Map Tactics...Attacking Fuel Dump...

(puubert) #1

I don’t know if this has been done before but too fucking bad.

Let’s discuss some map tactics, for Allies on Fuel Dump. If this goes over well I’ll come back with some others.

Imagine you are a General commanding the dozen troops sent to blow the Axis Fuel Dump. How do they do it?

Personally, Fuel Dump is THE map that needs teamwork. Without, Allies can falter big time. I think that’s a major factor in why Allies find it so hard to win this map.

For getting the tank to the depot, I think you need good Med support and Engys constantly repairing the tank. Every spawn your Engys need to run to the tank and fix it.

Most teams can get the tank to the Depot alright, but blowing the Depot befuddles them. You NEED to have your entire team entering the base, from the side wall breach. This is critical. It’s furthest from Axis spawn and you only have a little over 90 degrees FOV to defend instead of 270 with the main entrance.

Make sure you have at least 75% of your team entering the depot at the same time, each time. 30%-40% will get swamped time and time again. You need enough troops to kill every Axis in the base.

Now comes the tricky part, getting your covert off the hill and getting him to blow the Defences. If your Engy is planting dyno at the defences, then you need to rev the shit out of your Covert/s.

If you can wipe out the defense inside the Depot, then satchel the defences, you should have planted (depending on spawntime) by the time your see anymore Axis, and they still have to kill all of you to defuse.

By no means foolproof. A good Axis defense can hold the Depot indefinately, but I can’t see another way of doing it.

And please, forget the Covert/Engy shortcut exists. That’s not really a tactic, because you need an element of luck in order to complete it, and it defeats the purpose of this post.

(polka) #2

Some very good points here.

I’ll add some of my own opinions of this sometimes very frustrating map.

Right from the start the only important thing is to get the bridge built and the tank across.
I have never seen it done (only on goldrush to get the tiger rolling in record time) but I recon it would work wonders if like 80%-90% of the team went engineer at the beginning of the map until the bridge was built and tank passed it.

The tank is crucial and its not only the engineers job to keep it rolling.
Way too often I see people scattered across the map and that lone engineer repair the tank only to be killed and the tank spammed to a pile of junk again resulting in exactly no ground gained in that engineers spawn cycle…

Nothing more frustrating for an engineer than to sacrifice himself to repair the tank when noone bother to keep it moving once he gets killed.

I also agree with that basicly the entire team should rush the base.
An exception might be a good gunner in the tank (if its not broken) as he can keep the depot roof clear and weaken/kill the axis when they run from spawn to the west defences where the main attack should concentrate.

And all coverts who are sitting with their thumbs up their asses on sniper hill and not participating in those attacks are basicly helping the axis win the map imho…
Spotting mines, blowing the depot defences and laying down smoke is top priority.

I often find myself repeating these two lines during frustrating rounds of fuel depot =)

“Pretty please, with sugar on top, help escort the damn tank”

“EVERYONE needs to rush the base NOW”

(Kendle) #3

I mostly hate Fueldump, but it depends whether you’re playing it on a Campaign server or Stopwatch.

The first thing to do is get the Tank to the Bridge and build it (not necessarily in that order mind you). On a Campaign server this can be extremely difficult if Axis have a couple of LVL3+ Field Ops (which they probably will), as they can lay down Arty on the Bridge build boxes almost continuously. On Stopwatch this isn’t so much of a problem.

One of two scenarios is likely to occur. Either Allies get the Tank over the Bridge and blow the tunnel doors in reasonably good time, or they don’t and get spawn-raped. The key to achieving the former is lots of Engys and Meds. Unfortunately all too often Allies will have too many Coverts trying to Snipe from a safe distance, and not enough Engys to do the job.

Having got the Tank to the Depot it’s usually not too difficult to blow the main gate and the side wall, however getting in and blowing the Dump is another story. It’s far too easy for an average defence to hold back a strong attack on this map. The key to Allied success, as Puubert points out, is using a Covert to satchell the defences. If the Engy has to dyno the defences AND the Dump he ain’t gonna do it unless the Axis are completely useless, as it means defending 2 x 30 second plants against Axis that will re-spawn 2 or 3 times before the Dump is blown.

So the key to this map, for Allies, is Engy and Med heavy at the beginning, and a Covert willing to do more than Snipe once the Depot is breached. Neither of these happens that often on publics, and throw Campaign into the mix and this becomes an extremely difficult map for Allies to win.

(ETplayer) #4

do not forget , covert ops can be VERY VERY IMPORTANT on this map.

They are crucial for spotting mines, if u dont have the mines spot…

I can tell you, u cant even enter the base, the first half of ur team gets done by mines and the other half gets slaughterd by mp40 fire.

A good mix of classes is also very important, i have seen games with 6 medics and 4 engineers. Thats not gonna cut it, because medics need ammo 2 survive.{ etc etc }
So, if u want good teamplay. U have to mix all the elements of the game in.

Just my 2€ cents :drink:

(Wasted!) #5

A tactic that might work better (though I never tested it), once you have savaged the depot and a covert and an engineer are still alive next to a pile of dead axis bodies, is to not blow up the defenses but grab an uniform and go through the roof.
The engineer jumps on top of the fuel dump and then behind it (this way avoiding mines) and plants, while the covert remains on the roof and guards the trapdoor (which is the only way by which an axis engineer can go to defuse, since the defenses are still in place), maybe with a satchel or just shooting at the people coming up the ladder, which should be easy targets.
If there are other allies still alive, they can remain guarding the door to the roof from the inside. If there’s another engie he can place a few landmines in front of the 2 doors downstairs, or even better on the roof (if that’s possible… I never tried placing mines there, now that I think of it, but I’ve seen them on top of the building with the allies command post and it’s similar so I guess it’s possible)
I’m not sure about what the engineer that planted should do after that… maybe plant again (if he’s engie enough for it aka he’s got the bar to do it) or maybe hide and ambush incoming engies… or just throw granades over the defense, where there’ll probably be axis doing the same.

(joop sloop) #6

I once played an axis engineer and got (along with half my team) wiped out. After respawn I waasn’t able to even leave the spawn area, caus we were mown down by an allied soldier who sneakily placed his MG42 under the roof near the depot side wall breach… All we could do was wait and see the depot get blown to bits… :confused:

I then tried many times to replay this tactic but never succeeded in pulling this of, cause I never get any teammates to foloow me and defend me and the covert + engie…

(pgh) #7

This has got to be the most used tactic. Its been done since day one when the Fueldump demo/ettest was released. Ever more fun is to place a decent enough CovOps on roof guarding door with a Rifle pointed charged straight at the door… Click Open Headshot.

Best use imo is, Engy (Fuel Dump)/Cov (Sniping from Roof > Spawn Exits with Satchel at Hatch thing) to Depot… Fops on roof facing spawn exit from above MG/Main Gate side door (SMG Headshot constant to outgoing axis/Artying the stairs incase they get balls :D), a Soldier pref Panzer/Flamethrower at other spawn exit (Lower one) with a Medic in between. With 6 a team use a 2nd Engy for the second plant while one wanders Fuel Dump other backs up Solly/Fops/Medic. Kablam! :>

Voice comms all round and your sorted :>

(Kendle) #8

And you’re either going to set this all up in 15 seconds (average time till next Axis spawn) or Axis are going to just go grab a coffee or something while you get in position?

Any map is winnable if the defence are that bad! :disgust:

(fledsbo) #9

The key to get through the side entrance and the camping MG’er inside is plenty of smoke. So you need to have enough covops to both smoke heavily, and someone with a fresh chargebar to blow the defenses.

fledsbo

(PH@TIE) #10

The only way you will get the Dump blown, as has been said numerous times here, is to RUSH the base.

You’ll never get even close in 2’s and 3’s. Especially if they have a level 3+ Panzer Soldier. He recharges soooooo quick, your already dead. Plus he’s got an MP40 as well.

A well placed can of “woopass” or two over the wall is often enuff to break up any Axis not kamping up high, followed by a determined push, by everyone. (Meds in last to revive any mine casualties).

(SylverDragon) #11

I agree with the general sentiment, the allies have to rush those boxes on the first spawn, or they risk getting locked down before the bridge. The only thing I would add is, if you have a large enough team (8 or so), and the axis look like they are going to try and come down to the boxes and control them, have 1 or 2 guys (FO and Medic preferably) go the back way, down into the river, and then up the axis side of the bank (there’s one spot where you can get up and over, you hit the barb-wire, but it gets you up). Never build the footbridge, it just warns the axis that you are comming.
Once up there, the allies should try and take control of the MG tower, which the axis have conviently built for you, and use it to clear the axis off the boxes. At the same time, the second ally back there should try and pick off any FO’s standing on the upper walkway, to stop the barrage of artillery. While the allies in the back may not last long, just forcing most of the axis into limbo, and delaying them for a bit can be enough time for a couple of engy’s to build the bridge.
Of course, this takes some coordination on the part of the allied team, which is tough to get on a public server, but if you manage to pull it off you can force the axis back on thier heels for a moment or two.

(Ferrolux) #12

Fueldump seems to me to be a bit of a double edged sword for the allies. One one hand it can be a bit frustrating because they don’t win that much: looking back through fueldump auto screenshots (almost exclusively from the SD server) axis have 5 wins for every 2 allied wins. I think it feels that axis win more often than that because when axis win the games are longer. On the other hand, I would rate a winning plant on fueldump to be the most satisfying engineer task in the standard maps.

Previous posters have covered all the main points -In my experience allies tend to win in two ways

(a) blow grate, forget about the tank. Axis stick with the forward spawn point and amuse themselves attacking the bridge build point, allied spawn and mining the tank, etc. Meanwhile an allied engineer slips through with a covert ops (easy to get uniforms at this stage) to find an undefended base. Axis never get back to the base in time.

However, this won’t work if ,for example, Brevik is on the Axis team because as soon as the grate is blown you’ll find that the defense are built, doorways mined and you get gunned down from the balconies. In that case :

(b) get tank to fueldump. get engineer + cvops into base (if you can get three people to work together a medic is the ideal extra) - wall breach is easiest. don’t need a uniform beforehand since if you wait by the roof door an axis always turns up. engineer goes onto roof and plants two sticks on top of each other in the centre of the fueldump (very hard to defuse in correct order), cvops holds axis back at hatch just long enough so that the axis engineer gets blown by the dynamite

(a) won’t work if axis team know what they are doing. (b) is difficult but, in my experience, most successful. blowing the defences is an easier way to plant but axis tend to defuse.

If allies could spawn in garage once command post is built the map would be transformed.

(orangeboy) #13

as sometimes occurs, you can find the main gate blown and axis holding their own very well, as an eng i find i can manage to sneak in to the fuel dump area at least a couple of times in a match (take the small gap between the boxes) to the west side.

if it remains quiet (and if axis are holding the allies back to near spawn it usually is) you can litter the approach to the west gate with mines, then plant and hide. the mines normally take out the first wave of axis, and with luck you can plant at the depot.

(Fusen) #14

what also works if your the lone engineer on a crap team go to west mine the corner of the fuel dump by the wall breach and then make a row of mines just before the defenses then plant at defenses and hide behind the trees, you’ll get the engineers come and blown by the mines the medics will get hurt then just pop out and couple headshots clears the area then by then you should be able to plant another , then mine the gap in the defenses which was just blown and get against the west wall and lean then just nades when they come near you

Fc50

(Fusen) #15

lol just read orangeboys post… oops =X

Medical marijuana seeds

(bluechibi) #16

Ah the big map. I’ve done this so often.

I think someone mentioned that the main focus should be on the bridge and the tank, forget everything else for now. This is true, if you don’t have enough engineers from the start then you will be pushed back and may end up stuck in respawn. I’m one of those individuals who tends to have to do everything in the games I’m in. One annoying thing is, there might be 5 other engineers in my team but when I zoom to do the bridge, they instantly expect me to do the whole thing myself. The more engineers there are the more quickly it gets done. As mentioned before, it’s usually a case that the lonely engineer runs up to try and do the thing and instantly gets killed either by the thunder of airstrikes everywhere or the nazis coming from the gate.

Once the tank is over the bridge it still isn’t over, you have to make sure it blows the doors, and until then the axis will stay respawning in that area. Depending how good the other team are, you may have to sneak in the tunnel and run through their respawn kill anyone around and fix the tank. This I have done quite a few times and you get a very rewarding feeling especially as your teammates are being slaughtered to death at respawn and your actions have changed the entire situation of the game.

Once they’re in the compound by then all the mines are already laid, if the engineers are smart they’ll place mines both inside and outside. In this situation a medic is a real lifesaver or someone will need to sacrifice themselves.

If you can’t do a sneak attack, with a covert op and an engineer going through the roof. Then you’re best chance is to get the axis to focus on the main gate. Covert ops and engineers can always slip in through the side and hide. One good thing to do as an engineer if you have time, is to place mines just around the corners and doorway and near the gate itself. I’ve done this a of times. When the nazis see the other side of the fence is gone they rush over to stop the allies, of course most of the time they aren’t expect allied mines on their side. So while they’re blown away you are free to drop the dynamite. This can still work if the engineer hsa to blow both the fence and the fuel thingie, But of course without a covert op or a handy medic nearby your chances of winning are very slim.

A lot of the games I do, everyone is more interested in their own thing, I hardly see any teamwork. Probably because most of the players either speak French, German or Korean which I guess can be excused, so a lot of the time the axis face a couple of attacks one after the other rather than one big one.

Not sure how affective snipering is at the far back. Usually I just run through the side tunnel, throw some grenades, shoot some axis running out the tunnel. Hide around the corner from the side entrance then run inside when I notice axis running towards the tank.

As much as I would love teamwork a lot of the games I do there is none at all. Which is a shame as the games would be so much better. :slight_smile:

(GlUeYeS1) #17

this doesnt work often but when it does game over very quickly (and im not talking about a cov ops with a uni) assuming your playing shrubmode once tunnel grade is busted run to the fueldepot 2 of u and u can boost an engineer over side wall…While the rest of the team keep axis busy by
building bridge and repairing tank

(FireFly) #18

I’ve had some succes with this tactic:
As allied Cvops (with uniform) go onto the roof, now instead of staying on the roof, jump off and hide Behind the fueldump… Now try to hide between the 2 pipes and start looking at your command map. When a allied eng is on his way / is near the fueldump blow one of the two fueldump-gates and immediately return to your hide out spot between the pipes. Now if the engi doesn’t reach the fueldump don’t worry: An axis engineer will do his duty and repair the gate while other axis are inspecting the roof wondering where the hell that cops went that blown the gates from ontop the roof.Stay at your hiding-spot between the pipes and they will never spot you!

:smiley:

(pgh) #19

And you’re either going to set this all up in 15 seconds (average time till next Axis spawn) or Axis are going to just go grab a coffee or something while you get in position?

Any map is winnable if the defence are that bad! :disgust:[/quote]

Aye, nps. If I can be arsed ill look out some demos :slight_smile: - but tbh, all you need is a decent enuff aiming Fops with an arty at spawn exit/s and theres more than enough time. And, I guess from ur clan play you dont do groups, eg, 3 peeps meet one side other 3 other then attack at same time? Using TS or the likes means you can do this no problem… try it.

(The Wanderer) #20

I think the main problem with fuel dump and gold rush too is the fact that people expect the engineers to both repair AND escort the tank. This is the main reason why most of the time the allies fail on these maps. Many times in gold rush I rush in the base and as I’m being mowed left and right by literally hundreds of krauts, and barely seeing from all the blood dripping all over my face, I manage with my last breath to twist those pliers one more time and finish repairing the tank, but then I die before stealing it. Then I immediately message: “quick someone steal it”. But of course nobody bothers to go in and just run by the tank so it moves, because they’re obviously too busy fondling each other’s balls. So the axis damage the tank and i have to do it all over again.

It’s the same thing in fuel dump. It’s very hard to repair the tank after it crosses the bridge. But if there are a few allies around it drawing fire, it’s much easier for the engi to repair it and even if he dies, someone else can then move the tank. Most of the time however you only see one engi running towards the tank with his pliers out, and then the 10 axis around the tank take him out before he even crosses the bridge.

Moral: EVERYONE should move the tank, and even when the tank is broken you should stick around it to draw fire and make it safe for the engi to repair it. If the tank reaches it’s final position before 15 min than the allies have a very good chance of winning.