MAP DEBATE

(Weffy) #1

First of all does anyone from Splash Damage ever answer any questions here?

Ok here’s the thing. I play on a server and we’re having a debate on a particular map and what the admins say and what most of the players say. The map is Fuel Dump. When trying to get the tank across the bridge you have an opportunity to get across to attack all the snipers, field ops and mortar boys by jumping the barbed wire fence.

Now the admins seem to think this is illegal and is considered a trick jump. I personally don’t think that at all. What I want to know is did Splash Damage overlook this or is it in there as another route to the other side of the bridge. I can’t imagine they overlooked something so obvious. It takes no special skill to get across and you pay the price. Seems deliberate to me. Please answer this question so we can put this to rest.

(Salteh) #2

When we played the ET test version on the Splash Damage server, some of the SD employees used the jump_over_barbed_wire thing too… so I guess they knew about it :).

(Lanz) #3

I would be surprised if SD didn’t know and allow that to be possible, first you don’t build the bridge primarly for soldiers to get past it, the primary objective is to get the tank over it. If you as a player get over to that side without building anything so what? Second, to actually call something a trick jump you would expect it to actually take more than mere basic skills, that jump is hardly complicated for anyone. Finally it comes with a price, you lose health doing so.

The oasis wall jump is a different story, I dont think they where aware of the possibility to jump it, and if they had knowned about it they would have fixed it. Just as an example.

(Sick Boy) #4

I think they not only knew about the oasis walljump, but specifically designed it to be possible. But please correct me if I’m wrong SD :stuck_out_tongue:

You don’t even need to jump for getting across the river in fueldump so it can hardly be called a trickjump.

(faltytower) #5

That is not trickjumping; it’s called using your brain to play the game.

Oh, FYI: Trickjumping is a by-product of the OpenGL library. John Carmack had to insert codes to remove it (seeing how he never intended his engine to work that way), but when the Quake community complained about it, he inserted it back in.

Much <3 from me to the Unix Scientists/Engineers who wrote (and keep updating) OpenGL.

(ouroboro) #6

hey weffy, long time no see :slight_smile: ur never on msn, lol. i swore id never play on superwolf again even if it is the best ping i can get. i mean cmon, etmain with no PB? great ping yes, but god what a cesspool of cheats…

etpro 3 + pb + sv_pure 1 + league-like cvar enforcements = <3

on topic: nah thats not a trickjump, heh. basically if it aint on the lna trickjump map, its not a trickjump. at any rate, whether SD intended it or not is quite irrelevant, what matters is they havnt PATCHED against it, so its fair game. anything thats possible in the game (without using illegal settings and/or external programs) is fair in my opinion, unless and untill its patched.

(Rain) #7

No offense, but this is nearly the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard. Please tell me you’re joking. :bored:

On the chance that you aren’t, I’ve already explained why jump heights are framerate-dependent in laymans terms, and this is a key point of trickjumping.

(KingJackaL) #8

D@MN, Rain beat me to it D:.

Yeah, it was re-coded by ID when people complained about it being taken out (for Quake3 IIRC), but it’s nothing to do with OpenGL, it’s to do with their original engine architecture where all of the engine worked in the same timeunits (frames - with each frame getting its chunk of rendering, physics etc).

With engines now having almost completely seperate modules (engines?) for physics, rendering, AI etc that shouldn’t be cropping up (though of course Q3-based games still have that by default), but trickjumping is pretty cool, so maybe it’ll stick around… :smiley:

(faltytower) #9

None taken.

Aside from my redundant use of OpenGL as a modifier for library, no I wasn’t. After having read your post (which makes more sense that the physics encapsulation from the client-server architecture would be responsible for the effect) I’ll admit that I was wrong and I apologize to anyone whom I might have misinformed.

My original understanding came from a post I found a few years ago (while searching for topics on floating point arithmetic and accuracy) in the idevgames forum. The discussion concerned real-time rendering engine; one of the developers brought-up Quake and OpenGL and claimed that (which I later verified) in OpenGL system the higher the FPS the faster the movement; the poster then proceeded to explain how one might build-up an engine that would resemble Quake’s unique “jump bug”. I’ll try to find that post and edit this one later to link to it.

In any case Rain (and KingJackal) is right. I’ll do a better job next time to verify my statements.

(Rain) #10

Well, all’s well then. It’s nice to know that there are newish users here capable of rational thought i.e. new users that aren’t ironman.
Banana! :banana:

(sorry, I’m sleepy)

(faltytower) #11

^^Hehehe. Long hours, partly with ETPro + ETTv I suppose.

Anyway, I’ve been searching that forum for hours to no avail. The archives date as far back to Oct 2002 and I know the topic was a few months or so earlier than that. I would put in a few more hours but I won’t bother; it’s fuzzy memories anyways.

And yeah, I’m much more interested in refining my understanding of gaming software system rather than argue out of ego or stubborness.

Sweet dreams.

(Bongoboy) #12

A robust yet civilised exchange of views resulting in increased understanding by all parties without recourse to swearing, abuse or contumely. Huzzah!

And to answer the back-in-the-day original question, No, we make a point of never answering questions and yes it was designed that way.

(fattakin) #13

Education Value in this thread, never heard of this word!!

Definition: [n] a rude expression intended to offend or hurt; “when a student made a stupid mistake he spared them no abuse”; “they yelled insults at the visiting team”

(DG) #14

If I click “post reply” instead of “submit” again I’m going to get upset :frowning:

I was going to say I think theyre both intentional, too much of a convenient co-incidence otherwise. For example, what purpose does that little bit of building have that juts out from the cabinets building, and then it funnily enough is just the right distance to make going over the wall a very tricky but do-able jump?

[edit: me finally gets round to reading properly and notices the Q answered :o /]

(CM..Punk) #15

If I click “post reply” instead of “submit” again I’m going to get upset

I thought it was just me who did this \o/

(Weffy) #16

Hey ouroboro, how’s it goin man. Long time no see. I totally understand what you’re saying about SuperWolf, I rarely go there myself. I play at ET.EOF.NET, great server if you like FF off. The regulars are great and it’s a real fun place to play at.

You’re right I’m never on MSN, ever. Don’t have much use for it never have…;o) I only use it on specific occassions, mostly to help people with something or other.

Cya man, good to hear from ya

(Weffy) #17

Thanks A Bunch Bongoboy - Much Appreciated!!! :clap: