attacking sucks

(Yes) #21

I’m talking about the end of the escort, the start is the only part which is fair for attackers.

(JesseKomm) #22

I actually find the EV hardest to defend against right at the beginning, when it’s on the longer stretch it gets much easier for me since it’s much easier to know where the attackers will come from. At the start of the match attackers have many more options for attacking and unless it’s a stacked match it can be simple to break through the early defense.

(neverplayseriou) #23

@clown oooooh lol I said nthn @,@

(Octosquid) #24

Air striking the defenders at the last point in Chapel as Skyhammer and clearing their team is so great though. Otherwise, I think I prefer defending as well, its more laid back and relaxed.

(Malkovich) #25

Stacking for free 200xp LOL. That has never crossed my mind, what clown would do this. It looks to me like you have had a few bad games and now you’re looking for something to blame it on other than admitting your team sucked or the enemies were just better. Suck it up. Attacker side is more fun anyway.

I sincerely hope this was a troll thread but that is not looking likely.

(JesseKomm) #26

[quote=“Malkovich;81376”]Stacking for free 200xp LOL. That has never crossed my mind, what clown would do this. It looks to me like you have had a few bad games and now you’re looking for something to blame it on other than admitting your team sucked or the enemies were just better. Suck it up. Attacker side is more fun anyway.

I sincerely hope this was a troll thread but that is not looking likely.[/quote]

While not worth stacking over, the Long Defense bonus is really beneficial for people such as myself that do not play engineers because it counts towards Game Mode XP for the mission which really helps me out in completing them… it makes me extremely cautious about defense when playing assault because I really depend on it for those missions(In a good defense it really adds up fast).

(Malkovich) #27

[quote=“JesseKomm;81377”][quote=“Malkovich;81376”]Stacking for free 200xp LOL. That has never crossed my mind, what clown would do this. It looks to me like you have had a few bad games and now you’re looking for something to blame it on other than admitting your team sucked or the enemies were just better. Suck it up. Attacker side is more fun anyway.

I sincerely hope this was a troll thread but that is not looking likely.[/quote]

While not worth stacking over, the Long Defense bonus is really beneficial for people such as myself that do not play engineers because it counts towards Game Mode XP for the mission which really helps me out in completing them… it makes me extremely cautious about defense when playing assault because I really depend on it for those missions(In a good defense it really adds up fast).[/quote]

People have to rely on things like this to complete xp challenges? Pretty sure its not that hard to get any type of xp with any merc apart from support xp. But I guess that’s me. w/e You guys keep it up.

(Ardez1) #28

By default, when teams are even, the attackers will get the next person to join the server.

As a side note, it is significantly more likely that teams are stacked because players like to win, not for a some extra XP. The XP itself is rather worthless.

That being said, I would prefer for the attackers to have the advantage in Stopwatch, but that makes Objective much harder to balance out in the end.

And then of course a lot of this doesn’t apply to even matches where the game works fairly well. It is primarily when there is an existing imbalance on teams(either skill or playercount) that any map or timing advantages begin to be felt.

(JesseKomm) #29

[quote=“Malkovich;81380”][quote=“JesseKomm;81377”][quote=“Malkovich;81376”]Stacking for free 200xp LOL. That has never crossed my mind, what clown would do this. It looks to me like you have had a few bad games and now you’re looking for something to blame it on other than admitting your team sucked or the enemies were just better. Suck it up. Attacker side is more fun anyway.

I sincerely hope this was a troll thread but that is not looking likely.[/quote]

While not worth stacking over, the Long Defense bonus is really beneficial for people such as myself that do not play engineers because it counts towards Game Mode XP for the mission which really helps me out in completing them… it makes me extremely cautious about defense when playing assault because I really depend on it for those missions(In a good defense it really adds up fast).[/quote]

People have to rely on things like this to complete xp challenges? Pretty sure its not that hard to get any type of xp with any merc apart from support xp. But I guess that’s me. w/e You guys keep it up.[/quote]

Believe me without an engineer and doing objectives it can be really hard to get Game Mode XP, usually a normal match on attack(No Long Defense Bonus) I’ll get like 70-100xp for the whole round, with the bonus it’s usually 2000-4000 depending on how well we did.

This is the equalizer for non-engineer mercs to get game mode XP which is why I rely on it personally, not sure about other players though, it also promotes strong defense from assault classes like Nader, Fragger, and Rhino.

(Pecka) #30

[quote=“B. Montiel;81348”]Since they’ve choosed to go for synchronous spawn times between attackers and defenders, it’s indeed quite hard to pass some objectives, if both teams are equally skilled.

The lack of side routes also worsen the situation for quite a good bit in terminal and bridge mainly. In terminal, water pump route is just a quicker way to get at the same place, but it’s not a literal side route which needs extra attention if you’re defending the door to the forward spawn already. In bridge, as long as you’re camping the EV and the main road from afar, nothing to dangerous can happen to you. The lack of side routes, potential ways to hold the defenders far ahead from objectives reduce indeed the strategy you can apply for.

I really hope there will be some updates on the current maps, because except chapel and trainyard (there’s still a couple of things to say about those two), maps are imo way too defender-sided. This makes the game interesting on attack if you look for challenging plays, but the defending side is close from a rail shooter…[/quote]

Totally agree here, the synchronous spawns are just funny and in combination with lack of side routes… I am wondering if they made an official comment about why they decided to set them like that and not in a random fashion how it was in their other games.

(watsyurdeal) #31

Honestly, I just feel like defenders have too many sight lines.

(B_Montiel) #32

They choosed synchronous spawn times on purpose. This choice strongly impacts game design : [list]
[] Synchronous spawn times make the overall spawning process (and everything around it, such as spawn harass, long sides routes through spawn) more predictable, as well as overall strategies (choice between capturing the forward spawn or planting at the wall in terminal for example). This allow us to mess around enemy spawn without getting punished with a surprise spawn, and also allow devs to potentially reduce side routes in the map layout, as you can use the opposite team route safely enough if you’re checking spawn times well. As a downside, this will force them to have a very accurate spawn location which should not penalize attackers/defenders too much, resulting in possible strong map layout updates/work.
[] Asynchronous spawn times have the advantage of allowing devs to easily tune spawn times on every single objective to balance sided map design. An objective is too hard to reach on attack ? Give -n seconds on attackers spawn time or +n seconds on defenders and this might change the overall aspect of the game. And you won’t have to modify the map layout. But as a strong drawback, in attacker side especially, this forces players to do everything in a hurry, as you won’t be able to determine the upcoming forces you’ll encounter in the next 5/10 seconds. This will also force dev to do multiple side routes, as the enemy team route to objective will be death highway most of the time thus making it unusable.
[/list]

Both solutions have pros and cons. But changing from synchronous to asynchronous would be terrible now. This implies a lot of rework on the current maps which, for most of them, won’t handle it as they are set now. Just give a 2-3 seconds advantage on spawn cycle for attackers and this might turn current maps as massively attacker-sided, further than they are defender-sided now.

(watsyurdeal) #33

I actually like the spawn waves since everyone always spawns together. But I do think spawn time should also depend on the total number of players on the server.

(Jurmabones) #34

It’s just the nature of reality. The attacker’s desired position is automatically known to the defense. There is no way around this. Therefore defense will always have an innate advantage and the only way around it is making defense artificially hard or disadvantageous.

I find the best way to deal with it is pep talk people on my team. Just say “We’re on offense, gotta be aggressive, part of our job is to die sometimes to get the objective. It’s part of winning. We can do this!” Stuff like that.

I hear you though. If my team’s kinda bad or I’m having an off game, attacking seems unreasonably difficult. It’s just the reality of offense, it is harder to accomplish. Just gotta tough it out and get better, or do what you can to boost your teammates’ contribution.

(MethodOwn) #35

[quote=“Dirmagnos;81298”]Weirdly enough, when playing terminal, i actually prefer attacking team.[/quote]I always prefer attacking, because as someone who doesn’t have the reflexes of those younger I benefit most by PTFO which attackers have more opportunities to do.

Of all the maps, Terminal is actually the easiest for attackers, assuming they can get the forward spawn and blow the wall. On pubs neither is easy when people would rather stay in the safety of the building trying to protect their k/d ratio.

Trainyard and Bridge are probably tied for worst maps in the game for attackers. I don’t even want to play them when they’re an option, so I spend most of my time on Terminal, Chapel, or Underground.

(MethodOwn) #36

[quote=“ostmustis;81300”]play stopwatch[/quote]I refuse to play Stopwatch or Competitive because if I hate the map I’m not going to like it more playing it twice.

It has also been my experience from playing Execution that when a map is bias in favor of a side whoever isn’t on that side after the first half tends to leave the server, making it easy for the players that won the first half to do it again in the second half. It was really bad on Canal, which favored attackers who usually had a 2 player advantage defending the 2nd half.

(MethodOwn) #37

[quote=“Malkovich;81376”]Stacking for free 200xp LOL. That has never crossed my mind, what clown would do this. It looks to me like you have had a few bad games and now you’re looking for something to blame it on other than admitting your team sucked or the enemies were just better. Suck it up. Attacker side is more fun anyway.

I sincerely hope this was a troll thread but that is not looking likely.[/quote]Why do you think I’m trolling when I’ve played way too many matches where (at level 15) I’m the highest level player on my team and defenders have three or four players of much higher level? I don’t think it’s coincidence.

I’ve seen level 20+ players going spectator when they’re stuck on Attackers so they can switch to Defender as soon as another player joins the server, or switching as soon as they can.

If you’re trying to rank up for e-peen why wouldn’t you play Defender as much as possible? All the XP from kills/support and free 200XP every few seconds. You can even AFK in spawn!

(Litego) #38

I actually find the EV hardest to defend against right at the beginning, when it’s on the longer stretch it gets much easier for me since it’s much easier to know where the attackers will come from. At the start of the match attackers have many more options for attacking and unless it’s a stacked match it can be simple to break through the early defense.[/quote]
It’s pretty easy if you’re entire team doesn’t decide to stand on the EV. You only need 1 guy to move the EV, maybe add a medic too if needed. Put the rest of the team on the right and left side to kill the defenders (right side in pubs are usually 2-3 free kills right of the bat because defenders love to stand still on the bridge and shoot at the EV). Too many people will just throw themselves at the EV thinking it’s helpful when the defense has solid positions with crossfires over the EV to fuck up the offense. Well, it’s not, it’s not helpful. PTFO doesn’t work when you’re dead.

I can’t say I agree that attacking sucks. It can be a lot more frustrating, but at the same time it can also be a lot more rewarding.

(MethodOwn) #39

EV moves faster with more people around it. The worst is when you have people that don’t realize they’re not helping trying to repair the EV when it already says “TEAMMATE REPAIRING” on their screen and they should be covering that teammate.

(Amerika) #40

It no longer moves faster with more people around it. It’s always the same speed now. That was changed, uhh, maybe 3 or 4 patches ago I think.