HP vs SPEED BALANCED?

(Humbug) #1

While i like the general idea, i think its totally overdone.

I’m mainly playing sawbones and every Aura(without station) and Proxy is a REALLY easy kill for me, while i struggle hard to kill good Fraggers, even if I open with 5 headshots.
Fragger has almost twice the HP of Aura.
Speed just doesn’t translate into HP, because it depends on the weapon you use.
The difference in HP is just too high. All I want is an equal chance against all mercs, especially if this wants to be a competitive skillbased shooter.
Currently the game tries to balance with counters, but everyone can switch his merc after every death, so people will be switching after every death in both teams, it just doesn’t make sense.
This leads to an overall feeling that personal skill doesn’t matter.
All in all i think this game will fail hard, if it tries to be another moba. If I want to play a moba I go and play DOTA it has much more depth and allows you to counterplay.
What do you think?

(Ribero) #2

A good proxy/aura who knows how to Dodge, Duck, Dip, Dive and Dodge is a serious pain to kill, it really extends their survivability in 1v1 situations.

So I think it’s okay.

(appreciativeBuster) #3

Oh yes please give my proxy more HP!

Or with the augment after every death you get 10hp more can counter it.

In the end it’s objectives you should be going for with proxy and not kills but do find her somewhat squishy yes :P.

(Humbug) #4

[quote=“appreciativeBuster;11918”]Oh yes please give my proxy more HP!

Or with the augment after every death you get 10hp more can counter it.

In the end it’s objectives you should be going for with proxy and not kills but do find her somewhat squishy yes :P.[/quote]

that’s another thing i don’t like, running towards and objective and die for it 10times until it’s done. You can’t even look up while defusing, you’re just a lemming that defuses 10% more of that c4, but it doesn’t matter because you respawn fast enough to try again…

The problem is that everybody can do everything, instead of protecting that proxy you try to defuse yourself and die, and the next one does the same. Often saw 5 people disarming the same c4 dying one by one and it worked…

(god1) #5

[quote=“Humbug;2060”]All I want is an equal chance against all mercs, especially if this wants to be a competitive skillbased shooter.
[/quote]
That’s not how class based games work. Fragger’s job is to dominate PvP at the expense of everything else, and rightfully your Sawbonez doesn’t stand a chance against him. You’re not supposed to be dueling Fraggers as a medic.

(Humbug) #6

[quote=“richRevelation;11923”][quote=“Humbug;2060”]All I want is an equal chance against all mercs, especially if this wants to be a competitive skillbased shooter.
[/quote]
That’s not how class based games work. Fragger’s job is to dominate PvP at the expense of everything else, and rightfully your Sawbonez doesn’t stand a chance against him. You’re not supposed to be dueling Fraggers as a medic.
[/quote]

yes that is why he has grenades. There is simply nothing i can do but run away (hiding doesn’t work because of grenade)… and i don’t want to run in a shooter.
At the moment, although i would love to play medic, like in every other game, i just choose fragger instead…
Currently every other merc is only there to support the almighty fragger it seems…

(Szakalot) #7

what are you talking about; any merc can take out any merc if your aim is right. Sure its harder in a straight up battle; and you don’t want to engage fragger’s head-on, but its not like you have to run away if you see one, lol

(Varonth) #8

When playing Aura, the easiest to kill enemy is Fragger to be honest. He has a huge hitbox, so even at medium range he easily eats a full shotgun blast and his incredible slow movement speed makes him such a easy target in a 1v1 situation. The only time fragger is good, is if he is supported by an Aura healstation on medium to long range fights. And then the Fragger has to hope that there isn’t a Vassili on the opponents side who just instant gibs him.

(Humbug) #9

of course i don’t run ^^
i just think it should be more balanced… Proxi is such an easy kill compared to Fragger and I don’t think it should be like that.
If i kill a proxy it just feels like: aww she had no chance anyway…

you just proove my point. personal skill doesn’t matter. only your mercs and the other teams mercs

(smartIsland) #10

Did you try stacking a few medkits before you engage that fragger? Did you plan your engagement at all? How can you say let’s should be equal 1v1 then refer to dota where typically one hero gets destroyed by certain other hero’s…

(Kroad) #11

[quote=“Humbug;11946”]
i just think it should be more balanced… Proxi is such an easy kill compared to Fragger and I don’t think it should be like that.
If i kill a proxy it just feels like: aww she had no chance anyway… [/quote]
what, are you telling me that mercs designed to complete objectives are easier to kill than mercs designed to be the strongest fragger in the game?

(Humbug) #12

you can’t stack medkits this is not et…
In dota you can get items that counter your counter and its MUCH MORE depth in that game and room for counterplay and you can’t switch your hero during a match.

(Humbug) #13

a shooter is mainly about shooting and killing obviously and you cant just make 1 merc 100000times better at it…

(Unstable) #14

i have no problems killing fraggers, or any other mercs with my SMG proxy, as said before, the person with the better aim will come out on top 9/10. yes its harder to take out a fragger but if your aim is consistant you should have no problem.

(Humbug) #15

if the skill difference is high enough yes, but when you play ranked against equal skill levels it will change i think. 4 headshots vs 7 headshots…

also this thread is not about my problem with fraggers, but about general balance. it was just an example.

lets take vasilli he needs 1 headshot or 2 bodyshots to kill, no matter what class, but its obviously much easier to hit that big slow fragger…

i think it’s a very very bad idea to balance a shooter around countering, especially if you can swap classes all the time

(einstyle) #16

[quote=“Humbug;12055”]lets take vasilli he needs 1 headshot or 2 bodyshots to kill, no matter what class, but its obviously much easier to hit that big slow fragger…
[/quote]

he needs 2 headshots for Rhino, if I’m not mistaken

(Unstable) #17

if the skill difference is high enough yes, but when you play ranked against equal skill levels it will change i think. 4 headshots vs 7 headshots…

also this thread is not about my problem with fraggers, but about general balance. it was just an example.

lets take vasilli he needs 1 headshot or 2 bodyshots to kill, no matter what class, but its obviously much easier to hit that big slow fragger…

i think it’s a very very bad idea to balance a shooter around countering, especially if you can swap classes all the time[/quote]

i understand, but i believe this adds more diversity, it FORCES you to learn, play and adapt to your enemy mercs. whether that means to learn to play another merc or completely master your current merc. this is a TEAM/OBJECTIVE based game and so far regardless of that fragger having 30-40+ kills in a game, still loses to a team that plays well together rather than picking one merc and playing DB like COD

(Humbug) #18

if the skill difference is high enough yes, but when you play ranked against equal skill levels it will change i think. 4 headshots vs 7 headshots…

also this thread is not about my problem with fraggers, but about general balance. it was just an example.

lets take vasilli he needs 1 headshot or 2 bodyshots to kill, no matter what class, but its obviously much easier to hit that big slow fragger…

i think it’s a very very bad idea to balance a shooter around countering, especially if you can swap classes all the time[/quote]

i understand, but i believe this adds more diversity, it FORCES you to learn, play and adapt to your enemy mercs. whether that means to learn to play another merc or completely master your current merc. this is a TEAM/OBJECTIVE based game and so far regardless of that fragger having 30-40+ kills in a game, still loses to a team that plays well together rather than picking one merc and playing DB like COD[/quote]

yes if you really work as a team, maybe have the same 4 players play with you all the time I think it is enjoyable.
But the casual mode will either die fast or become a fragger vs vasilli. I saw many 8v8 games already where there simply was no medic…

(Unstable) #19

I’ve won many games with no medic, you don’t NEED a certain merc on your team to win, at some point it just becomes a convenience. I’ve also played many games where the team naturally has a decent understanding of the objective game and teamwork just comes off as second nature. The casual scene will never die because new mercs will constantly be released.

As of now, im yet to see one fragger completely dominate a game to the point where its “OP”.

(Humbug) #20

[quote=“Unstable;12061”]I’ve won many games with no medic, you don’t NEED a certain merc on your team to win, at some point it just becomes a convenience. I’ve also played many games where the team naturally has a decent understanding of the objective game and teamwork just comes off as second nature. The casual scene will never die because new mercs will constantly be released.

As of now, im yet to see one fragger completely dominate a game to the point where its “OP”.[/quote]

maybe that is just the problem i have, a medic should be in theory the most useful merc on the field. it just doesn’t require enough teamwork to win. Deaths don’t really matter because of short respawns and fast running

for me the game just feels much more like quake mixed with tf2, i expected more enemy territory feeling