Hit Reg

(Sun_Sheng) #41

Cheers m8…that’s kind of what I expected was happening and what I experienced a lot of in the Cod series whenever I tried to play that. Basically you could go from one match to the next and feel either godlike or a complete nabje and that takes the fun right out of the game. So much so it stops you playing it. I have Ghosts with the season pack, about 80 of my hard earned pounds and i haven’t touched it since I got my beta key. No amount of money is worth the frustration.

Hopefully this won’t end up the same as I have a lot of hope for DB despite its flaws. At the same time I wouldn’t want to play something where I felt penalised for having a decent connection. In cod when you got shot like that you’d tell the other person to stop downloading so much porn (no insinuation that’s what is happening) but it gave rise to the idea that if you wanted to win, you just stick on a load of torrents and screw your connection as much as possible. I hope that doesn’t become the norm here too because that would basically be cheating. I could see it being a temptation though, or at least create that aggrieved perception, if this is down to lag comp. I loved ET because of the friendship and the community, cod i hated because it was always an abusive environment. Sometimes justified, most times not

Edit: regards the head shots and i think the first one just about hits as I start to duck behind the wall and he hits me with a body shot to drop me down to 44hp. Then next 1 or 2hs i get seem to be behind the wall

(Sun_Sheng) #42

Ok, i’m into wtf?! territory again with this video. It’s not too clear on the video so i’ve included a screenshot of where the bullet that takes my head clean off has gone, and where i’m stood with 100 health at the time it hits. This seems crazy to me at an olympic level and seems to be happening quite often since the patch, although that could be coincidental with a sudden influx of HPB’s

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//youtu.be/o-zqD2Q_bMs

(Mustang) #43

Very nice example of the “hitting people around corners BS”.

+rep

(Anti) #44

It is a client side game so if that guy had high latency then this makes sense. He spotted you when in open, shot you and hit on his client, that was sent to the server slowly then the server told you. His shot was legit you just found out late.

There isn’t much that can be done about this on the code side, client side makes high ping feel ok to play but leads to odd stuff like this, server side makes high ping horrible to play but doesn’t have these oddities, so they both have their benefits and faults.

Ultimately once we have more active players and servers we will probably add a system that removes high ping players from servers that are too far from them, which would solve this.

(Mustang) #45

There are things you can do that is better than nothing though, for example the say the guy with good ping keeps the server very very well updated then the server could say, “if he was behind cover as far as I’ve been made aware for the last 100ms then do half damage, if he was behind cover for 200ms then do zero damage”, basically a server side check that it’s somewhat legit, otherwise hackers and lagswitchers will reign free.

I support clientside hit detection, just with very stringent server side checks, which at the moment are too slack.

This doesn’t solve it, this just ignores the problem…

(Sun_Sheng) #46

Many thanks for the reply Anti, very much appreciated! :slight_smile: :smiley:

Do you know if ET was client/server? As I never remember having these sorts of problems then, and recently I seem to be feeling it a lot. Having said that, when I played ET, a 2Mb down connection (probably 256k up or similar) was considered extravagant and these days i’m running off 160/12Mb which is a vast difference and maybe technology hasn’t kept up. Still, it does feel sometimes like being penalised for a decent connection, even though technically it’s probably a fair fight if all things were equal.

If by removing HPB’s from a server it cures the problem than i’d have to say i’m all for it as I dread to think what fun it would be if i’d ducked down to revive someone behind the EV as well, as that would have led to us both being killed off I guess :confused:

(Mustang) #47

Serverside.

(Sun_Sheng) #48

Then let’s have some of that! :slight_smile: :smiley: <3

(Mustang) #49

This has it’s own undesirable problems, even better something in-between as I suggested, that is clientside with serverside sanity check.

(PixelTwitch) #50

The guy that shot was from is from austrilia and plays with a 300-500 ping so it makes sense he shot you from nearly a full second before you died…

Other cases where this would “mess up” is when you or he run around a corner… you would see him nearly a second before he sees you and if he does the same the result is the same…

With snipers this can be really frustrating!

(PixelTwitch) #51

[QUOTE=Mustang;507999]There are things you can do that is better than nothing though, for example the say the guy with good ping keeps the server very very well updated then the server could say, “if he was behind cover as far as I’ve been made aware for the last 100ms then do half damage, if he was behind cover for 200ms then do zero damage”, basically a server side check that it’s somewhat legit, otherwise hackers and lagswitchers will reign free.

This doesn’t solve it, this just ignores the problem…[/QUOTE]

Getting a clear headshot and hit beep to only have your shot not register would actually be more frustrating.
Right now the problem is more a frustration based one (in this example for instance) but it is fair. He shot Sun when Sun was in that location and if A++ had lower ping it would have 100% been a kill and likely not as far behind the cover so it would not be as frustrating for Sun.

While doing the check you are asking for would basically make playing over 100 ping unplayable.
In this case I have to say I agree with Anti and that the best solution is to remove high ping players completely to help frustration levels.
150 ping should be around the limit really. The reason why BF4 was so bad was because of the way the servers run on a 10/30 tick. (updating every 10 but calculating every 30) this means it was adding upto 190ms delay alone. With DB on 60 tick is 17ms delay from the server working it out alone. So around 150 ping SHOULD feel the same as BF4 at 30ish ping and anything lower should feel a lot better… I THINK!

(Mustang) #52

Actually I thought there was already this system in place where 120-130ms was the cutoff, so what I was proposing was a scaling system to make it fairer for highpingers, and not WTFBBQ for lowpingers.

(PixelTwitch) #53

kind of…
The current system (as far as I know) is to allow shots to register after you die…
The idea of shooting as your going down kinda thing…

This is the reason for the kill trades you sometimes get. While it is kinda like the system you are suggesting, it is more focused on the first problem I mentioned in my reply (the running around a corner advantage) so for when you are in a one vs one fight. It actually helps out both high and low pingers equally in that case because if its the high pinger running around a corner it is still him with the advantage anyway and the 100ms is to make it fair on the low ping player… HOWEVER, if the high ping player has above a certain amount of ping they still have an impossible advantage (can actually kill you before you see them and even before the end of the 100ms safty zone) This is why jumping high ping snipers are so OP in the current build. Providing they do not miss you literally had 0 chance to avoid the hit.

The BIGGEST problem I have with this whole system is the hit shake. Because its delay is ping based you can try and shoot a sniper with any weapon and get a couple of hits but he will still kill you with a headshot. This is due to the hit shake not yet happening on his system.

Overall this game should not be competitive because its technically broken by design…
That does not mean it cannot be fun though >.< Especially if they do LAN events :smiley:

(Sun_Sheng) #54

[QUOTE=PixelTwitch;508034]

The BIGGEST problem I have with this whole system is the hit shake. Because its delay is ping based you can try and shoot a sniper with any weapon and get a couple of hits but he will still kill you with a headshot. This is due to the hit shake not yet happening on his system[/QUOTE]
damn!! You must be psychic! ! I was just about to ask about that because I was thinking it was a nice shot considering I hit him a couple of times before I worked out he was a sniper and i didn’t fancy the head on at that range

(Violator) #55

I’m afraid I pretty much ignore any kill by anyone with a ping over 100 as my not great reaction times (was getting around 250ms on the tests posted above) can’t compensate for the prediction difference (no disrespect to any particular players out there) and the corner-kill thing :(. I also ignore a lot of luck-kills I get against hpbs in return that really shouldn’t have hit and yet they drop.

It is true that older games seemed to handle this a lot better. IMHO high pingers should be the ones to suffer on a given server as they will not generally be playing on it if the netcode can’t be fixed - no sense in everyone having to suffer in some way. The lack of non-EU players is forcing those players onto the EU servers atm.

I think Sun has a point with the direction the enemy is facing and trying to dodge where you think they’re aiming, I’ve never assumed that it may be wrong which would explain the lotto effect in most CQC fights. I can get a 5 kill streak and feel like I can’t miss then die 5 times in a row and feel like I couldn’t hit a barn door and this pattern will repeat in a match, not sure why this is. My ping tends to hover around 25-30 (I’m on 80MB fibre).

(Stinger) #56

Nah, this is just how client side hit detection works.It reminds me so much of BF 3 & 4. Its the most noticible when youre playing against people with high ping. Just pay attention of how you die when theres american invasion on EU server - it happens all the time when you try to duck behind cover while being shot.

(Sun_Sheng) #57


Nice local server…


So even if it’s a southern fairies server i’m probably going to suffer

Same goes for Germany

the biggest worry that it gives me is that it affects the way I play. My natural style is to use speed and movement as much as possible and be very direct. If I can’t rely on my aim, and in this case what i’m seeing, then it has an effect of my decision making, to such an extent that it makes me want to change my playing style, i:e avoid one on ones, hold back, and generally be more stealthy. That’s not something i’m particularly great at. I’ve had some great games forcing myself to play as a reviving medic for example, topping the leaderboard in terms of XP but with something like 3/17 kdr and that feels useful.

At the same time though, when i’m looking at the match in general and seeing that we really need to get a plant in so I should change to engineer, I now feel like I don’t want to change because I know i’ll get slaughtered down to the same kdr or worse, plus be lucky if I even get the plant in and hold off the defenders trying to defuse it. It makes you wonder where you fit in and why bother? Better to lag my connection out and get a fairer playing field. But that goes against my nature because it’s cheating, but at least i’d see what everyone else sees :frowning:

(Sun_Sheng) #58

I just tried this one m8 … http://www.humanbenchmark.com/tests/reactiontime/ wasgetting the same 210 -250 and 280ms as a worse case scenario for a 246 average :frowning: … old age is taking its toll lol

(Humate) #59

My average was 192 with that test.

edit: make that 188

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(Mustang) #60

Another fun test, my best so far is 17.041: http://www.echalk.co.uk/amusements/Games/pilotTrainer/pilotTrainer.html