Community Question: Stamina Bars

(badman) #1

Those of you playing Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory will be familiar with that game’s stamina bar - sprinting and jumping eat up certain amounts of the bar, and it recovers when you’re not doing either one of those things. Both Enemy Territory: QUAKE Wars and Brink did away with the stamina bar, allowing for unlimited sprinting/jumping/SMARTing. But which system works better? This neatly leads us to this week’s Community Question:

How do you feel about stamina bars limiting the amount of sprinting and jumping available to players?

Please vote in the poll above and do let us know your arguments for and against this kind system in the comments.

(DarkangelUK) #2

I prefer no stamina bar, but again that’s down to my movement preference. These are meant to be elite soldiers you’re controlling, and they can’t run for more than 5 seconds without getting out of breath :smiley:

(Pytox) #3

Stamina bars ftw!!!

(Humate) #4

Provided the movement system is exactly like ETQW, no stamina bar.

(badman) #5

Can you elaborate what you like about ETQW’s system for those who might not have played it? Thanks!

(light_sh4v0r) #6

I prefer no stamina as well, having full sprinting available makes the game feel a lot faster. It feels very sluggish sprinting for some seconds and then having to walk again, like you ran into a pile of goo.

(BrinkTourist) #7

I really like the movement of a light bodytype character in Brink. The only thing that bothers me is SMART not being too smart.

(Humate) #8

ETQW vs ‘Cover shooters’

In cover shooters like BC2/BF3/COD, they use this clunky animated sprint system that not only makes you feel 150kg, but experientially feels like youre locked onto a certain path. Theres a level of restriction and lack of control, which Rahdo frames as - “a boots to the ground feel” that is not present in ETQW.

In ETQW you feel fast, agile and skilful… in a tasteful, balanced way that you can take seriously.

ET vs ETQW -
From memory ETQW uses a sprint system but only for moving forwards while also unlimited. ET I believe sprint can be used while strafing from a static position - which means the player which was camping a certain position gets the benefit of the sprint bar in a fight over the player, that used the sprint bar to get to that position. Not saying thats good or bad, a lot of it depends on the size of the maps and the overall speed. In a brand new game, the ET method of sprint bar is a nice way of slowing down the action, that is already near the threshold of a frantic pace. Like I said about my description of ETQW - the pace was balanced, wasnt over the top and it wasnt uninspiring so there was no need for the bar.

Hopes this clarified my original response badman.

(king_troll) #9

they are kind of pointless, man can chain smoke, eat iced buns and drink whiskey and still sprint 2 and a half miles like a real marine, yorkies with biscuit and raisens are special when you find them in a shop

(wolfnemesis75) #10

Halo Reach has stamina bar. I hate them.

(Indloon) #11

Well,it’s pretty annoying while your stamina bar is empty at Wolfenstein:ET,but then when you have charged,then TING TING TING.

But why not to add a unlock,?
Like play with medic to level 5(W:ET) then you ill get unlimited sprint.

This makes stamina bar haters and lovers to enjoy the game.

(Humate) #12

To answer your unlock question:

Sprint bars only work when everyone has one… not a select few. :slight_smile:
Its perceieved depth comes from deciding when and where to use it, to gain an advantage.

(SebaSOFT) #13

There is no option for “stamina system but not in a bar” like “heavy breathing”

(Slade05) #14

SD makes games about strafejumping supermans, why add a crippler?

(tokamak) #15

I like the stamina bar but I think the consequence of depleting it should be different. Depleting your stamina bar should cause slower spread recovery (because you’re exhausted) rather than taking away your sprint. This would decrease the power of lemming rushes considerably.

(Humate) #16

The other thing with the stamina bar that I forgot to mention ( but it was implied ), is that someone who hasnt used their stamina bar might not be consciously conserving it to gain an advantage in a particular moment, yet are reaping the rewards from it anyway.

I prefer stuff like the risk-reward switch to knife mechanic, because it prompts a player to be proactive with it. A player running around with a knife or a pistol, 99.999999999% is intentionally doing so to gain a speed boost.

Same with the walk function - there arent going to be many players who accidental use walk.

With a stamina bar, I don’t see players always basing their movement decisions around it.

(Apoc) #17

I think limiting movement in games is a horrific trend, it takes away so much depth. Games like battlefield where you can almost feel clumsy legs underneath you really annoy me.

The problem is consoles. Consoles cant really strafe shoot. So games are getting dumbed down to what we regularly see today, run forward, see someone, stop, shoot them. Whoever saw the other first wins. Its horrible, strafing is fantastic, or any variation on it, dodging, jumping, flying (been playing tribes, its amazing and adds a new level to the game) as it means that some idiot who has no idea how to play wont just point his huge spread high damage weapon in your general direction and kill you with footshots. It actually encourages and improves aim, which i feel is a large part of fps games (yes yes there are lots of other parts, tactics, coms etc).

The beauty of quake wars unlimited sprint and movement system was that it meant people were not punished for trying to get somewhere, no one wants to push into an objective fast and skillfully only to get shot down by someone who has just been sitting in there keeping their stamina bar full so they can out strafe you. It balanced out the game very well. Every fight was fair, the only way one person would have an advantage in a one on one gun fight, was their choice of weapons, with heavy weapons sacificing speed for power and vice versa.

As someone else pointed out, quakes movement was very smooth, you didnt feel held back, which was why it was such a pleasure to play. Didnt feel like you had someone else controlling your movement, which led to further depth when choosing how to move for what situation, as opposed to recent games with the choice of:sprint forward (not shooting), stop and shoot.

Stamina bars are really just an annoying feature. I mean they dont add much depth, i guess you have to time your movement and conserve energy but really all its doing is slowing down the pace of the game and frustrating people who want to just play without being held back.

Im a big fan of rewarding skill. Quake wars did this. You had normal sprinting, then if players payed attention and used their heads, they noticed running with a knife made them run faster. Then players noticed if you strafe jumped you went even faster, those who practiced a little reaped the benefits.
It meant letting every player have all the tools at their disposal right off the bat, and giving them the choice if they wanted to learn how to use them. As opposed to games these days, where you have 2000 unlocks that do everything for you, but only once youve played 500 hours.

(tokamak) #18

Quake Wars’ infinite sprinting was mainly to reduce the need for vehicles to bridge the vast expenses. The scale of the game needs to be considered when establishing movement mechanics.

And you like skill right? Knowing when and where to use your sprint as a resources is just as much a skill as strafe-jumping or picking a knife. I’d wager one that adds more depth as the consequences of mismanagement are far more severe than the others.

(Scrupus) #19

I don’t like stamina bars that restrict the movement, like in ET.

I think the way it was implemented in ETQW was pretty good. The only consequence there (I think?) was that you started panting when you had sprinted too long - which was quite important to be aware of when hiding in disguise within enemies groups, but not a problem elsewhere. A nice tactical twist IMHO, for both parties. :infiltrator:

Stamina bar might be good for some types of games or maps - but mostly I feel it’s just annoying, both by cluttering the HUD and the “downgrade”.effect when it’s depleted.

(Cep) #20

I prefer no stamina bar but still a stamina limit. As in, after prolonged running you start tiring. ETQW did a good job in that after prolonged running your strogg would start breathing heavily which your enemies could hear.