Can we talk about Nader?

(acekiller345) #1

Since the Steam beta has started, i’ve constantly been in matches where nader is being used to spam, effectively shutting us out of an objective or keeping us in our spawn. While one and sometimes 2 naders are not a big deal, when you get 3+ it just turns into a giant spam fest. The grenades seem to be a bit OP considering how many a player has.

Sometimes I think Nader was creating with trolling in mind- she can spam grenades, or just run up to a group of enemies and Martyrdom, allowing for easy kills. I can see this becoming a rather big issue when the game is released to the public, and people figure out how little effort is needed to use her.

Maybe this is just me being a little whiny, but I would still be curious if there are any plans for Nader, or if SD is content with how she is right now.

(Protekt1) #2

I don’t think its nader that really needs to change (maybe some tweaking for balance). As a concept, I think nader is fine. What we need are mercs that are stronger at countering nader. Not hard counter, whose presence would make nader feel useless, but soft counters.

I think so far there is really 1 character who has a really defensive ability, which is the tower of healing. Aura. And aura is pretty damn strong, especially the healing deployable. I think maybe a deployable that soaks up explosives or nullifies them if the explosive enters the sphere. This would be countered by well thrown grenades which land and explode outside the radius because explosives can still pass into the protected area. You would have an appropriately timed cooldown to prevent it from being too hard of a counter.

There are some augments that reduce explosive damage as well, keep in mind.

Maybe there could be a way to cause instant health regeneration when hit by an enemy explosive, so if you survive the explosive you can get back in the fight quicker. Maybe this works as an augment or some engineer ability. Maybe they add a turret that gives out explosive resistance related buffs to nearby teammates while it is alive and itself is resistant to explosives.

I feel like they do need more defensive stuff and ways to counter heavy explosive/spam tactics.

(V1s0r) #3

[QUOTE=acekiller345;518906]Since the Steam beta has started, i’ve constantly been in matches where nader is being used to spam, effectively shutting us out of an objective or keeping us in our spawn. While one and sometimes 2 naders are not a big deal, when you get 3+ it just turns into a giant spam fest. The grenades seem to be a bit OP considering how many a player has.

Sometimes I think Nader was creating with trolling in mind- she can spam grenades, or just run up to a group of enemies and Martyrdom, allowing for easy kills. I can see this becoming a rather big issue when the game is released to the public, and people figure out how little effort is needed to use her.

Maybe this is just me being a little whiny, but I would still be curious if there are any plans for Nader, or if SD is content with how she is right now.[/QUOTE]

Yes, I agree with you. And she is hard to stop. It’s even worse when you do get to stop her, she has an awfull perk that she blows up (so easy). The splashdamage on that is high. The character has to much stopping power. Was in a match where two of these where running around. We where totally defenceless. Could not attack anymore and where stuck at the spawn.

For me, I would have removed her, I find her to be an awfull (cheap) character and out of place in this game. If she was removed I would not miss her.

(I have not had the change to played with her yet. But when I do, I know I will spam the hell out of this character. Spam grenades and run around corner into a group blowing myself up).

(Floris) #4

I remember one of the Strogg classes in ET:QW could put up a forcefield as shield. Might be cool to have a class with that same ability.

(Senethro) #5

An Australian engineer called Brolly who has invented a directed magnetic repulsion backpack that can become a deployable that redirects incoming heavy ordnance. They are very dissatisfied with their nickname and keep trying to get people to call them something badass like Guardian, Shield or even just Mags. Unfortunately the umbrella shape of the device means Brolly has stuck.

There. Job done plz put check in mail.

(demsix) #6

Oh man, if there was a deployable with small aura that soaked up explosive damage, even for a few seconds it would be incredible to see in play.

Air strike or nade spam incoming? Gather around the explosive damage soaker upper for a few seconds!

This has risks tied to it as you’d be in a vulnerable and predictable spot to get cleaned up, but it would allow you to maintain your position rather than get pushed out.

I’m not talking 100% damage reduction, just let it reduce damage by half or something.

(tokamak) #7

Hawken has a defensive mech that can turn himself into a wall with his two back shields. It’s more fun and involving than deploying shields.

Hawken-Screenshot-15.jpg1280×800 150 KB

(Senethro) #8

It has to be said that a class that is only a counter class is super super boring. Being the guy who undoes stuff is not as fun as the guy who does stuff and rarely balances well.

(Violator) #9

There is a perk that lets you throw back nades, only managed to do it a couple of times though :). Many Naders doth a spamfest make however. As for the martyrdom - just don’t try and gib her (with the knife at any rate) :).

(ToonBE) #10

Nader is not OP.

And about the martyrdome: I rarely get killed by it. Gib with your secondary gun and you are fine.

(Kl3ppy) #11

Wasnt there an engi planned with a portable cover?

(tokamak) #12

Yeah the little wall looked cool but I can imagine that so far it’s more a nuisance than a real perk.

So let it cover more niches. Your repulsion engineer could bounce players as well.

(Protekt1) #13

Putting the affect on a turret that is weaker would make him still able to do things. Regardless, I think it would still be fun, sorta like aura is still fun. And you’d have timing and placement being important factors as well. There would still be skill to it if they do it right.

Maybe repulsion grenade that bounces players with the explosion and leaves a residue that disarms enemy explosives that enter the area.

(Senethro) #14

I’d love to give players a mobile jump pad deployable but that would be way too many mapping headaches created.

What if you had to pick and choose? What if when stowed as a backpack the Brollydevice was part of an armoured suit that ONLY neutralized grenades and gave a little extra health. The player ability is to undo a quick-release catch that drops the device and it deploys into an Artillery/Airstrike interceptor. The player also loses the extra armour but gains a bunch of speed.

(INF3RN0) #15

Reduce current AoE/Damage by 30-40%, and add in air-bursting to make it viable/accessible. Then double damage and AoE from direct hits. Knock back/up shockwave would also be awesome (cough nade jumps). The end.

(tokamak) #16

I think that should be the general approach to most explosives in this game. An (un)healthy combination of damage, disruption and deterrence.

(acekiller345) #17

[QUOTE=ToonBE;518954]Nader is not OP.

And about the martyrdome: I rarely get killed by it. Gib with your secondary gun and you are fine.[/QUOTE]

The issue with that is what I said above. People will simply run up to you/a group of you, wait to be killed and instantly drop martyrdome, allowing for essentially skill-less frags.

(Volcano) #18

there used to be one early on

(Glottis-3D) #19

yep.

10chrzzzz

(xdc) #20

easy to avoid.
nader nerf made everything better