Iron Sight - What is it there for?

(attack) #61

they should concentrate on one style not try to do a crossover of both

(Bangtastic) #62

the question is how much do you need to convince players from BF4, Call of Duty Ghost? For me when it gets to Ads battlefield is pretty much the best out there.

Maybe there is a way to combine ADS with certain abilities? maybe increase the movement penalty for hip fire, standing still should remain good or even better.

If you keep ADS as it is now, then you could really introduce running and hip fire only (great penalty ofc). To compensate the slower play of Ads. I guess soldiers with exoskeleton, or robotic arm can do this^^

Instant ADS, at least faster than your competitors

Isnt it possible to make Assault rifle type A hip fire (more accurate, higher fall off) / assault rifle Type B Ads (better for long range, hip fire penalty) it could be explained how the gun is designed and build -> older models that we know stay as we know from other games; Future new guns provide certain systems, ergonomic design, combined with armor, etc and may look really futuristic? i mean if u already set it in future ^^

/thoughts

Whatever you decide to do, go for one way only and complete the puzzle with the same pieces^^ enough of my input^^

(tokamak) #63

Are there any other players?

(Breo) #64

Games that doesn’t have IS are focused on CQ gameplay like CS:GO where the maps aren’t really open so you wouldn’t use it anyway?
In DB with different (small-large) map sizes I would leave the IS as it is so you can “adjust” the weapons characteristics slightly for the larger maps.

(rapid_shot) #65

I think of it like this, if including iron sights doesn’t drastically change how the game is played OR spread / creep, then they aren’t necessary. Games like CoD use iron sights and is a vital part of the game. If you don’t learn to use them, you’re screwed. However, you still need hip fire because its impractical to run around in iron sights as it would take up most of your screen On the contrary in DB, if you never learn how to not use iron sights, you’re screwed. But I don’t understand the need to have iron sights if the most important and successful method of shooting doesn’t involve it.

I just don’t want to see DB turn into one of THOSE games that tries to coddle all types of players and ends up with none. Keeping iron sights to try to not alienate players that prefer it ends up changing the functionality of the primary method of shooting making neither methods fun. Stick to one primary method if if you MUST include both, don’t let the secondary method alter how you develop the primary.

All that said, I think iron sights should be reserved for scoped and red dot sight weapons only as previously suggested.

(Nail) #66

I don’t mind them, thought I would hate them, but no, especially if we have cg_drawgun 0
I’m old I need the zoom, otherwise I gotta make a fov toggle

(mfzor) #67

[QUOTE=Mustang;447624]Reduce (or remove) movement penalty, separate customisible sensitivity, increase visibility with less intrusive IS or give option to pick red-dot/scope on all weapons or r_drawgun 0 or zoom without putting gun to shoulder/cheek.

There is lots that could improve IS before considering removing it.[/QUOTE]

This, some good idea’s!

(ailmanki) #68

I asked myself what do I need IS when I got a crosshair anyway?

Only reasons I see is having a somekind of IS with advanced technology. Whatever it is… highlight moving stuff, heatmaps, highlight noises…
I don’t like the idea of conditions changed of the weapon, if zoomed in = 1 shot dead, if using IS less recoil/spread…

(acQu) #69

Both are fine for me. The only reason i would like ironsights removed is because it takes up an important button and doesn’t really fit into my config, but i am fine with that more or less.

However, in the current form with ironsight < hip i would do some changes to make the ironsight a better choice for medium to long range (which happens rarely anyway on the small maps). I would do this by having hipfire bullets losing damage output over distance, ironsight bullets would keep their damage output over distance. I would touch spread only if there would be a breathing bar for all ironsighted weapons, so that i can’t get better accuracy by just switching to ironsight when i am in a close range infight to get an advantage. Or if the breath bar would be too short i would leave it out and implement it only functionally without trying to give feedback to the players. But the point is: i wouldn’t mess with spread to distinguish ironsight mode from hipfire mode. As a last measure i would take out the zig zagging and make it a normal recoil (the zig zagging is just horrible. It is like a troll feature lol :))

(Kl3ppy) #70

No, pls no breath bar. We had it with the sniper and many ppl didnt like it. I would like to see a reduced spread and a reduced recoil when using IS but punish the movement speed while in IS. As you said, the zizag spread right now is just here to troll :smiley:

(acQu) #71

The breath bar would not take your crosshair and move it around, it would affect the bullet spread directly until thebreathbar is down (it would be down in 0.5 till 1 sec imo). The reason i would do it like that is so that you can’t just go ahead and switch to ironsight mode infight just like that, because in infight hipfire should be a better choice. That is the whole thought process behind that.

So not the breathbar you know, another breathbar. Maybe you don’t like it as well, but imo never mess with spread too much. It is just horrible. Weapons should be accurate and you should hit exactly where you shoot at. Especially in this alpha this became clear to me that i would never be willing to learn different spreads on weapons because i find it ‘not enjoyable’ at first place :slight_smile:

With ‘mess with spread’ i mean there should at most be a difference in spread like there was with W:ET between sten and thompson. Everything out of that range is just stupid and can really destroy your game imo.

(acQu) #72

Well, another punishment? The game currently has a horrible hipfire movement system (don’t know if i am the only one realizing that). At first you have to adjust that so that hipfire and movement feels right, then you can talk about movement penalties on ironsight. The punishment implemented on the current movement system of DB is like a punishment over a punishment :smiley:

EDIT in addition, if you just get slowed down when using the ironsight, but have better spread and better recoil then IS is OP compared to hipfire imo. I would probably use it all the time infight if hipfire + movement is that bad anyway …

(Kl3ppy) #73

I know, the movement in DB overall is bad :wink:
I assumed that the movement will get fixed and after that, IS should have some impact on movement. Right now its not a good idea to punish the movement even more, the movement itslef is a punishment :smiley:

(acQu) #74

If the movement penalty would be an increase in spread while you move ironsighted then i think i wouldn’t like it that much either :wink: I prefer moving around adjusting my position in ironsight mode.

The breathbar would be just a transition from mode to mode, but once you are in one mode the spread stays. Once you transition from hip to ironsight it would be a short while until your bullet spread gets better again. Maybe breathbar is the wrong word for it though. It would like i said just avoid so that you can use ironsight in close range infight ‘out of the box’.

If possible i would like the movement untouched and even have a good spread while i move while in ironsight mode. I think ironsight would not be much fun if you can’t move around that much without getting a punishment for it. I at least move and adjust position very often. Depends how much penalty is implemented i guess and if it really serves the actual task of making hipfire favoruable close to med range and ironsight the better choice at med to far range.

(Kl3ppy) #75

I think that you need to get some disadvantage while using IS. As an advantage, ur recoil+spread is reduced therefore you need some disadvantage. I would prefer a lower FoV (which isnt a disadvantage) and a lower sensitivity of your mouse while IS. I dont want a punishement with the movement, e.g. moving slower etc but as soon as u push sprint while IS, IS should stop. But other punishment for IS is not good. Maybe I didnt make it clear what I want as a punishment and what I thought of punish the movement :wink:

(spookify) #76

Did you read my post or just pull out a sentence and take it out of context… I was talking about COD and their Iron Sights…

(INF3RN0) #77

Ironsights are an alternative to what crouching was, but now you can stand up too. It’s really very simple. As long as ironsights serve the purpose of long range use and equalize with hipfire at med-close range it’s all dandy. If anything crouching could be a bit more useful in both hip and iron sighting since your in the most limited state of movement.