
I once play on a team with 4 Phoenixes, and no one, and I mean NO ONE, played him as a medic and they were around the lvl. 8-14. So can you see now why I want him nerfed.[/quote]
Hardru, I have listened, now listen to me. I play Phoenix as a medic. Phoenix lets me do something that other medics cannot and this provides a unique gameplay mechanic. What I am talking about is I can push in with a wave, get downed and get back up to save my team under fire, if and only if the enemy is stupid enough to ignore me.

I recently helped win a match on Chapel where I got downed behind the rock while my team was pushing in for the objective, I was able to self revive and under fire I managed to revive my team mates. Had I had less health this would have been less viable. I would have had to waste my only healing pulse and not be able to heal my buddies after I got them up.

Often times Phoenix needs to get right back into the fray when self reviving. However you seriously need to stop comparing it to regular revives. Self revive takes a fair amount of seconds to go off, regular revives can be quick or charged for the majority of health back if not full health. He can be gibbed easily during this time and if he wastes his only self revive it goes on a full minute of cooldown. That’s way too long for it to not be as effective as possible if he pulls it off.

In short just gib Phoenix and you render his self revive useless but don’t say that you need to nerf a merc because of the way some people play him. Bad medics will be bad medics no matter what and you will have selfish Sawbonez, Sniper sparks, hoppy shotgun Aura and assault Phoenix forever.

EDIT: Clearly you do have a problem with his self revive as you keep asking for a nerf, so that part is pretty much a lie.[/quote]

Okay I can see you point, but you still protect Phoenix way to much, just because he is you main merc it doesn’t mean that you need to protect him as much as you do. One of my main merc’s are Aura, and in some ways I can see she is some what op.
And hey mate 1 min is not vary long.
But when i get 50k I will by Phoenix and check him more out and then I will test if he really need that full hp. Because when I were play him when he were free to play I didn’t see the need for him to have full hp. and I still don’t see the reason for it.

(cornJester) #18

[quote=“Hardru;94343”][quote=“cornJester;94314”][quote=“Hardru;94306”]Cornjester Would you like to listen for a moment. There are 3 kind of support classes. There are engineers, medics and ammo dealers. In the medic class there are 4 merc’s. Sawbonez, Aura, Sparks and of cause Phoenix. All of them got abilities that makes them unique. And like I have said, (many times time now,) I got no problem’s with Phoenixes self revive, but for some reason do you keep say over and over that he needs full health, and no he doesn’t. Merc’s there are not medic don’t need full health for they do not have those kind a abilities. So why does Phoenix need full health. And it is not like that Phoenix only can self revive and get 20% hp no that would not be fair. That’s why I say give him 75% hp when he self revive because that would make people think more when they are playing Phoenix. when Phoenix first got free to play nearly no one were playing him as a medic, more like a assault. that is why I want him nerfed so people will play him more as a medic.
I once play on a team with 4 Phoenixes, and no one, and I mean NO ONE, played him as a medic and they were around the lvl. 8-14. So can you see now why I want him nerfed.[/quote]
Hardru, I have listened, now listen to me. I play Phoenix as a medic. Phoenix lets me do something that other medics cannot and this provides a unique gameplay mechanic. What I am talking about is I can push in with a wave, get downed and get back up to save my team under fire, if and only if the enemy is stupid enough to ignore me.

I recently helped win a match on Chapel where I got downed behind the rock while my team was pushing in for the objective, I was able to self revive and under fire I managed to revive my team mates. Had I had less health this would have been less viable. I would have had to waste my only healing pulse and not be able to heal my buddies after I got them up.

Often times Phoenix needs to get right back into the fray when self reviving. However you seriously need to stop comparing it to regular revives. Self revive takes a fair amount of seconds to go off, regular revives can be quick or charged for the majority of health back if not full health. He can be gibbed easily during this time and if he wastes his only self revive it goes on a full minute of cooldown. That’s way too long for it to not be as effective as possible if he pulls it off.

In short just gib Phoenix and you render his self revive useless but don’t say that you need to nerf a merc because of the way some people play him. Bad medics will be bad medics no matter what and you will have selfish Sawbonez, Sniper sparks, hoppy shotgun Aura and assault Phoenix forever.

EDIT: Clearly you do have a problem with his self revive as you keep asking for a nerf, so that part is pretty much a lie.[/quote]

Okay I can see you point, but you still protect Phoenix way to much, just because he is you main merc it doesn’t mean that you need to protect him as much as you do. One of my main merc’s are Aura, and in some ways I can see she is some what op.
And hey mate 1 min is not vary long.
But when i get 50k I will by Phoenix and check him more out and then I will test if he really need that full hp. Because when I were play him when he were free to play I didn’t see the need for him to have full hp. and I still don’t see the reason for it.[/quote]

Phoenix isn’t even my main merc. My main merc is Phantom and incidentally I have seen him overnerfed and made unbalanced due to that and I don’t want that to happen again. 1 minute is definitely very long in a first person shooter… I am defending him because I hate seeing nerfs that are not needed. Even if I hate the merc and they frustrate the crap out of me I wont ask for a nerf unless they 100% need it. I do not feel this nerf is warranted as I feel Phoenix is balanced.

(Hardru) #19

[quote=“cornJester;94350”][quote=“Hardru;94343”][quote=“cornJester;94314”][quote=“Hardru;94306”]Cornjester Would you like to listen for a moment. There are 3 kind of support classes. There are engineers, medics and ammo dealers. In the medic class there are 4 merc’s. Sawbonez, Aura, Sparks and of cause Phoenix. All of them got abilities that makes them unique. And like I have said, (many times time now,) I got no problem’s with Phoenixes self revive, but for some reason do you keep say over and over that he needs full health, and no he doesn’t. Merc’s there are not medic don’t need full health for they do not have those kind a abilities. So why does Phoenix need full health. And it is not like that Phoenix only can self revive and get 20% hp no that would not be fair. That’s why I say give him 75% hp when he self revive because that would make people think more when they are playing Phoenix. when Phoenix first got free to play nearly no one were playing him as a medic, more like a assault. that is why I want him nerfed so people will play him more as a medic.
I once play on a team with 4 Phoenixes, and no one, and I mean NO ONE, played him as a medic and they were around the lvl. 8-14. So can you see now why I want him nerfed.[/quote]
Hardru, I have listened, now listen to me. I play Phoenix as a medic. Phoenix lets me do something that other medics cannot and this provides a unique gameplay mechanic. What I am talking about is I can push in with a wave, get downed and get back up to save my team under fire, if and only if the enemy is stupid enough to ignore me.

I recently helped win a match on Chapel where I got downed behind the rock while my team was pushing in for the objective, I was able to self revive and under fire I managed to revive my team mates. Had I had less health this would have been less viable. I would have had to waste my only healing pulse and not be able to heal my buddies after I got them up.

Often times Phoenix needs to get right back into the fray when self reviving. However you seriously need to stop comparing it to regular revives. Self revive takes a fair amount of seconds to go off, regular revives can be quick or charged for the majority of health back if not full health. He can be gibbed easily during this time and if he wastes his only self revive it goes on a full minute of cooldown. That’s way too long for it to not be as effective as possible if he pulls it off.

In short just gib Phoenix and you render his self revive useless but don’t say that you need to nerf a merc because of the way some people play him. Bad medics will be bad medics no matter what and you will have selfish Sawbonez, Sniper sparks, hoppy shotgun Aura and assault Phoenix forever.

EDIT: Clearly you do have a problem with his self revive as you keep asking for a nerf, so that part is pretty much a lie.[/quote]

Okay I can see you point, but you still protect Phoenix way to much, just because he is you main merc it doesn’t mean that you need to protect him as much as you do. One of my main merc’s are Aura, and in some ways I can see she is some what op.
And hey mate 1 min is not vary long.
But when i get 50k I will by Phoenix and check him more out and then I will test if he really need that full hp. Because when I were play him when he were free to play I didn’t see the need for him to have full hp. and I still don’t see the reason for it.[/quote]

Phoenix isn’t even my main merc. My main merc is Phantom and incidentally I have seen him overnerfed and made unbalanced due to that and I don’t want that to happen again. 1 minute is definitely very long in a first person shooter… I am defending him because I hate seeing nerfs that are not needed. Even if I hate the merc and they frustrate the crap out of me I wont ask for a nerf unless they 100% need it. I do not feel this nerf is warranted as I feel Phoenix is balanced.[/quote]

And that’s is cool, but at the moment we can not come to any middle way. So why not just stop the argument here, and call it a day because we are not getting any where. People I talk with is saying the same thing as I, and people you are talking with is surely saying the same thing as you.

(watsyurdeal) #20

Phoneix’s self revive is so easy to counter though, like hella easy.

And yet you want a nerf…get the hell out of here.