etqwstat.activision.com !

[asmo]

Hi,

http://etqwstat.activision.com/ is up but not updating anymore !!! :magicpony:

                                                                      :stroggflag:

[Aristotle]

Good for it.

[asmo]

it’s tragedy, not good, if i wouldn’t care about something but you would love it i would vote YES for it, yes, even if i’ll have no use from it. I don’t get why so big hate for stats.

[Aristotle]

it’s tragedy, not good, if i wouldn’t care about something but you would love it i would vote YES for it, yes, even if i’ll have no use from it. I don’t get why so big hate for stats.

It’s one of the things that ruined this game, and has made it so only a very small portion of the community will do anything with custom content because everybody else is obsessed with the stats that really mean nothing. Just because you have the most xp overall, or have all your awards doesn’t mean anything in game. Somebody with no awards at all can still completely own somebody with all of them. The only thing the stats are good for is killing the custom content community.

[canvasback]

It’s one of the things that ruined this game, and has made it so only a very small portion of the community will do anything with custom content.

This.

extra text here

[ED209]

Whether you like the stats or not, the fact the site is down shows the level of support you can expect.

[WhiteAden]

It’s one of the things that ruined this game, and has made it so only a very small portion of the community will do anything with custom content because everybody else is obsessed with the stats that really mean nothing. Just because you have the most xp overall, or have all your awards doesn’t mean anything in game. Somebody with no awards at all can still completely own somebody with all of them. The only thing the stats are good for is killing the custom content community.

seconded…

[Stroggafier]

I also don’t get the hate-on for stats??

Stats extend the game by providing additional objectives
When done right, stats provide insight into personal performance
When done poorly, stats can disenfranchise (e.g. allow cheating/whoring and some stats or “achievements” become meaningless, not all stats)

Have stats prevented you, @Aristotle or @WhiteAden, from participating in the custom maps or other aspects of ETQW? you should allow others to have the same sensibilities, or at least the choice.

If players find pursuing stats more fun than running custom maps, thats not a problem for stats, thats a problem for custom content. I believe your lament over custom content would be better directed at the lack of official support for custom content, than the bogie of stats. I’d push for better stats and stat support and official map recognition as the answer.

[Aristotle]

[QUOTE=Stroggafier;206657]

Have stats prevented you, @Aristotle or @WhiteAden, from participating in the custom maps or other aspects of ETQW? [/QUOTE]

Actually yes. With the vast majority of players only playing for stats, meaning they play on ranked servers, which means no custom content (maps more than anything) on a wide scale. There are vast numbers of players who would never set foot on a server if it wasn’t ranked, even if it ran no mod and full vanilla settings, putting the number of servers that one who wishes to play custom maps to such a small number. There are only two server’s I know of that really ever have players on them with custom maps, and they are generally only busy during European peak hours, which means a lot of North American players wouldn’t be able to make it. Then there is the TAW’s Battle for Earth that takes place on custom maps ( I believe anyway ) but you have to be a member of TAW to join them. If they would remove the stats, or at least allow you to add custom maps/content to ranked servers, there would me a far larger market for custom maps and content. Look at Enemy Territory, no ranked servers, and more maps for the game than you could possibly play in a month, and almost every populated server has at least one custom map in their rotation, with a huge custom content community.

[asmo]

first of all, i wanted to quote few folks who wrote before me but it’s too much and im known to be lazy. so.

Why stats are good:

you wait for anansi, being fieldops (yes, to get even more XP by marking deployable targets), mate near you who is last time mostly Nazzz, fly with me. We have strategy on each map, that leads us to win after max 12 minutes since start. Rest of team doing crap at the time. Doing the obj give me ~250XP per map, starting from reffinery. This is because of excelent anansi usage (yes im mostly GDF player) but also by covering the teammate in FT, eventually finisshing the OBJ which he started but died while in progress. This all is amazing exprience which i believe SD wanted to provide, but here we go, many players wont exprience it because teamplay is not forced and being XP whore atumatically gets you ignored / kicked before you can evolve with your tactic during gameplay. Check how much wins brought anansi transport on Island, while transporting the OBJ guy to the antenna. This is epic win each time it works.

Look, i can go with positives just whole day but at end you will wonder how it’s releated to stats - stats are important to keep yoiu interested in doing objectives in the terminator mode but in same time, you keep in mind the most effective way gain most XP.

Why stats are bad:

I noticed many guys (i check who’s 10th+ places before me and few after me, with some i play, yes, now you are right - in 75% of cases we have XP whoring, why ? because teamplay is not enough rewarded and yes with ETQW there’s no way to measure it. I have no idea how it will be with Brink but what i want to tell - as soon teamplay will be rewared, teamplay matches will own 90% of public scene
but why it’s bad: XP whore, blocking servers owned by farmers, glitches used, now i would deny base raping as it should have no penalty (kicks/bans/spec moving), get AVT/panza and done, sick rules with no SK… my oppinon.

new stats system need to be invented, the idea was good and works for me, doesn’t work in many cases but you will always find some folks ready for teamplay. depends where yoi hang on.
try not to complain on stats as reason why some players sux.

[WhiteAden]

[QUOTE=Stroggafier;206657]I also don’t get the hate-on for stats??

Stats extend the game by providing additional objectives
When done right, stats provide insight into personal performance
When done poorly, stats can disenfranchise (e.g. allow cheating/whoring and some stats or “achievements” become meaningless, not all stats)[/QUOTE]
when done right it provides a bonus to gameplay, but that’s where the problem lies, I’ve often seen people just whore their rocketlauncher, vehicles or artillery outside while the objective moved indoors… thus giving a false sense of even teams… thus ruining the gameplay…

Have stats prevented you, @Aristotle or @WhiteAden, from participating in the custom maps or other aspects of ETQW? you should allow others to have the same sensibilities, or at least the choice.

Yes, not directly, but indirect, because most people want their stats, so they don’t play unranked servers, which are running the custom maps, and due to a lot of people not willing to play unranked, custom mappers/modders are stuck with say a total of 60 people* to get feedback from, instead of the possible 250** which gives them more feedback, thus better problemsolving / balancing / motivation
60 people*, that is if they all show up, 3 almost full servers (24slot servers)…
250 people**, that’s 10 full servers

*: maybe 60 casual/ ex-comp. players, I don’t know how many people are still / were playing competitive…

**: I know a lot of people are not fond of downloading stuff manually / messing with their files, so I’m not being pessimistic about the 250, I’m being realistic about the hassle they need to go through, and this would be the average every weekend (except holidays)

If players find pursuing stats more fun than running custom maps, thats not a problem for stats, thats a problem for custom content. I believe your lament over custom content would be better directed at the lack of official support for custom content, than the bogie of stats. I’d push for better stats and stat support and official map recognition as the answer.

incorrect! Promod offers auto-download, and that gives us the freedom to play “vanilla style” with autodownload, also promod has some features which can improve custom maps (think changing the respawn time of vehicles to make bigger maps more enjoyable / or prevent vehiclewhoring… also the lack of official support for custom maps is Activision’s fault, and who’s in charge of the stats again? Activision… so our hatred for stats is still grounded if you dig further =)

enough rambling, my fingers hurt from typing…

Aden out

:stroggtapir:

[DrFunkenstein]

If they would remove the stats, or at least allow you to add custom maps/content to ranked servers, there would me a far larger market for custom maps and content.

This is the important part, it’s the way it’s all tied together that spelled doom for custom content.

The things you see on the stats site itself are mostly irrelevant. The personal things (weapons, vehicles etc.) aren’t detailed enough and the “leader boards” are basically meaningless. People like to play for the awards and ranks and track their progress there, hurrah for them! As long as they don’t try to “milk it”, I’m fine with that.

The only reason I was glad the stats site was brought back to life some time ago, was the fact that sites like Geezers use their xml files to produce something more meaningful with it. Currently trying to improve my (headshot) accuracy and it’s nice to have something to keep track of progress. Cankors site was really suited for this, but that died an untimely death.

There’s stats and there’s the way you use them.

Dr. Funkenstein

[Stroggafier]

Guys, with all due respect, all you have really said is that stat whoring appears to be more fun than playing custom maps. If that were not the case, then according to your argument, those folks would be playing custom maps.

Your argument in another context is: If we take away all automaker’s colours except the colour red, then no one can choose those bad colours and ergo all will be better with red only. (To obviate misinterpretion, in the above statement, replace colours with “features”, bad with “stats”, red with “custom maps”, and automaker with ETQW.)

Please don’t blame others for not doing what you want them to, i.e. supporting your desire to play custom maps. Stats have not prevented you from doing what you want, but you’d like more and would be willing to take away stats from others to get more of what you want.

Instead, support a stat done well approach, and support an official custom map process done well.

(Activision is another kettle of fish)

[Apples]

I never blame ppl for not playing custom maps, I’m just sad we are like 10 max playing it the sundays, you just have to double click on the server and wait a bit to join us, is that so hard?

peace

[Aristotle]

Guys, with all due respect, all you have really said is that stat whoring appears to be more fun than playing custom maps. If that were not the case, then according to your argument, those folks would be playing custom maps.

I never once mentioned the word fun, that was somebody else. I said that the majority of the people who care about stats whore/milk/whatever you want to call it and don’t care about anything else but their stats and their rank, regardless of whether it’s fun or not, but personally I don’t see how sitting behind a MCP doing nothing but repairing it constantly for 20 minutes is fun in anybody’s book. Those people would never touch an unranked server because anything they do there will not be tracked in their stats, meaning that there are far fewer players who are willing to play on servers with custom content, maps more than anything. Also, everybody I have ever talked to on a ranked server who wasn’t overly concerned about stats have all said they want new maps and when the custom maps are mentioned they will say they won’t play on them because those servers aren’t ranked, which really comes back to the fact that on some unconscious level they care about stats over anything else. Which is why I said that it would be best to either get rid of the stats all together, or at least allow ranked servers to run custom maps.

Please don’t blame others for not doing what you want them to, i.e. supporting your desire to play custom maps.

I don’t blame anybody but Activision for it, and I never said I did. I simply said that I’m glad the stats don’t work.

Good for it.

It’s one of the things that ruined this game, and has made it so only a very small portion of the community will do anything with custom content because everybody else is obsessed with the stats that really mean nothing.

Everything I said I have said from the standpoint that stats are to blame for killing the custom content community.

[QUOTE=Stroggafier;206682] Stats have not prevented you from doing what you want, but you’d like more and would be willing to take away stats from others to get more of what you want.
[/QUOTE]

Let me repeat myself.

There are only two server’s I know of that really ever have players on them with custom maps, and they are generally only busy during European peak hours, which means a lot of North American players wouldn’t be able to make it. Then there is the TAW’s Battle for Earth that takes place on custom maps ( I believe anyway ) but you have to be a member of TAW to join them. If they would remove the stats, or at least allow you to add custom maps/content to ranked servers, there would me a far larger market for custom maps and content.

Stats keep people away from those servers, taking away my ability to play custom maps a lot of the time, not always, but the majority of the time.

[Stroggafier]

Ah now I see, what you mean. Although perhaps I would have a different take on these points.[ol][li] In many minds, Ranked = Quality, Unranked = Take your chances. (I don’t think that has anything to do with stats). Like you, I can’t see the attraction of stat whoring. However, I do see the frustration associated with setting up unranked capability on my PC and potentially wasting my time getting seriously pwned on maps that I’ve not had a chance to play beforehand, or on maps that I may not even like.
[/li]
[li] Where is the evidence to suggest that eliminating stats means folks will therefore switch to Unranked/custom play. That’s abit of a leap. It’s just as possible that those folks would simply not play, period. So its better to keep them stat gathering, then have them absent. Indeed, this is the perspective of many who implement stats.
[/li]
[li] It seems we both feel the same way about Activision.
[/li]
[li] Although the player blame we speak of, is not explicitly stated, the implication you make is clear. Your logic appears to be similar to “Guns kill people”, so get rid of guns. It can be argued that “Guns don’t kill people, but people using guns kill people”. We might blame the gun, but we certainly blame the person using the gun. The gun didn’t make the person perform the act. Hence, as much as thou protest, me thinks the blame you ascribe is obvious. The blame is “People Playing for Stats” not “Stats”.
[/li]
[li] You say that your ablity to play unranked is dependant on others to some extent. After all, you can’t play alone. Why is that? You believe its because of #2 and #4 above. I believe its because of #1 above. I also believe that if the custom maps were supported more, and officially recognized or certified, many more folks would play them with or without stats, and even more folks might play if stats were added. So, let’s hear it for stats! And let’s hear it for official custom map support!
[/li][/ol]

[Aristotle]

[li]In many minds, Ranked = Quality, Unranked = Take your chances. (I don’t think that has anything to do with stats). Like you, I can’t see the attraction of stat whoring. However, I do see the frustration associated with setting up unranked capability on my PC and potentially wasting my time getting seriously pwned on maps that I’ve not had a chance to play beforehand, or on maps that I may not even like.

[/li]
I can see how some people would get frustrated with the fact that they don’t know the maps, but it’s not so much different as it was when they played the game for the first time. If they never played against the computer, they would have no idea where or what anything was.

You could always play the custom maps offline a few times to get a general idea of where objectives are, some custom maps even support bots.

[QUOTE=Stroggafier;206701]
[li] Where is the evidence to suggest that eliminating stats means folks will therefore switch to Unranked/custom play. That’s abit of a leap. It’s just as possible that those folks would simply not play, period. So its better to keep them stat gathering, then have them absent. Indeed, this is the perspective of many who implement stats.[/quote]
[/li]
Not saying it would be guaranteed that everybody would switch to unranked, but without stats there is no reason to have a two types of servers, no reason for people to call them ranked or unranked, and people could add new maps to their rotation freely.

[li] It seems we both feel the same way about Activision.

[/li]
+1

[li] Although the player blame we speak of, is not explicitly stated, the implication you make is clear. Your logic appears to be similar to “Guns kill people”, so get rid of guns. It can be argued that “Guns don’t kill people, but people using guns kill people”. We might blame the gun, but we certainly blame the person using the gun. The gun didn’t make the person perform the act. Hence, as much as thou protest, me thinks the blame you ascribe is obvious. The blame is “People Playing for Stats” not “Stats”.

[/li]
Yeah I will agree to that, there is an undertone to my arguments of blaming some players. Playing for stats can be innocent, I will admit that, it’s just to the degree that a lot of players will take it to, ie tk’ing to get objectives, flipping out over VoIP because somebody stole your hack/build ect.

Oh, the last part of that made me laugh too.

[QUOTE=Stroggafier;206701][li] You say that your ablity to play unranked is dependant on others to some extent. After all, you can’t play alone. Why is that? You believe its because of #2 and #4 above. I believe its because of #1 above. I also believe that if the custom maps were supported more, and officially recognized or certified, many more folks would play them with or without stats, and even more folks might play if stats were added. So, let’s here it for stats! And let’s here it for official custom map support!
[/li][/QUOTE]

I could play alone, but playing against bots gets real old real fast.

I agree with giving custom maps and content more recognition and support. I’d love to see ranked servers allow us to add them to the rotation, with or without stats, so as long as they get played by more than the same 10-15 people.

[ED209]

Most people I play with have no idea if the stats site is up or down. The main reason I play ranked is because that is where the players are… er… playing. Be it the shiny noobs or the older grizzled vets, you can usually find somebody on a ranked. Unfortunatley I reckon you need a bigger fan base to support the custom content community. I’ve played custom and mods (loved DuskMod) but unless it was organised we had to go back to Vanilla.

Even when I played W:ET, we played custom content, but 9/10 times we were playing the same 6 map campaign over and over

[asmo]

it just came to my head:

i preffer the stats to stay down, than when sometimes it’s working, sometimes it’s not.

if it’s down, i wont play etqw
if it’s up, i will play
but when it’s like now - working/not working - you think “how the hell such big company can have problem with simple stats system”. I DON’T GET IT!!! SHAME!!!

[timestart]

Go play WoW instead