Merc and Weapon balancing ideas


(x3onn) #1

Hello, I made a list of changes I would personally do to mercs and primary weapons. I’ve been playing the game since open beta started, and I think I know pretty well how the small competitive scene feels about the balancing in Dirty Bomb. Even if I say this, these changes only represent my own point of view. I mainly play 5v5 so these changes are more focused on that. Any feedback is welcome, I’d like to hear what you think and what would you change about my list!

MERCS

broken tier: thunder
god tier: vassili, redeye, sparks
great tier: fletcher, aura, aimee, kira
good tier: arty, nader, fragger, sawbonez, phoenix, phantom, rhino
bad tier: skyhammer, bushwacker, proxy, stoker

PRIMARY WEAPONS

broken tier: MoA, felix
god tier: stark, br-16, grandeour
great tier: crotzni, m4, dreiss, pdp, k121, blishlok, hollunds
good tier: timik, smg-9, hochfir, kek, remburg, ahnuhld
bad tier: MK46

BALANCE CHANGE SUGGESTIONS

MERCS

thunder: reduce his HP back to 160. reduce the max flash duration from 4sec to 1sec. increase the recharge time for conc nade from 15 to 20.
redeye: reduce the smoke duration from 12sec to 6sec.
sparks: change the revive gun from an ability to a primary weapon. remove the ability to ress with the gun and remove the dmg falloff from the gun, give her defibillators and remove her pistol.
fletcher: increase the sticky bomb recharge time from 7sec to 9sec. reduce the splash damage from sticky bombs by 30% and keep direct hit dmg the same, 100.
aura: start the cooldown recharing after the old station is broken, not after she puts one on the ground.
nader: increase the grenade launcher recharge time from 7sec to 8sec.
fragger: increase the grenade recharge time from 17sec to 20sec.
skyhammer: reduce the airstrike cooldown from 70sec to 60sec outdoors, and reduce the indoor cooldown from 19sec to 15sec.
bushwacker: reduce the turret cooldown from 30sec to 25sec.
proxy: make the proximity mines invulnerable after throwing them out for 2sec.
kira: increase the laser cooldown by 5sec, from 50 to 55.
arty: fix the bug where he can destroy ammo and healing station through walls by arty striking close to them.

WEAPONS

MoA&felix: reduce bodyshot damage by 33% and increase headshot multiplier to 3x (felix from 79 to 53, MoA from 75 to 50)
stark&br-16: reduce bullet damage (stark bodydmg from 18 to 15, headshot dmg from 36 to 30) (BR-16 bodydmg from 17 to 15, headshot dmg from 34 to 30)
grandeour: reduce bullet damage from 40 to 37 (headshot dmg from 80 to 74)
MK46: increase bullet damage from 11 to 12 (headshot dmg from 22 to 24)


(ImSploosh) #2

No… Just no.

EDIT: Some of these look like decent balance suggestions, but then others are just insane… Remove Sparks’ revivr? Then remove the damage falloff. You’re looking to make it a hipfiring sniper rifle, 100% accuracy, the ability to shoot faster than a sniper too. Wtf.


(x3onn) #3

That’s just one idea. I don’t think the ability to revive from range should be in the game. She didn’t use to have any falloff damage in her gun, so I was thinking reverting that change to give her better chance at killing people from afar now that she wouldn’t be able to revive from afar. My idea might not be great, just throwing it out there. I’d like to hear other ideas, specially ones that include removing the reviving from range!


(n-x) #4

Just a question about the weapon tiers. It seemed that everybody agreed on Kek10 as the best SMG. Whats the reasoning behind putting Crotzni and even Blishlok above it. From my impression there are a lot of people who say, the Blishlok is the worst SMG (I am not agreeing with that)


(x3onn) #5

About Kek vs Blishlok, I think they’re pretty equal. Blishlok is just unique, it has a lot potential if you’re able to hit headshots constantly. Kek is too similar to Crotzni in many ways, and I’d take Crotzni any day over it. I still use all the 3 primary weapons (Kek, Blishlok, smg-9) when I’m playing Bushwacker for example, they’re really similar in strength. Most competitive players agree that Crotzni is the strongest SMG.


(STARRYSOCK) #6

[quote=“ImSploosh;c-224703”]No… Just no.

EDIT: Some of these look like decent balance suggestions, but then others are just insane… Remove Sparks’ revivr? Then remove the damage falloff. You’re looking to make it a hipfiring sniper rifle, 100% accuracy, the ability to shoot faster than a sniper too. Wtf.[/quote]

I agree. You’re talking about changing Sparks from a long range medic to an OP sniper with medic abilities, lol.
I agree Sparks can be godlike in the right hands, but she’s already very difficult to learn for most players. Nerfing her would make her even less desirable to most in casual play, so I’d honestly just rather they leave her as-is.

Tbh I actually feel the opposite on a lot of what OP suggests. I’d rather see snipers removed from the game (along with most other one-hit kill items like shotguns). I’m not even talking about the noobs that instantly buy snipers, but the fact that getting instantly killed from across the map feels very cheap. It’s not that it doesn’t take skill, but imo the game is a lot more fun when there are no snipers on either team.
People should have a chance to fight back, and punishing players who would rather play low-health mercs with even more random instant kills doesn’t make the game more enjoyable, it makes the game more frustrating, especially after losing a battle that you clearly should have won, just because a random vassili kills you from afar or whatever.


(ostmustis) #7

[quote=“STARRYSOCK;c-224710”]
I agree. You’re talking about changing Sparks from a long range medic to an OP sniper with medic abilities, lol.
I agree Sparks can be godlike in the right hands, but she’s already very difficult to learn for most players. Nerfing her would make her even less desirable to most in casual play, so I’d honestly just rather they leave her as-is.

Tbh I actually feel the opposite on a lot of what OP suggests. I’d rather see snipers removed from the game (along with most other one-hit kill items like shotguns). I’m not even talking about the noobs that instantly buy snipers, but the fact that getting instantly killed from across the map feels very cheap. It’s not that it doesn’t take skill, but imo the game is a lot more fun when there are no snipers on either team.
People should have a chance to fight back, and punishing players who would rather play low-health mercs with even more random instant kills doesn’t make the game more enjoyable, it makes the game more frustrating, especially after losing a battle that you clearly should have won, just because a random vassili kills you from afar or whatever.[/quote]

Sparks already is a snipper with op medical abilities. >:)

I agree about the snippers, they are ruining the fun for everybody, except for other snippers, in the game. Please remove!


(averagerussian) #8

Most of these things would be good for the competitive scene, although i would balance some of them differently. However pub players won’t be able to play those mercs anymore apparently, that’s why they disagree. The game wouldn’t be as casual anymore and people always freak out if something is slightly underpowered or harder to play. Instead they’re fine with making everything stronger.
I also think it’s hilarious to call this tier list retarded when all you play is public and never witnessed top players play.


(Melinder) #9

@averagerussian you clearly have no idea who I am.


(Szakalot) #10

let me grab by ego detector…

...its over 9000!

(STARRYSOCK) #11

No need to be rude. Sure, a lot of OP’s suggestions are extreme, but it doesn’t mean you have to act like kids. Say why you think their opinion is retarded instead of whining.

As they said, they want to hear your ideas, not random pointless name-calling. I don’t personally agree with OP, but come on. Really?


(x3onn) #12

[quote=“STARRYSOCK;c-224710”]Tbh I actually feel the opposite on a lot of what OP suggests. I’d rather see snipers removed from the game (along with most other one-hit kill items like shotguns). I’m not even talking about the noobs that instantly buy snipers, but the fact that getting instantly killed from across the map feels very cheap. It’s not that it doesn’t take skill, but imo the game is a lot more fun when there are no snipers on either team.
People should have a chance to fight back, and punishing players who would rather play low-health mercs with even more random instant kills doesn’t make the game more enjoyable, it makes the game more frustrating, especially after losing a battle that you clearly should have won, just because a random vassili kills you from afar or whatever…[/quote]

I’d remove all 1 shot mechanics from the game if that could happen :smiley:
I agree with you completely about this.


(x3onn) #13

[quote=“ImSploosh;c-224703”]No… Just no.

EDIT: Some of these look like decent balance suggestions, but then others are just insane… Remove Sparks’ revivr? Then remove the damage falloff. You’re looking to make it a hipfiring sniper rifle, 100% accuracy, the ability to shoot faster than a sniper too. Wtf.[/quote]

It was just a suggestion to compensate losing the ability to revive from her gun. You know she didn’t use to have any falloff dmg for long time, so that nerf could be reverted. My Sparks suggestion isn’t really realistic and I know that, I just personally wish there was no long range revives in the game, in first place. Thanks for you feedback anyways


(GatoCommodore) #14

[quote=“x3onn;c-224734”][quote=“ImSploosh;c-224703”]No… Just no.

EDIT: Some of these look like decent balance suggestions, but then others are just insane… Remove Sparks’ revivr? Then remove the damage falloff. You’re looking to make it a hipfiring sniper rifle, 100% accuracy, the ability to shoot faster than a sniper too. Wtf.[/quote]

It was just a suggestion to compensate losing the ability to revive from her gun. You know she didn’t use to have any falloff dmg for long time, so that nerf could be reverted. My Sparks suggestion isn’t really realistic and I know that, I just personally wish there was no long range revives in the game, in first place. Thanks for you feedback anyways[/quote]

she doesnt have a scope either.
shes simply invincible death machine before the nerf.
All Range medic that can one shot.

you can one shot today, but not at long range, and not with good amount of risk.
i think SD will need to revert the nerf slowly to cope in with the people’s growing skill.


(Xyfurion) #15

ESSAY INCOMING!!!

@x3onn Honestly, I think you are right about some stuff, but other suggestions are utterly absurd.

bad tier: MK46

Are you serious?! Have you used the MK46 to a decent extent? The MK46 has beautiful ADS, low spread and moderate recoil, very accurate, high Rate of Fire, decent to high damage. It’s literally a bullet hose. I understand you want to fix/nerf Thunder, but going for his gun is the exact wrong way to do it.

bad tier: -snip- stoker

I’m biased (Stoker main) so it hurts to say that his damage ability right now is low (haven’t checked out the latest update) albeit his high damage potential. His molotov should be improved to promote area denial and prevent players from going through the flames without suffering much consequence.

fragger: increase the grenade recharge time from 17sec to 20sec.

Fragger was nerfed a while back (some time late-2015) bringing his grenade count down from 2 to 1 and his cooldown from 30 to 17. Bringing the cooldown back up, albeit by 3 seconds, will just be a handicap.

proxy: make the proximity mines invulnerable after throwing them out for 2sec.

Yes, please god yes!

skyhammer: reduce the airstrike cooldown from 70sec to 60sec outdoors, and reduce the indoor cooldown from 19sec to 15sec.
kira: increase the laser cooldown by 5sec, from 50 to 55.

Honestly, I think Skyhammer and Kira’s abilities should have the same cooldown: 55 seconds for consistency. Skyhammer’s indoors is not too bad though. Would welcome a 4 second cooldown reduction.

sparks: change the revive gun from an ability to a primary weapon. remove the ability to ress with the gun and remove the damage falloff from the gun, give her defibrillators and remove her pistol.

No. None of this. Sparks is a gimmick. If there is a good Sparks on your team, it forces the enemy team to gib your teammates. The revive fall-off and damage fall-off is fine. If the REVIVR became the primary and was reverted to previous numbers, no one would use her as a medic. She has medkits to heal herself and a god damn pocket-PDP.

fletcher: increase the sticky bomb recharge time from 7sec to 9sec. reduce the splash damage from sticky bombs by 30% and keep direct hit dmg the same, 100.

iirc, the already reduced the splash damage to 80 and kept the direct at 100.

aura: start the cooldown recharging after the old station is broken, not after she puts one on the ground.

This one is iffy since I can see both the reasoning for and against this.
For:
When you destroy it in a choke point, the enemy aura can put down another one leaving you with cooldowns on your grenades. This would stop that; a really good idea.

Against:
Will have to change it for Bushwacker turrets as well as all deployables for consistency.
What about reclaiming?

redeye: reduce the smoke duration from 12sec to 6sec.

Not that drastic, come on. Maybe something like 9-10 seconds.

thunder: reduce his HP back to 160. reduce the max flash duration from 4 sec to 1sec. increase the recharge time for concussion grenade from 15 to 20.

I would honestly bring the cooldown up to 19-20 seconds. The max flash duration remains at 3.5 seconds, but the concussion should not hinder you nearly as much (ie. you should be able to wall-jump, gtfo, and in general, avoid Thunder while concussed).


(The_True_mo) #16

Leave sparks out, i like the rest of the changes. Sounds like it would balance alot out so we dont go down the path > Merc 1 cancels Merc 2 but Merc 3 cancels Merc 1 < bullshit.


(neverplayseriou) #17

I agree on everything except for some of the weapons and their place on the tier list, and would personally also like to see Kira’s laser get an ever longer cd time than what you suggested here.

Better ideas than Splash Damage has had over the last 2 years.

@Smooth @stayfreshshoe @Exedore might wanna take some player suggestions for once :wink:


(chimaira92) #18

Bring it on!


(LifeupOmega) #19

Would be nice to shake up the balance of this game a bit, Sparks is iffy but I also hate her entire design anyway. Would rather see the Revivr be a heal/hurt ala Crusader’s Crossbow than rev/hurt, give her default defibs.

Snipers can go fuck themselves regardless of what happens.


(GatoCommodore) #20

[quote=“LifeupOmega;c-224854”]Would be nice to shake up the balance of this game a bit, Sparks is iffy but I also hate her entire design anyway. Would rather see the Revivr be a heal/hurt ala Crusader’s Crossbow than rev/hurt, give her default defibs.

Snipers can go @$!# themselves regardless of what happens.[/quote]

This.

Probably even more cool if the normal click would also shoots bolts instead of charging it