Hit Reg

(Sun_Sheng) #21

Thanks again :slight_smile: appreciate it. …and i’d agree. From my side it seemed like we both started badly, finished not so well (although his duck was a better move) and in the middle hit each other with a couple of shots. As good or as bad as each other in other words. What ultimately concerned me was after coming away with that impression, it seemed to be stretching things to find out he must have got around 8 hits to kill me while I only managed 1.

(PixelTwitch) #22

Actually that “CoD” style thing you are talking about is present in every single FPS on the market to more or lesser degrees. The very fact that 100ms delay is the very minimum delay you will get in a game like this with it more likely to be around 300ms when all is said and done, that is also excluding human reaction times. One of the main issues with this type of client side hit reg is not actually fairness… It is the perceived fairness in the majority of cases.

The reason why its showing its face here is due to the speed of Dirty Bomb. Animation blending can only help the problem so much because when he hit you with them first shots it looks like he was hitting to the side of you and the truth is where he is aiming is where you was when he shot. Trying to blend the animation to look at where you are currently would actually be a lie and require a quiick instant visual change to line the shot up that would confuse other people watching the fight due to the fact that to them it would look like he is massively missing you.

I am not saying do this but its a mental exercise… If you was to slow the movement speed by 50% this issue would be reduced by 50%…

I suppose technically what your client COULD do to negate this problem currently would be to take the enemies current aim posisition and offset it with your own position by 50%. (only client side) This could result in stuttery looking fights unless implemented perfectly with decent blending. When it comes to the false hit beeps… You could have it so that it only triggers when the server says that you hit the enemy… However in that case you would have a 100-300ms delay and when you shoot bullets faster then that you run the risk of being given confusing information that makes you think you hit bullets that you miss and miss bullets that you hit. This would result in players over compensating their aim in many cases. Though it would prevent the false hit beeps.

You could go fully server based hit reg and while these kinda issues would be then negated, it would be the least fair implementation to people with uneven pings.

Meh, I don’t know… I just think the game has not been designed around the technical limitations…

(Nail) #23

fixed that for ya :wink:

(Sun_Sheng) #24

Well, i’m inclined to agree with your explanation, but by the same rule, I don’t remember these sorts of problems back in the day when I was playing Quake/Unreal, or even more recently playing ET. The problem seems to be a recent one that i’ve only noticed since I started playing COD a couple of years ago. That said, there were times in Quake when if you wanted to rail someone and you knew they had a bad ping then you’d wait for them running towards or away from you so it negated the ping difference, but even so, if you saw something hit, they’d go down.

That in mind, i can accept what Anti says with regard to spread and a higher rate of fire whereby you’d hit as your crosshair passed over them. Maybe it’s just damned bad luck that sometimes your bullet goes left when they go right and vice versa? Or we are in the Matrix after all :o Still, I find it strange that guys who made ET, RTCW, ETQW which I played with no noticeable concerns over aim, now have one where I do. I expect it with COD games, they’re useless and couldn’t make a working game if you paid them …which we do. With DB, this concern will hopefully disappear …somehow :slight_smile:

Actually, I would much prefer server based hit reg if that would be its effect. If you have a bad connection for some reason, you shouldn’t get an artificial boost at the expense of those with a decent connection. Call me Margaret Thatcher but that sounds like a pretty fair way of doing things. For the times when you’re playing someone who’s lagging like a B!, that too I can live with. Again going back to Quake, leading people when you were using a rocket launcher or plasma gun that used slow moving projectiles was just par for the course and part of the skill. Same as leading a lagger. If you know about it you can deal with it. If you’re thinking you’re hitting but aren’t, then that just goes back to the perceived fairness you mentioned

(HardyRah) #25

I think we need to remake duel or two and both record and see how it looks like. =) I belive that my crosshair was actually really close on you but my model animation was inaccurate / turning bit too slow.

(Sun_Sheng) #26

Sounds good :slight_smile: cheers. If I try to imagine it from your side then i’d agree. I’m taking hits pretty much straight away and consistently so I would guess that from your side you’re tracking me and down I go. From my side, the animation and feedback doesn’t seem to fit for 1 hit out of half a clip full of bullets. I’ll see if I can get any more videos of any similar experiences next time i play, just for comparison sake

Edit:

Something i’ve just noticed as a difference in styles… your movement is a left/right/left/right strafe, whilst mine is more of a circle strafe using forward and back as well. I’m wondering if that might affect the way the spread is implemented i:e stop-start compared to a more constant feeling of travel over distance?

(INF3RN0) #27

I recommend trying to aim more for the upper body than the head until your tracking improves. I think you’ll get better results that way imo, and the ttk isn’t that bad when it comes to bs with a lot of weapons. Otherwise I’d say it’s pretty easy to miss all your shots if your going for the smallest hitbox on the model.

(Humate) #28

Have a bit of fun with this - Link Sun_Sheng
No doubt it will help with your tracking and aim.

edit: oh and be sure to post your scores :slight_smile:

(Sun_Sheng) #29

Cheers guys :slight_smile: I’ll definitely give it a go (nothing better to do in work at the moment :stuck_out_tongue: )

I usually use the tried and trusted Raziel method…I’m too old to change lol and it’s served me well over the years http://www.teammuppet.eu/home/index.php?/topic/6058-aiming-by-raziel/

As a general rule my aim and tracking’s not too bad but age has dulled my reaction times. It’s not what i’d class as “great”, but it’s good enough to keep me alive most of the time…with all things being equal. I’m running at around about 23-4% in DB and was roughly the same in COD Ghosts which is enough to put me in something like the top 15-20% for aim stats. The downside is there are so many camping nabjes in that game, that’s probably not a stat to be proud of :stuck_out_tongue:

(Humate) #30

I’m older also, and I still have Reflex on the desktop. :wink:
This site is a bit more detailed and mature than that app.
I highly recommend it if you want to improve the 23% accuracy. :slight_smile:

(Anti) #31

[QUOTE=Humate;506738]Have a bit of fun with this - Link Sun_Sheng
No doubt it will help with your tracking and aim.

edit: oh and be sure to post your scores :)[/QUOTE]

Which one are we supposed to try? :slight_smile:

Had a go at exact aiming and it made me feel old :frowning:

(Humate) #32

All of them :slight_smile:
If you have a go at one and plateau after a few tries, playing a different type of test will help you break that plateau.

But in general I recommend:

*EA
*EA Dot
*EA Dot Plus
*EA Masters
*Press Reaction
*Press Reaction Pro
*Press Reaction V2
*Fast Aiming Mass Click

(spookify) #33

I have like ADD and I loss interest after 2 minutes haha! I get super high and then ADD kicks in and im like F it! Back to zero!

(Mustang) #34

I like the fact that none of them imitate a players movement, that is something I’d be more interested to see.

(Humate) #35

wax on wax off!
:penguin:

(Mustang) #36

[QUOTE=Humate;506904]wax on wax off!
:penguin:[/QUOTE]
Maybe so, but I’d rather train tracking and prediction than reactions.

(Humate) #37

Tracking - http://aim400kg.ru/en/ea_v2/
Prediction - http://aim400kg.ru/en/ea_pro/

But yeh I can see how it can be too mechanical :slight_smile:

(Sun_Sheng) #38

Update for feedback:

Quite by accident I discovered it’s possible to set the mouse sensitivity in-game rather than from the main menu and, by doing that you can fine tune the sensitivity much more. Previously I had my sensitivity set to 1 in-game and last night I tried with it set to 1.3. That seemed to make no real difference and if anything, compounded the problem. This morning i tried the other way and set it to 0.8 and that seems to have my aim more consistent and back on track. I might need to drop it to 0.7 to really nail it, but i’ll stick with 0.8 and see how that goes for a while before playing about with it again.

In summation, how people live with the other 99.2 settings I don’t know!! but also it could be worth making the option of fine tuning a bit more obvious in the main menu as well. With regard to the original experience, PEBKAC/Aim seems to have played a major part although potentially the things Anti mentioned in relation to sync and animation may take out the problem or ‘perceived problem’ completely

(Sun_Sheng) #39

Bit of an update to this one. If you get a moment, please could you have a look into this video as well. It was taken playing against a few HPB’s on the 15th I think. My query in regard to it is not so much aim this time, but i’m struggling to decide if because they were hpb’s, I was suffering lag comp, or if the hitboxes are so much wider than I imagine and i’m guilty of ostrich syndrome i:e I can’t see them so i’m safe, they can’t see me either.

What I see from my perspective is that i’ve realised i’m in for a kicking, so I duck behind the wall with 54 health left, take another to the body that drops me to 44 as I go behind the wall, but then I lose that whole 44 while i’m behind cover, and also I get in 2 or 3 headshots straight through the wall. :confused:

//youtu.be/Mbaf8f0RgFE

(Humate) #40

As someone that played the alpha entirely on high ping :frowning: I might be able to help you.
The game uses a WYSIWYG system, which means players arent required to lead aim they just shoot at what they see.
From the HPB’s perspective your model would be in the doorway not behind the wall, when he kills you.
The second thing is you dont actually hs the guy through the wall it happened slightly before you backed around the wall. The hit indicators dont decay instantly, so it will give the impression you are still doing damage.

Also the player that fragged you -prophett, we’re talking 40% accuracy here.