Mandatory Tutorial

[ClemClem7]

So I checked reddit and saw some post about newbies, and their clueless approach of the game (objective stacking, skyhammer not dropping ammo in ranked…).
Why isn’t the tutorial mandatory for new players ?
If it’s just to avoid new players getting stuck and can’t play until they do the tutorial, we can make it so you need to do it to launch ranked and open the level 7 gold case. Just a condition to do it, and when they try to do it (any of the 2 actions), a pop up show to tell them to do it before doing any of the actions. Then they are not stuck at the beginning, but they will do it if they want the shinny golden case. (and imo it’s evident to do it before ranked).

Tldr: why isn’t the tutorial mandatory yet ?

[BloodySin]

The current tutorial is probably too generic to be all that effective on people who don’t already do it spontaneously. What the game needs is a short tutorial for each character as they get unlocked, teaching what that character can do and how, enforced before the character can be used in play. It could also have a game basics tutorial, mixing part of Tutorial and Assault Course into one, keeping just controls and movement, leaving out special skills and actions for each character tutorial instead.

[everlovestruck]

If somebody gets stuck on the tutorial - why do we need them in teamplay?

[SnakekillerX]

Regardless of the tutorial applying to all characters, it does apply to some. Once you learn how to do an objective, heal/revive a team mate and pass ammo to people, this pretty much becomes relevant across the board regardless of which merc you are playing.

Knowing to do these things will enable you to understand what you should be doing, as well as what others should be doing so you can work as a team better.

[BloodySin]

@SnakekillerX said:
Regardless of the tutorial applying to all characters, it does apply to some. Once you learn how to do an objective, heal/revive a team mate and pass ammo to people, this pretty much becomes relevant across the board regardless of which merc you are playing.
“Encouragement” revives and slow fixing/planting is what I’d bundle in a game basics tutorial, like I mentioned. Healing, passing ammo, defibrillators (and their advantages) and specialists (and their advantages) would feel better on a character basis, since they are much more specific.

[SnakekillerX]

@BloodySin said:

@SnakekillerX said:
Regardless of the tutorial applying to all characters, it does apply to some. Once you learn how to do an objective, heal/revive a team mate and pass ammo to people, this pretty much becomes relevant across the board regardless of which merc you are playing.
“Encouragement” revives and slow fixing/planting is what I’d bundle in a game basics tutorial, like I mentioned. Healing, passing ammo, defibrillators (and their advantages) and specialists (and their advantages) would feel better on a character basis, since they are much more specific.

But what happens if people don’t play those characters? Wouldn’t it be better to teach them how the game works as a whole, instead of just what their character does? Its better to be aware of other peoples roles so you can help that player be more effective as well.

[BloodySin]

@SnakekillerX said:
But what happens if people don’t play those characters? Wouldn’t it be better to teach them how the game works as a whole, instead of just what their character does? Its better to be aware of other peoples roles so you can help that player be more effective as well.
You can’t teach it all in one single tutorial, and trying to push too much information would just make it confusing - “hey, in the tutorial I was great and fast at planting that C4, I’ll always do it with all my characters!” If anything, I’d say being curious about what the hell that guy playing Stoker did that set the ground on fire could be encouragement to go do Stoker’s tutorial to learn it, in a much better way than trying to cram it all in one thing. Right now, as the tutorial is, nothing of what you say happens anyways, no one gets taught about other roles, at most they get confused believing they can refill their own ammo and be the best bombs expert there it.

[kittz0r]

Biggest thing is that people don’t Care. If you want to be better, you go to Google and search, go to Youtube and Watch, go to Twitch and look there etc.
these people just want their TDM and maybe press Mouse 1 once in a while. And this is the same for Level 50+ Players who just grinding XP but have no idea about anything. Nothing you can do…

[Shirobon]

@BloodySin said:
The current tutorial is probably too generic to be all that effective on people who don’t already do it spontaneously. What the game needs is a short tutorial for each character as they get unlocked, teaching what that character can do and how, enforced before the character can be used in play. It could also have a game basics tutorial, mixing part of Tutorial and Assault Course into one, keeping just controls and movement, leaving out special skills and actions for each character tutorial instead.

I like this idea very much. Maybe force players to take the tutorial right after they buy the merc, before they’re allowed to use it.

[ClemClem7]

Maybe a general tutorial with each role. And a specific one when we buy one merc in particular.

[Szakalot]

forcing players to do anything is a bad idea

plus, the thinking that everyone who went through tutorial will suddenly be a good player is a major myth.

people are bad teamplayers CAUSE THEY SUCK, and have tunnel vision, not because they are douchebags. Newbie skyhammer is too focused staring down the barrel ofM4 at a position they saw an enemy at two minutes ago, to notice anyone needing ammo

[SnakekillerX]

The tutorial does push to show people how to play to an extent, the problem is it doesn’t cover enough.

Here are the things it does cover…

Skyhammer:
How to reload, shoot and switch weapons.
To keep mobile in combat and not to crouch or iron sight unless you really have to.
How to pass ammo to team mates.
How to use an airstrike marker to destroy a generator and blow up some people.
How to revive someone manually.
How to repair a generator.
Run with your knife because its faster.

Aura:
How to revive someone with defibs, showing you how much faster it is when a medic.
How to heal your team mates using medic abilities.

That’s about it though…

It is definitely lacking information on certain areas. It also should have covered an engineer for instance to show the repair/defuse progress difference, as well as covering some other abilities and things like wall jumping.

I think the hold back on these is they feel the tutorial needs to be in game and scripted, which does take a bit of time to do… what they should have instead is just 1 in game tutorial being a good place to setup controls, tweak sensitivity, etc… then tiered tutorials by use of videos that show you…

1. The basics (all mercs):
   -reloading
   -finding ammo when you are low
   -hip fire shooting and when to use it
   -iron sight shooting and when to use it

-repairing/destorying a generator/EV
-arming/defusing C4
-returning/delivering carriable objectives

-reviving a team mate

-sprinting with knife out vs sprinting with gun out
-wall jumping

2. Working as a team (with role awareness):

-giving ammo as fire support
-healing your team as a medic
-reviving a team mate as a medic
-repairing a generator/EV as an engineer
-destorying a generator/EV as someone with explosives
-detecting enemies as recon
-covering allies while they attempt to… revive, repair, defuse, etc

3. Map awareness, Objectives and Secondary Objectives and Spawn Timers:

-different paths often lead to the same area
-focus primary objective
-secondary objectives can help, but keep your eye on primary objective
-spawn mechanics and spawn timers
-ability to swap between 3 different mercs from your loadout

Past this, the Role Call videos are enough to learn each individual merc… they don’t all need an in game tutorial. Some Role Call videos are in need of updating however, like Phantom and Thunder, and it would be great if they could be viewed in game.

[BloodySin]

@Szakalot said:
forcing players to do anything is a bad idea

plus, the thinking that everyone who went through tutorial will suddenly be a good player is a major myth.

people are bad teamplayers CAUSE THEY SUCK, and have tunnel vision, not because they are douchebags. Newbie skyhammer is too focused staring down the barrel ofM4 at a position they saw an enemy at two minutes ago, to notice anyone needing ammo

Care to elaborate on why it’s a bad idea? I mean, you are forced to grind to get more loadouts, forced to grind to get more characters, etc. What’s bad about forcing the player to take 5 minutes being told what their character does before they go out on their own clueless?

And you are somewhat right, but still fundamentally wrong. If it was a matter of douchebaggery there would be nothing to teach. Sucking is something that can be fixed if they get taught how their abilities affect team play. The newbie Skyhammer might just not be throwing ammo because they don’t realize they can and should be doing it.

@SnakekillerX said:
Past this, the Role Call videos are enough to learn each individual merc… they don’t all need an in game tutorial. Some Role Call videos are in need of updating however, like Phantom and Thunder, and it would be great if they could be viewed in game.

The Role Call videos only serve as advertisement and to perk interest in a character, they aren’t made in any way that they could be possible interpreted as tutorials. We’re talking teaching people how the character and abilities work in practice on a tutorial, and no video can be a substitute for that. It won’t make anyone master any ability, but it will at least give them a feel of what the character can do, with them in control.

[Szakalot]

@BloodySin said:

@Szakalot said:
forcing players to do anything is a bad idea

plus, the thinking that everyone who went through tutorial will suddenly be a good player is a major myth.

people are bad teamplayers CAUSE THEY SUCK, and have tunnel vision, not because they are douchebags. Newbie skyhammer is too focused staring down the barrel ofM4 at a position they saw an enemy at two minutes ago, to notice anyone needing ammo

Care to elaborate on why it’s a bad idea? I mean, you are forced to grind to get more loadouts, forced to grind to get more characters, etc. What’s bad about forcing the player to take 5 minutes being told what their character does before they go out on their own clueless?

And you are somewhat right, but still fundamentally wrong. If it was a matter of douchebaggery there would be nothing to teach. Sucking is something that can be fixed if they get taught how their abilities affect team play. The newbie Skyhammer might just not be throwing ammo because they don’t realize they can and should be doing it.

You are most definitely NOT forced to grind, to get loadouts or merc or anything. You can play the game without any of that. Just like you can skip tutorial currently.

Sucking is something that no tutorial will fix, because it takes actual in-game experience to learn all the things we take for granted.

Hell, to me 80% of minlvl10 population is in the ‘complete newbie’ range, because they have no clue how to assess situation, no map awareness, mediocre aim at best, silly gameplay, etc. and I’m not even that good.

The things you consider obvious, like throwing ammo, are difficult for a newbie who can barely keep track of who is friend/foe, and where the hell the frontline even is. Teamplay is a skill, and it takes time to develop; its not nearly as much a matter of knowledge as the ‘mandatory tutorial’ crowd make it out to be.

[BloodySin]

@Szakalot said:
You are most definitely NOT forced to grind, to get loadouts or merc or anything. You can play the game without any of that. Just like you can skip tutorial currently.

Not much I can say when you apparently have an alternative interpretation of what entails griding, that differs from most people’s.

@Szakalot said:
Sucking is something that no tutorial will fix, because it takes actual in-game experience to learn all the things we take for granted.

Sucking from lack of a bare minimum of knowledge of how a class works beyond “go out there and try it” can be fixed, or at least eased, with proper information.

@Szakalot said:
The things you consider obvious, like throwing ammo, are difficult for a newbie who can barely keep track of who is friend/foe, and where the hell the frontline even is.

I’m saying there should be tutorials for each class, but you say I consider it obvious? For real? I’m the one saying those things aren’t obvious to new players and they need to be better explained instead of leaning by being yelled at by other layers in first-hand experience. You’re the one saying teaching them about that won’t fix anything.

PS: Still waiting for the elaboration on “that’s a bad idea.”

[Cgz27]

I dunno about you guys, but I’m the kind of guy who likes to do the tutorial just to see what it offers.
When I started out, I also tried to search for more basic info before, during, and after playing to clarify things I thought might be useful. I don’t like to disappoint others so I tried my best to be the best noob I could be

I don’t want to brag but when I started out about a year ago I found myself regularly topping or close to topping the board as mainly Skyhammer and Aura and for some reason I used server browser and never touched quick join, didn’t even notice the max 6 servers until I was way past the requirements .-.
I found myself trying out every single merc merely for fun through the rotation because this game was so unique compared to others that I’ve played, before even buying my first merc at level 15.

Anyway my point is that I think it really does depend on the person. If they want to learn the game they do the tutorial and maybe check the forums etc. If they just wanna shoot it up, they go to the mall and…just kidding, they just skip the tutorial and not give ammo until they get yelled at, then they buy Vasilli :^D

So yea, I’m gonna agree that there needs to be a better incentive for the tutorial, and its probably likely (and a good idea) that SD will update and add to the tutorial in the future after they get the more important stuff done like fixing the game and releasing impactful content.

Perhaps players can be told about the free rotation and that they can ONLY access it after they do the tutorial. Maybe even give a credit reward for completing and improving on the Assault Course, which gives them a reason to learn how to move more efficiently and helps expand their mindset.

[Nail]

“Not much I can say when you apparently have an alternative interpretation of what entails griding, that differs from most people’s.”

lack of understanding of the English language seems to be a major problem on this site.

what he is saying is there is NO NEED to grind, you DON’T NEED anything other than default loadouts to play and win ie: there is NO requirement to grind, you start with everything you NEED

[BloodySin]

@Nail said:
“Not much I can say when you apparently have an alternative interpretation of what entails griding, that differs from most people’s.”

lack of understanding of the English language seems to be a major problem on this site.

what he is saying is there is NO NEED to grind, you DON’T NEED anything other than default loadouts to play and win ie: there is NO requirement to grind, you start with everything you NEED

Nothing compares to lack of common sense, though. Players - especially new ones - aren’t interested in defaults. Not even Splash Damage is interested in players sticking to defaults. New players want to experiment new things, the whole point of the free rotation is giving them a taste of what’s available, and all that is behind grind walls. Go right ahead and say there’s “no NEED,” sticking to technicalities no one is going to base their game on; I’ll base my arguments on practical reality instead.

PS: Damn, did I get hit by one of those that “downvotes” everything that exposes an argument they like as flawed already? That must be a new record.

[Nail]

and you’re still wrong

[JonBongNoJovi]

The tutorial is more fun when you ignore every instruction given and derp around to listen to all his voice lines