A demo for brink ?

[BioSnark]

Notice sockdog hasn’t been in this thread yet

When done well, free weekend + persistent character development ties demo-goers to the game. On the other hand, when done poorly, it makes them feel underpowered and helpless.

[Jess_Alon]

[QUOTE=DoHo;278072]If they released a map and just the VERY minimum of content (like one pistol, SMG, shotgun), medium body type, very little to no customisation (or perhaps randomly generated characters) and no chocie of abilities beyond the default, I don’t see how it could be misrepresented.

It’s different when a company releases a demo and the demo is 6 months old has a whole bunch of bugs and gameplay issues that where never fixed and the final game is a compeltely different product. Right now, as far as we’ve been told, BRINK is finished…

Edit: I meant basically what you’d get if you started a new game/character (without any abilitiy to unlock anything new)[/QUOTE]

Then people who didn’t know about all the awesome stuff would have no idea what it would be like to build your character start to finish. Brink doesn’t appear to be a game you can capture in a demo.

[Jess_Alon]

[QUOTE=BioSnark;278080]No, it doesn’t! There are console players, here, who passionately defend Brink. It doesn’t make reasonable sense to me.
Splash Damage. The reason I speak to my doubts is that the other position has so many avid speakers, already. There’s no reason for me to also mirror that position, here. I represent a different position, elsewhere, which is why I got lovely Brink posters from Bethesda
These are useful. The console clashes on metacritic and anti-drm advocates show some imperfections with this source. They are much less detailed than ‘journalists’ and prone to giving out 10s and 0s but I’ve often found good info on features that I was interested in and that the professionals seem to ignore.[/QUOTE]

1.) I’m a console player. I’ve fallen in love with the idea and I trust the reputation. I’ve never owned a toyota or a honda but I know they are reliable and if I had the money to buy one I would.

2.) I follow amazon reviews and I look out for the same 3 guys that buy every shooter that comes out on xbox and then review it. And they are usually right on the money. With Brink I’m gonna just go for it because I just have a really good feeling about it.

[DouglasDanger]

I defend Brink because everything I have seen looks good.

except for the downed fire thing

[Auzner]

i think splash damage should add a team deathmatch mode

I think we should have a beta.

I’ve been a fan of Brink a long time and reading these forums forever but haven’t seen these topics yet so I’m going to make a new thread on them.

What makes you believe that I feel entitled to have a demo? I’m saying that its extremely stupid of them NOT to release a demo, as it provides and generates free marketing by spreading via word of mouth.

Ok, first a (demo/beta) thread has been brought up once a week since forever so it’s really old. That addresses “America” as in “a whole group” feeling entitled. Then your second sentence says you’re entitled because you’re making a whole bunch of assumptions with no facts or experience. Did you study economics or marketing in college or have ever been involved with the development of a video game? You offer no comparisons or real conclusion to why “its extremely stupid.” You’re just saying that because you want a demo. If they figured out the most advantageous forms of promoting themselves with regard to time and money I’m sure there’s a reason why there’s no demo. Most games don’t get demos anymore so I’m not really disappointed.

With broadband and streaming HD we don’t really need 5.25" floppy disks with the shareware levels on them anymore.

There is a lot more press coverage and early video releases for games than there were 10 years ago. They still had videos, but very few actually saw them or could download them. A demonstration doesn’t have to be playable, it just has to show the game.

Not trolling you. The company doesn’t owe you a demo just because you want one. That’s the point I’m trying to make.

If no one is going to be objective about this then he’ll keep posting that image.

But people who want a demo are necessarily suffering a disorder.

It’s more about the inherit culture of the nation than a sole individual’s problem.

Also I don’t understand how we have people who are totally doubtful about how good this game will be who are more active on the forums then the people who are excited about it. If you’re doubtful then why are you even here?

I’ve noticed that too. I think they’re going to end up like the L4D2 boycotters (they all ended up buying the game).

[BioSnark]

I’ve never owned a toyota or a honda but I know they are reliable and if I had the money to buy one I would.

But you wouldn’t argue that people who want to test drive one are delusional or defend them from other criticism, would you?

[LyndonL]

…One’s $50, the other is $15000+…

Still, I’d prefer a demo for getting the word out… I’m just playing devil’s advocate.

[Jess_Alon]

But you wouldn’t argue that people who want to test drive one are delusional or defend them from other criticism, would you?

Still have to spend time listening to the salesman’s whole pitch you have to drive out there which is usually out of the way for some people. (Car lots aren’t around the corner for everyone so there’s the investment of gas money) It takes some time and you actually have to tell the person you’re not interested if you’re NOT interested. ALSO the car is already made and insured by that lot for the purposes of selling that car.

If you wanted to go to a LOCALLY owned game shop that lets you play the console version of something in advance. I have one down the street from me that lets you hang out all day and will let you play whatever game you want in the store that is already open. You could go that route if it’s available to you.

HOWEVER. Gamers are usually self entitled and lazy. They want to be able to download a demo and not have to leave the house at all. And that demo better be the best thing ever. Or they won’t buy the game. They don’t want to face anyone and say “I don’t want to buy it.” Or even leave the house to check it out.

So the car comparison is ridiculous. Especially when you think about the fact that they actually let you drive a way nicer version of the car then you’ll probably actually buy. So how pissed would you be at SD if they did that? They don’t give you a ghetto DEMO version of the car. They give you the luxury package to drive. And then you buy the standard to save money.

You can’t compare a video game to a car. You just want a demo. And you aren’t going to get one.

[Chris2]

I guess people who try the free samples at deli counters have some mental disorder also?

Whenever I’m in a pub and see a beer I’ve not tried before (on tap) I ask if I can try a little first, 9 times out of 10 they will let you, even though they technically lose money from it, however providing the beer is good I will buy a full drink or maybe more so it’s all good, I fail to see the difference between this and a game demo. To suggest this ‘try before you buy’ mentality is indicative of wider social decay or whatever is quite a stretch…

It seems pretty clear there wont be a demo and many may say it’s due to it not been cost effective or something along those lines and they should be trying something else to generate interest to real in potential costumers. That’s all very well but with about a month till the release I haven’t seen Bethesda doing much for this game fullstop. If they aren’t going to release a demo what are they going to do? I think that’s the more pressing issue here many have.

[Jess_Alon]

[QUOTE=.Chris.;278335]I guess people who try the free samples at deli counters have some mental disorder also?

Whenever I’m in a pub and see a beer I’ve not tried before (on tap) I ask if I can try a little first, 9 times out of 10 they will let you, even though they technically lose money from it, however providing the beer is good I will buy a full drink or maybe more so it’s all good, I fail to see the difference between this and a game demo. To suggest this ‘try before you buy’ mentality is indicative of wider social decay or whatever is quite a stretch…

It seems pretty clear there wont be a demo and many may say it’s due to it not been cost effective or something along those lines and they should be trying something else to generate interest to real in potential costumers. That’s all very well but with about a month till the release I haven’t seen Bethesda doing much for this game fullstop. If they aren’t going to release a demo what are they going to do?[/QUOTE]

Well. That’s a totally different thing. You said on tap. What if it was only in a bottle?

There are people out there that would seriously insist you open the bottle for them and let them “try” it. I’ve been a bartender. You wouldn’t believe the crap I’ve seen.

[Herandar]

So the car comparison is ridiculous. Especially when you think about the fact that they actually let you drive a way nicer version of the car then you’ll probably actually buy. So how pissed would you be at SD if they did that? They don’t give you a ghetto DEMO version of the car. They give you the luxury package to drive. And then you buy the standard to save money.

Reminds me of the time we bought the Mitsubishi Eclipse. The test drive was in a car with the top line engine package. I was going 55 in second gear and the speed limit was 25. Fun!!

[dandragon]

I see alot of hostility here towards the self entitled gamers waiting for a demo. Just to inform we are not all in this category. I for one am not one of those impatient gamers with a disposable income. I am a poor gamer who is fairly selective and only gets 2 or 3 games a year if im lucky. This is a game i’ve been waiting for since last year. I have full belief in SD and thier reputation to bring us the next great squad based shooter.

People have been playing thier games for years after release. Whose going to play black ops in 2 or 3 years? I think SD has a good reputation of delivering a lasting experience and a great new game to further back that up.

I just wanted a demo to pass the time with something I am almost sure to be playing alot. But I can understand if they don’t release one. it does build that anticipation all the more and that can be fun too. Although they could maybe do a comercial.

[Jess_Alon]

I see alot of hostility here towards the self entitled gamers waiting for a demo. Just to inform we are not all in this category. I for one am not one of those impatient gamers with a disposable income. I am a poor gamer who is fairly selective and only gets 2 or 3 games a year if im lucky. This is a game i’ve been waiting for since last year. I have full belief in SD and thier reputation to bring us the next great squad based shooter.

If you really want to try it so bad before you buy it you could always research the area you live in. I’m assuming Franklin Indiana is the same Franklin near Indianapolis. Go local. http://www.playntrade.com/default.aspx

Places like these usually let you TRY before you buy if they have a used copy on hand. So wait a month after brink is released, then call the place and see if they will let you come in and play around with it. Problem solved.

[JeP]

dandragon : You sure seems like you need something to pass the time.

[Jess_Alon]

dandragon : You sure seems like you need something to pass the time.

He also needs to learn to use this.

[Chris2]

[QUOTE=Jess Alon;278336]Well. That’s a totally different thing. You said on tap. What if it was only in a bottle?

There are people out there that would seriously insist you open the bottle for them and let them “try” it. I’ve been a bartender. You wouldn’t believe the crap I’ve seen.[/QUOTE]

I had a feeling I would get this kind of reply and thanks for ignoring the second half of the post though and concentrating on semantics.

It would be unreasonable for me to ask them to open a bottle and let me try it in the same way it would be unreasonable for me to go to a game shop and ask if I can open a sealed game and take it home to try for a short while to see if I will buy it.

Anyway back to games though, I’m not sure how much work is required to produce a demo but I’m assuming if your title is planned to be available as a digital download surely it can’t be that much different to produce a downloadable demo in the same manner? (I know there’s more to it than that) Coming back to the beer on tap analogy, you have a product that is readily available through a specific distribution method, a method that also allows you to provide small samples albeit at a cost however by providing this ‘service’ you can get potential custom and increased sales recouping that initial loss. This is how I see it anyway. Any insight from those who work in the industry (games not bar) would be nice.

So yeah, if you don’t want to provide demos/samples, how else are you going to drum up business, on strength of your product? Marketing?

Been a new IP I don’t think you can solely rely on the game been great and news slowly spreading by word of mouth as there is bound to be some flashy new update of Call of Honor or a highly anticipated Duke Life 3 around the corner that will steal the spot light no matter how well Brink turns out. Sad but probably true.

So that leaves marketing, up until recently I haven’t been too concerned about folks’ complaints about the lack of marketing as there was always time for the marketing drive to pick up just before release, however we are looming ever so close that release now and I haven’t seen a great deal yet which is a bit worrying. Hopefully things do pick up and there will be a lot of buzz over the coming weeks and all is good!

tl:dr Demos are great but not exactly necessary providing long as you have a viable alternative to ensure healthy sales, in my opinion anyway.

[dandragon]

Places like these usually let you TRY before you buy if they have a used copy on hand. So wait a month after brink is released, then call the place and see if they will let you come in and play around with it. Problem solved.
Oh i’m getting it one way or another, a preorder would be preferrable.

[dandragon]

You sure seems like you need something to pass the time.
I agree I do need that.

He also needs to learn to use this.
I probabily do. not even sure what all it does. I’ve never posted anything anywhere ever so it’s all new.

[Jess_Alon]

I had a feeling I would get this kind of reply and thanks for ignoring the second half of the post though and concentrating on semantics.

I think that you’re worrying that I’m not hearing you. But I am. But the problem is that I don’t think you’re listening to me. There’s not going to be a demo. It’s official. And we’ve got to respect splash damage as a reputable company for doing so. I can promise you that 90 percent of the people who are whining about no demo are console players under the age of 25. I am 28 and a console owner (xbox). I wish there was a demo myself. It’d be nice but no dice. I’d download it and mess around with it just to get a feel for it but I’m buying it anyway and I want my first experience to be the full experience. To be honest it’s kind of inconsiderate of self-entitled dudes to be sitting around saying I need to try it and all that when they know they are going to buy it on rep alone when we know what to expect as console owners when PC owners have not seen much on their side. Yet they are on average the ones that have already pre-ordered on steam and stuff like that. I don’t know if you can cancel on steam. But on console you can go to walmart or gamestop and cancel your order the day before it comes out if you don’t have the cash. So I seriously don’t want to hear you guys cry about it. Splash Damage has catered to the console crowd at the expense of the PC owners who helped build the company into what it is. Splash Damage is legendary to some people. To half the people crying about a demo you just heard about this company 3 months ago or a year ago tops. So show some consideration for the old schoolers please.

It would be unreasonable for me to ask them to open a bottle and let me try it in the same way it would be unreasonable for me to go to a game shop and ask if I can open a sealed game and take it home to try for a short while to see if I will buy it.

I know they’d have to make you a crappy version of that beer to take home with you that would give you no idea of what having the whole bottle would be like. It’d be kind of pointless. Just like the stupid demo discs that official xbox magazine pack in the plastic cover just end up being drink coasters for a week before my wife throws them in the garbage.

[QUOTE=.Chris.;278435]So yeah, if you don’t want to provide demos/samples, how else are you going to drum up business, on strength of your product? Marketing?
[/QUOTE]

How about a legacy of making amazing products in the past? Do you think they are suddenly going to crap out the worst thing ever when the whole community that’s been following them is looking at them to see what happens?

[Avoc]

Its not SD who makes the call if there will be a demo or not. They are not the publisher. Bethesda is. Sure, they can push for it, but Bethesda has the final say in the matter, since they are the ones who are publishing and marketing the game.

I’m a PC player, have pre-ordered the game for PC and I’ve played all SD’s games. I’ve even mapped for ET. Demoes go a long way of convincing fence-sitters to get the game. I don’t need a demo, others do. Now you may say they feel entitled - but in the end it doesn’t matter what they feel like. They will just invest their money elsewhere, and that is not good for any business.

[QUOTE=Jess Alon;278485]
How about a legacy of making amazing products in the past? Do you think they are suddenly going to crap out the worst thing ever when the whole community that’s been following them is looking at them to see what happens?[/QUOTE]

Lets be honest. SD wants to cater to the casual crowd just as much as they want to cater to their old-school fans. How many casual players know about Splash Damage? How many casual players know about Brink? Not many.
How do you make casual players interested in your new IP? Heavy marketing outside the world of internet or a strong word of mouth. Brink has a word of mouth, but its not that strong, and it will get drowned out considering other high quality titles being released around the same time. A good demo can re-spark interest and word of mouth in a game, just take a look at Witcher.

Once again, I do not care about a demo before release. I simply think they need a demo.