K/D/A?

(Jostabeere) #21

Where did you read that an Aura can’t kill? Also what’s that gibberish about A safezone and a >2K/D?
Since you do not understand what my idea was, I’ll explain. In the scoreboard, specific mercs get their specific stat shown instead of a bland kills and death for everyone.
Medics get a heals/revives stat, engineers an objectives done stat. Recons a spotted stat. Phantom may have a deactivated devides stat. But mercs whose primary objective is killing, geep the K/D as the primary thing on the scoreboard.

(watsyurdeal) #22

I think it would just be easier to show

Total XP, Combat XP, Support XP, and Objective XP in separate columns.

(Szakalot) #23

@Jostabeere and what if i want to see kills as Aura? now i cant? and what if i play aura on 1st obj, but switch to fragger on 2nd obj? what if i play aura, fragger and fletcher? which one will be displayed?

in the end this is a shooter: typically most players are interested in k/d.

i definitely agree that ALL the other stats should be accessible as well

(Jostabeere) #24

[quote=“Szakalot;200272”]@Jostabeere and what if i want to see kills as Aura? now i cant? and what if i play aura on 1st obj, but switch to fragger on 2nd obj? what if i play aura, fragger and fletcher? which one will be displayed?

in the end this is a shooter: typically most players are interested in k/d.

i definitely agree that ALL the other stats should be accessible as well[/quote]

Well what about the displayable stats change if you change the merc? It’s just a thought and not a final “this should be like that”. Don’t be so overly passive-aggressive without any reason. Thanks.

(bgyoshi) #25

Here’s why showing K/D in DB is bad.

Casual players are the majority of DB players. Casual players value their K/D as a reflection of their personal skill.

DB is a teamwork game where, often, you have to put yourself out of position in order to give your team a better position. Sometimes you have to make a risky C4 plant or a risky defuse, which often means dying over and over. That means your K/D is going to be bad.

Medics are super important. Good medics will spend the majority of their time healing and reviving, and often have to put themselves in the line of fire to top off the assault class or to res a picked off engineer. This typically results in a very poor K/D. A medic who is getting a high K/D is spending more time shooting than they’re spending healing and reviving. Players are often discouraged from medic because there isn’t enough killing, or if they ARE playing medic, spend more time killing and less time healing.

The worst part is players trying to farm kills. Sure, they have a 5:1 K/D, but they never break position to plant C4 or repair the EV or do any of the objectives. They sit and shoot and get kills and figure someone else on the team is just going to handle all of the objectives, rarely paying attention to who is dead and who is around them. Sometimes there’s only 2 of you left and you just have to rush in during the enemy respawn timer and get an objective done. But they don’t, because that means being closer to enemy spawn and being killed by the enemy team. And so, nothing gets done.

In general, kills are not a very important aspect of the game. Kills are just going to happen. The problem is that players looking for kills don’t play with the team more often than not. Then you get a scoreboard like…

  1. 30/4 - Sniper
  2. 18/6 - Medic
  3. 12/7 - Engi
  4. 2/10
  5. 3/11
  6. 1/17

When really, a strong team working together will have a scoreboard like…

  1. 2/20 - Medic
  2. 16/10 - Engi
  3. 14/4 - Assault
  4. 13/9 - Engi
  5. 9/9
  6. 10/7

The kills are more spread out among the entire team because everyone is sticking together and firing on the same enemies. Instead of one person teaming up with the medic and getting high kills while the rest of the team is just getting killed by flanking and a lost medic, everyone is being healed up and moving in as a group, and engis are sticking their necks out to get clutch objective completions.

TL;DR Working as a team naturally creates mediocre K/D ratios. Highlighting K/D makes people think it’s important and makes them worry less about the team and more about their personal kill count.

(pumpkinmeerkat) #26

Frags often determine the outcome of a game and absolutely should be displayed after a match.

End of game statistics need to do a much better job demonstrating to casual DB players how a fire support or medic got to the top of the scoreboard. That’s the best way to encourage team play IMO.

(watsyurdeal) #27

So should we display kills, revives, and objectives handled?

(Lord.Eblis) #28

Yes all the stats that are important as the KD. As a medic I would like to see how many revives I did. As an engi how many times I tried planting and how many were successful, how many people I spotted as sniper and how many I killed or got killed thanks to the heartbeat sensor. It all helps to see what I’ve done to the team even if the displayed KD is bad. To give an example with BF4 again, one day I played pure Medic, I mean almost no kills and that was a choice, my KD was like 1/5 but, on the stats page : ~250 revives of the 320 total for the team! I was just so happy to see how much I helped the team. Stats are not only to show off, it’s a personal achievement like in sports :slight_smile:

(watsyurdeal) #29

Honestly, I don’t think deaths is important

If someone dies 20 times, but that son of bitch planted 90% of the total bombs planted, I’d say that dude is da mvp.

(Szakalot) #30

i definitely disagree that medics are okay with 2/20 stats.

at low level you might be useful to your team, but a stat line like this is really realy bad: you have a gun as well, some of them very decent: you need to be able to put people down.

a medic that only has defibrillator out is making their team play with one gun less

(Amerika) #31

Similar to standing around the EV and getting points I like the idea of being around any deliverable and getting points (assuming it’s been moving recently). A lot of times I’m not the guy who delivers unless it’s the last possible option and am the guy who covers the deliverable or the defuse/plant (unless I’m playing an engineer) on pubs.

(bgyoshi) #32

[quote=“Szakalot;200354”]i definitely disagree that medics are okay with 2/20 stats.

at low level you might be useful to your team, but a stat line like this is really realy bad: you have a gun as well, some of them very decent: you need to be able to put people down.

a medic that only has defibrillator out is making their team play with one gun less[/quote]

I very frequently top-score steamroll as Aura/Phoenix with under 5 kills and over 15 deaths. Your single gun is far less useful than your team’s 4/5/6/7 other guns. It’s more worthwhile for me to revive a player or keep my teammates at full HP than it is for me to revenge kill someone that just killed my teammate.

The only time a medic should be using their gun is when there are no teammates close by in need of healing or reviving (either due to a heal cool-down or simply having no teammates).

Since I tend to never be on my own as medic I almost never have a need to use a gun, and my teammates are far more successful when they can’t die, as opposed to when they can die, but I’m also shooting too.

Seriously, learn to play medic. If I could count the number of times I’ve been rolling around on the ground waiting for a revive while my medic, standing on my rolling body, or running straight past me, seems to think they need to use their gun to get kills, I would’ve run out of numbers a year ago. Even worse is the number of times I’ve had to run in front of medics shouting MEDIC MEDIC MEDIC MEDIC with under 10 health, just to see them run off and start trying to get kills.

Another thing TF2 did right; useless weapons for the medic.

(Amerika) #33

Medics in this game have killing potential. Typically you always play medic first and you play a bit more guarded but that’s not the whole class. DB is not TF2. You have to determine what you should be doing in each situation. Some medics that only try to medic and never fire back are the easiest ones to bait. I won’t gib a body knowing that medic will pretty much suicide towards a body so you don’t do yourself any favors by rarely ever using your gun against competent players. You have to show that you can be lethal at times to ensure that you don’t simply get baited over and over.

(onLooSe) #34

[quote=“MidnightButterSweats;200384”][quote=“Szakalot;200354”]i definitely disagree that medics are okay with 2/20 stats.

at low level you might be useful to your team, but a stat line like this is really realy bad: you have a gun as well, some of them very decent: you need to be able to put people down.

a medic that only has defibrillator out is making their team play with one gun less[/quote]

I very frequently top-score steamroll as Aura/Phoenix with under 5 kills and over 15 deaths. Your single gun is far less useful than your team’s 4/5/6/7 other guns. It’s more worthwhile for me to revive a player or keep my teammates at full HP than it is for me to revenge kill someone that just killed my teammate.

The only time a medic should be using their gun is when there are no teammates close by in need of healing or reviving (either due to a heal cool-down or simply having no teammates).

Since I tend to never be on my own as medic I almost never have a need to use a gun, and my teammates are far more successful when they can’t die, as opposed to when they can die, but I’m also shooting too.

Seriously, learn to play medic. If I could count the number of times I’ve been rolling around on the ground waiting for a revive while my medic, standing on my rolling body, or running straight past me, seems to think they need to use their gun to get kills, I would’ve run out of numbers a year ago. Even worse is the number of times I’ve had to run in front of medics shouting MEDIC MEDIC MEDIC MEDIC with under 10 health, just to see them run off and start trying to get kills.

Another thing TF2 did right; useless weapons for the medic.[/quote]

You just made my day my man :smiley:

Never forget that you can rack up some dope score when you hide behind a corner while one of your teammates is getting murdered at the opening next to you… You can charge the defibs between every revive so you can maximize the times your teammate dies 1vs2/3 who knows… The point is to make him die 6-7 times in a row until they manage to gib him so you can face them.

Revive first… shoot later is a must for top scoring.

(bontsa) #35

I am slightly disappointed there was no mention of the legendary “healing through excessive use of force” in @Amerika s comment.

(Amerika) #36

I only break it out on occasion :slight_smile:

(Szakalot) #37

sorry, but its you who needs to learn. The better the players involved the harder it is to pull off a good revive.

Good players will likely gib the body before you can revive, even if you tap the defibs immediately, the body will be ‘finished’ before the person can get revived.

There is nothing worse than a medic trying to revive while the opponent is already long jumping at the body with the knife out.

Too often a medic at full health & full ammo will sacrifice his life to tap a 30hp revive. Medic dies, the revived person soon follows.

I dont mean to bash nice medic play, and its definitely nice if people play medic over rambo, but good intentions are not enough.

Overall, I’d say that keeping people at full health is MUCH more important than revives: revives are risky under fire, and often fail terribly, but if you can top people up to full hp between fights, you are doing great work. This is why Sawbonez is still the king of medics, as he can quickly get anyone up to 100%

(nokiII) #38

If you’re a medic and get under like 10 kills per stopwatch half you’re pretty much a failure and a reliability to the team.

You can see it in basically every single pug game and even in comp games. If the medics have just a few kills while the other guys perform as expected, the team with the medics who can’t kill will usually lose. Sitting behind a fragger with paddles out is just a recipe to lose, you got a weapon with 130dps for a reason.

(Saiph) #39

If anything they should stop showing the death count. Score and kills show how much you contributed to the win, not deaths. Dying a lot in this game is normal, especially when playing obj. And in many situations it’s better to suicide than wait for your life/ammo to regen.

If people were not shown their KDR we would have a lot less Vassilis.

(SnakekillerX) #40

Deaths are an important aspect of the game as well though, some games I have very high deaths, but its because I’m constantly throwing myself at the objective either in attempts to take it, or defend it. Dying might be a result of this action, but I make sure to take people down with me each wave.

You can often tell who wasn’t pushing hard enough based on their deaths. (assuming you lost)