Actually changing the “Medic” for the “Nurse” class would be quite a deal. As a woman “medic” would be harder to hit(smaller body), shorter(so could run along the brick wall having head covered, for example. And to put some cost on it it would run for shorter time, and have some Machine pistol as a weapon, not the standard, full size rifle, what makes medics in ET/ETQW the ultimate self-healing soldiers, reminding rather Rambo, than any real-life medic occupation in some army…
I’d prefer more specialized medic class. Nurse does the job well, and also fixes the parity problem :P. Can’t wait to say “Revive me lady!” to some asshole passing by and paying no attention to his team-role ;-). Pronounce it like “milady” and it’s all the way perfect ;-).
Done joking, the problem is serious, and during writing this post I totally converted my own opinion - I want nurse instead of medic!
I would in a sense keep the 5 classes but have it that players be a specialist in a class but can pick and choose various skills or weapons from other to aid them to become the ultimate commando.
So once a player has gained the top level in a particular class they get perks and the ability to use certain weapons whilst being other classes, so you could have a specialist medic who has a sniper rifle or an engineer with a flamethrower. To go on further, i would improve it by…
Engineer specialists get engineering crates so instead of merely constructing set apparatus on the map they get to choose where to construct the mg nests, whereabouts the bridge gets built, look out tower, assault ramp etc Does he choose 2 road block crates at the expense of landmines? This would take the first ET to the next level instead of being just a copy. This would also enable stock maps to be able to be played in totally different ways each time, with much thought in perfecting various routes etc and increasing tactical variety. Once the engineer gets to top level they would then get transferable perks to other specialist classes such as a pliers for reconstructing damaged engineering constructions, remote bomb, sticky bombs and land mines.
Those that specialize as a Medic have to themselves the usual continuous health packs and revive whilst gaining the transferable perk of First aid kit which instantly replenishes the health of a player but can only be used once then requires supply crate to restock it. That way an engineer can choose a first aid kit to take with them in place of mines etc if they want.
Rename Field ops to scout and give them the ability to have a motorbike in addition to keeping the ammo crates and arty etc for themself, whilst allowing the transference to other classes of a supply airdrop flare which parachutes in ammo. I would also give the scout the sniper rifle instead of the covert op (or Spy) as they can scout the are through the scope.
Rename the covert op “the spy”, give them the new ability to have a decoy which alerts enemy to place on map when used. They would keep the uniform change for them self but have linguistics (the ability to communicate with the enemy in their team vsays when in a certain range of the enemy), or pickpocketing ( stealing the grenades and ammo of the enemy whilst standing behind them) and “wire” which can be attached between landmines to trigger them or for garroting, and Molotovs transferred to other classes.
Soldier would gain the ability to climb with a grappling hook but this kept to them self because of his superior strength whilst getting scuba gear and heavy weapons transferred to other classes once top level is reached. So an engineer could guard and plant a dynamite under water using a scuba gear etc. or canvas his mine field with a heavy gun or become a pyromaniac using explosives and flamethrowers.
There would be a certain set amount of slots or weapons that can be carried into battle and up to the player to choose what he goes with and specializes in enabling thousands of different combinations and increasing tactical dynamics of the gameplay.
Like this
In a sense every player can become their own unique commando, their character becomes a representative of their gameplay.
[QUOTE=YouAreGood;408130]Actually changing the “Medic” for the “Nurse” class would be quite a deal. As a woman “medic” would be harder to hit(smaller body), shorter(so could run along the brick wall having head covered, for example. And to put some cost on it it would run for shorter time, …
Can’t wait to say “Revive me lady!” to some asshole passing by and paying no attention to his team-role ;-). Pronounce it like “milady” and it’s all the way perfect ;-).[/QUOTE]Women? Are you sure you’re not thinking of Dwarves?
I don’t think Splash Damage are prejudiced. They can make a male nurse model with some tight fitting scrubs for surgeons to ogle, if that’s their thing.
Dystopia has a good form of dynamic classes using three body types. Loadouts could be changed and customized in game and saved as presets. To summarize the system,
Body Types:
[ul]
[li]Heavies: Heavy weapons are armor, slow speed, very little class points and energy to use them. [/li][li]Mediums: Mid range weaponry and armor, intermediate speed and mantling, lots of class points and energy. [/li][li]Lights: Light weaponry and armor, fast speed and mantling, lots of class points and energy. [/li][/ul]
Class points (costs for each varied and actives and passives came out of the same point pool):
[ul]
[li]Active abilities (cost energy): things like med that helped the team, radar pulse that helped the team, cloaking, silent movement, various night vision or audio sensor systems and more I can’t recall. [/li][li]Passive abilities: additional energy, IFF hud (friendly fire=on), super jump, fast reload, additional ammo, and more I can’t recall. [/li][/ul]
Pair this level of class customization with weapon customization and you have a free-to-play designer’s wet dream. Dystopia is/was a really creative class and objective based source mod that it seems like a lot of the class/objective junkies here overlooked.
Nevertheless we all are flaming, like it would be important, whether or not Rad Soldiers for PC will have a commander class.
Let’s take it easy, idea is super-cool, as fun as ultra-realistic village simulation, it just does not fit “The Unannounced”, maybe it is the title…
Chris placed the suggestion within a context. Reread his post. Also, not only does a commander role exist in Rad Soldiers but it is the only role a player can play.
Almost all elements are unnecessary. Without exception, all classes, weapons, objectives, maps and so on can be rolled into one.
The universe involves large scale organized conflict so of course it does. However, I doubt the franchise holds any real value, even if SD could use it. I assume you’re referring more to gameplay, in which vehicle play also certainly didn’t seem to fit.
Make sure you’re not missing a difference - in the Splash Damage model the “commander” is not able to force allocation people don’t want. Do you think it’s wrong approach?
[QUOTE=BioSnark;408144]
The universe involves large scale organized conflict so of course it does. However, I doubt the franchise holds any real value, even if SD could use it. I assume you’re referring more to gameplay, in which vehicle play also certainly didn’t seem to fit.[/QUOTE]
I’d say its fairly small ;-). And about IDs - remember gothic and PiranhaBytes? See what they did having no rights to Gothic - another gothic game, with different name only. Can Splash Damage do the same? The fact we are here is the answer.
Introducing a commander role would move the game into a different direction for sure. Matches would be longer most likely as a result too as to gather resources and research upgrades and the like wouldn’t be instant. Also remember we have a primary objective to complete, would be tricky to still have players focus on those objectives and the teamwork needed to complete those whilst keeping in mind the resource side of things.
People seem to wrongly think that players have to obey the commander, the commander how I imagine it is a single support role, they advice the rest of the team about where to go depending on what they see on their overhead view. They can drop supplies to aid players who are struggling to get past a choke point or so. They would research new upgrades that would be available to the team to use (purchase using individual resources), what upgrades he chooses would hopefully be based on the circumstances of that given match. All this would be supplementary not mandatory, a lousy commander would just mean the team has to be more self reliant using their own resources more to get what they require.
I haven’t really thought about it that much as you can tell, was just to promote discussion, simply saying it doesn’t fit the unannounced title we know nothing about without giving a reason isn’t a great discussion.
Anyway, beyond that I’m not sure what else you could possibly add, I think simply refining the existing classes would be more than adequate if the next game largely plays like previous ones.
Have yet to get into NS2 so I can’t really comment on the idea of a commander role, although from what I’ve seen it’s a fun addititon to team MP shooters.
For classes I would indeed stick to the classic 5 heavy weapons, medic, engi, fops and sniper. I reckon you could move some of the commander elements to the fieldops, as a fieldops you’re pretty much a regular soldier who gets to call in fireworks at times.
Hey Chris, hope you;re having good time on the forum!
simply saying it doesn’t fit the unannounced title we know nothing about without giving a reason isn’t a great discussion.
Look, you are replying for a joke, that was where it was just to remind - just in case - we are talking about the unknown game(only game) and not only because of that we shall not flame too much.
Anyway though my argument was the following: The commander class provides nothing we cannot have without it. All it does is that it forces certain allocation, that was up to people before. If players will like to listen to someones advice - they will set the supply crate in expected place. If they don’t want the supply on the roof though - they will not. My question is - do you want people to have nothing to say?
I know it may sound offensive, though don’t worry - no bad feelings are involved :).
Anyway, beyond that I’m not sure what else you could possibly add, I think simply refining the existing classes would be more than adequate if the next game largely plays like previous ones.
Agreed.
light_sh4v0r
Great idea! Lets distribute the commanders abilities amongst the classes, and among the players. Field ops might have fire-support abilities, medic(nurse!) would deploy supply crates…
Probably a bit offtopic but I think that classes are wrong implemented in a lot of games because in almost every shooter the medics plays in the frontline while it’s that task of the soldier class. So they die first while it’s actually a support role.
In ETQW the technician is even the most powerfull class with stroyent (health+ammo+stroyup/down) this class don’t need the team for supplies and can frag forever when not dieing or overheat the weapon.
A commander in a FPS is useless (unless it’s a “bot” high command/makron), because pub games aren’t organised anyway, players just don’t care about orders etc. that’s my exprience with Battlefield 2.
For ETQW I would take out the Field Ops, give ammo packs to Soldier and airstrike to Covert Ops, 4 classes are fine.
Breo
+1 for RamboMedic problem description. See my post about nurse class(specialized replacement for medic) somewhere above. What do you think about that alternative?
Rambo medics arent a problem. If you actually care about winning, you’re not going to complain about someone dropping 80 kills a map. However I can definitely understand having issue with incompetent rambo medics. But then you could make that complaint about all the other classes as well.
You know, these frags are deeply connected with deaths of ppl trying to do the objective… Therefore overpowered class is not good thing not only for those, who loves only dueling, but also for those who loves only winning. Finishing this answer - mix both to get a real-life case.
Maintaining area control aka fragging = completed objective
The class one chooses to maintain area control shouldnt really matter, if the goal is to win.
Thats why the whole - ‘the soldier should be at the frontlines’ comment is a bit silly.
However most rambo medics, are actually wannabes.
They pass up revive opportunities which would benefit the team more, than their ability to frag.
I don’t see the point of this question, you already have the 5 classes found in majority of the games, every one you should invent would be a variation of the above or a specialized class.
I would start with no class, and let the player build his own by picking the abilities from a pool and create his own hybrid class, may it be engi-med, rambo-medic, sniper-ops, soldier-med-engi, comander-ops, etc. or chose from those five if he don’t like to tune his own.
I remember when i had a script for the most important maps of W:ET (with specific spawnpoints and enemy time), why not let me have a specific class made by me for a specific map or for my specific type of play and be able to load it by “/exec hybrid1.cfg” of “F9”.
Make it more hard, let’s say you wont be able to build your own class until you played 50h/1Mil.xp/unlock all of them. After “50-100h/5mil.xp” you should have the idea of what type of game-play you like, or what class you like, or what type of support you like to bring to your team, and chose your own class/classes.
Reward those who play your game by allowing them to tune, grind, achieve or stay within a predefine class.
[QUOTE=Humate;408164]Maintaining area control aka fragging = completed objective
The class one chooses to maintain area control shouldnt really matter, if the goal is to win.
Thats why the whole - ‘the soldier should be at the frontlines’ comment is a bit silly.[/QUOTE]
I think it should matter. In Brink it didn’t matter because all the classes were very similar. It didn’t matter where or what the classes where doing, as long as there was one of each then it was all okay.
In ETQW, not having the right classes in the right places is a disaster while having a class in the right place at the right time means you’re completely stomping all over your opponents.
That’s what I’d like to see.
So to that extend. A rambo medic is valid, IF players commit to that before hand. The opposite of a rambo medic should be a supply medic. A medic that has far less combat potential but is much more capable at replenishing the team during down-times.
A rambo medic is in the thick of the fight, keeps himself alive and secures one or two high priority revives right in the middle of combat. A supply medic is the backbone of the team. Rather than improvised quickfixes he steers the team through making sure the team goes in fully prepared and also provides them a place to fall back and replenish. A supply medic is also the guy that comes in when the fight is almost over and quickly gets everyone right back up again to have another go. We’ve seen that all too often in ET.
And if you want to take that supply archetype even further. A medic player should be be able to go ‘meta medic’ and invest in meta upgrades that go team wide. Typical commander type deciscions: ‘+10% hp for each health pack’ or ‘+5% max health’ or ‘50% faster supply crate drop’ or ‘double supply crate duration’. When a player choses those kind of upgrades over individual upgrades then he should also get return on that investment. So if a player picks the +10% hp per health pack upgrade, then every time any player in his team receives a health pack of any medic, then he will get a score/resource reward for enabling all the medics on his team such a bonus.
In ETQW, not having the right classes in the right places is a disaster while having a class in the right place at the right time means you’re completely stomping all over your opponents.
Who decides what the right places and the right classes are?
You dont need to have your soldiers on the frontlines, if they can own from the back.
And you dont need to have your soldiers at the back, when they can own on the frontlines.
Its like telling me only engies should be aloud in the Titan.
What should it matter to my team-mates if im smashing the opposing team as a covert in a Titan?
That’s what I mean with a “bot” commander like in ETQW you can request a Icarus, but a real player as commander I don’t think it’s a good idea at least not for the FPS genre.
[QUOTE=Humate;408164]Thats why the whole - ‘the soldier should be at the frontlines’ comment is a bit silly.
[/QUOTE]
Well I mean the soldier should be the strongest class so that medics can also heal teammates etc. instead of fighting in the frontline. Ofcourse everyone can pick their class and choose to fight in the frontline but the equipment need to fit the role.
I try to give a better example: what if the object class had the best equipment and the player fight in the frontline instead of doing objects? In a game with health regen it doesn’t matter but a class/objective based shooter it does or else:
There’s something wrong with the balance of the classes
Get rid of the specialised tasks (e.g. in Counterstrike every class can disarm a bomb)
I don’t see the point of this question, you already have the 5 classes found in majority of the games, every one you should invent would be a variation of the above or a specialized class.