My thoughts exactly, although I think some (most?) people repair the truck out of ignorance rather than XP whoring. 
Nice ideas Kendle. :drink:
Also, XP for kills shouldn’t be rewarded if the player gets revived. (Awarding points for gibbing is the one thing in Shrub/RtCW that influenced gameplay in a positive way.)
Maybe, but if Clans adopt the no XP approach (which is possible with ETPro (the de-facto mod for competition)) then maybe we’ll see more servers running with XP disabled. Clans will usually set-up their public servers to run “match” settings, that’s certainly the case with RTCW OSP servers. The www.rtcw.co.uk “Pro” server (in my sig) was originally set up with XP disabled ( ah, sweet memories 
) but now follows ClanBase recommended match settings. If ClanBase go no XP, then this server, for one, will as well, as will most Clan servers, which in turn will be “most servers” eventually anyway.
Besides, saying “that’s the way it is, nothing you can do about it” doesn’t stop us discussing everything else that isn’t going to change, so why not XP as well? Especially when no XP is actually possible, unlike some other topics of conversation around here. 
Yeah, that would be a good one. A player isn’t really “dead” until the body’s been gibbed, so award the points at that stage instead.
I don’t see how the XP system is flawed when its the people who are the problem. Kendle had stated about a server running with no XP points.
I do like the sound of that. Mainly because of all the stopwatch scrims and matches I play. XP is not a priority. Weapon achievements should be increased. Class skills should remain the same and battle sense should only reflect what kind of team player you are. Did you help gang bang the enemy. Take away the points for for arties, airstrikes and mines. Something else, make the levels depend on each other before advancing. Like you can’t get lvl3 engy without 2 weapons and 1 battle sense. Now thats just a example. Well, I’m out of ideas. Probably for the best.
c-ya
The thing about xp that makes it so flawed to me is that it’s centered around individual players, taking away the fact that this is a team game. People play for their xp’s instead of what is best for the team at any given point.
The fact that you become quite deadly takes away the team effort on the higher levels too. Take level 4 heavy weapons for example, in rtcw a panzer soldier that had been shoot where useless after he had fired the gun, sure you still had some grenades and the pistol but where no match anyway. Nowdays you can play as a rambo player and the xp actually encourage you to do so, fire you panzer, switch to smg and kill off any left overs move forward, take position and fire panzer again. This would have required a team effort before but no longer.
This is a team game, not how good you as an idividual play the game. XP and stats gives you the fealing that it actually is an indivudal performance based game. I know most people want to be able to measure their performance against other players but it’s a flawed system even if you only have a score, the XP system just increase that flaw imo. Do I have any sugestions for a less flawed system that would work better? Nope. Though I think the levels could be tweaked better to avoid some rambo behaviours at least.
Between DG’s post above, and PH@TIE, BongoBoy made an interesting post but then quickly withdrew it. In it he basically said the XP system was designed to provide an incentive for players to play for the team, but that in hindsight he could see how it could have been better balanced.
I can go along with that. The XP system moves on from RTCW’s simple points system in that it rewards players for doing stuff other than killing people and touching the objective (a big problem in RTCW, in the early days at least, was people camping the objective).
However, IMO, it goes too far the other way. There’s now little incentive for completing the objective. The Allied Engy who blows both Guns on Oasis will probably NOT end up Best Engineer (it’ll most likely be the Axis Engy who got the most Landmine kills). There’s no reward for moving the Tug on Railgun, or the Tank in GoldRush and FuelDump, etc. The 5XP for a uniform for a Covert-Op is quite simply ridiculous and out of all proportion to the contribution it makes to the team.
There are other examples, but you get the picture.
Now, if the system were to be better balanced, would that make it OK? I’d still argue probably not, as this is supposed to be a team game and the whole idea of awarding points to individuals for doing their own thing just doesn’t sit well with me. However people are people, and human nature is such that we like to see how well we are playing, and how well we perform compared to others.
In that respect I think the “Best whoever” rewards are a good thing (though I think the Engy that achieves the objective should automatically get “Best Engineer” regardless of points), but if the points themselves were hidden, and a few of them revised (like Covert-Ops 1XP for a uniform, etc.) then maybe it would be a “fairer” system and more representative of the contribution each player had made to the team effort?
In short, it’s both a flawed system and there are many “flawed” players. We can do something about the former (if we want to and the game mods and/or SD are prepared to make it so), and hopefully the latter will either become less “flawed” or get bored and move on to other games.
Remove all xp and let everyone play with the skills they has from the beginning (but give us medics an extra clip and give field ops their Mega ammo pack^^)
And there you go, no more boring campains and no arty spamms! =D
It seems to me that XP does get a little unfairly criticised: overall it does a good job of encouraging the basics of team orientated play in a difficult environment - the public server. Good players will always try to do what is best for their team to achieve objective, others might need a bit of incentive, especially if new.
The thing about xp that makes it so flawed to me is that it’s centered around individual players, taking away the fact that this is a team game. People play for their xp’s instead of what is best for the team at any given point.
Does that not beg for team XP? Not just the tally at the end of each level, but rejigging XP so there are no induvidual totals, just a team total. When the team total reaches a certain level, then everyone on the team gets an upgrade.
Also, I was thinking about what people have been saying about people performing useless actions to gain XP (building truck barriers before te tank is in the courtyard). Would it be possible to split maps up into different parts. For example Gold Rush. Set the map up so the truck barriers do not exist until the tank has blown the bank doors. The tank barriers don’t exist until the tank is repaired. Set up objectives in steps, so people can’t move ahead just for the sake of XP, and keep people’s attention on the job at hand.
BY Kendle
However, IMO, it goes too far the other way. There’s now little incentive for completing the objective. The Allied Engy who blows both Guns on Oasis will probably NOT end up Best Engineer (it’ll most likely be the Axis Engy who got the most Landmine kills).
But this is a two way battle, hasn’t the axis engie done his job on defence
by planting mines in the important areas thus helping stop allies from destroying the guns?
I mean if the Allies win (i.e. blow both guns). If the Allies win then the Axis Engy possibly hasn’t done his job as effectively as he might. It just seems wrong to me that you can win the entire game, virtually single-handedly on some maps, and not get recognition for it.
But then I guess you could apply that to all Classes and argue that only members of the winning team should get “Best …” awards. Maybe that wouldn’t be such a bad idea as it would give people an incentive to complete the objective and win the game (or stop the other team doing so, whichever team you’re on).
Or building CP and ramp, and then blowing the gun on Battery, only to see someone with ten rifle nade kills become best engie…
:moo:
Personally I dont care who gets best Engie at the end board,if I know ive blown the wall & both guns on Oasis I know it was me what must have been the real best Engie ,I have done this & not got the award a few times but in my mind I am happy with the performance and thats were it counts the best.
Absolutely, and is exactly how it should be.
But then that begs the question “what’s the point of having these awards in the first place?” If you know that they don’t matter, and you know they’re not necessarily awarded to the real “Best whatever”, then what’s the point in having them?
Either XP adds something to the game, or it doesn’t. Simple logic I’d say. This thread started as a “defense of XP” but I’ve yet to see anyone give one good reason why it should exist (given that it can be removed with ETPro).
Maybe there should be a page at the end of the map saying
SOUTH GUN DESTROYED BY…etc.Or you could just write whilst waiting for the map to change "I done both guns bask in my glory"OR "wtf were
you all doing you lazy bastards i had to do everything"But the latter could cause problems methinks. 
XP is your skill. The more work you do the better you become in that field.That is what splash damage set out to try and replicate.Unfortunatly the scoring system is a little flawed with what xp is allocated to.I mean getting unis. off already dead bodies ? Not much skill there.But if you were to compare it to your job notice the similarities.That lazy good for nothing whore who gets paid the same as you but does much less.Maybe splash damage has made this game to real.LOL.Yes I know this hasn’t really defended Xp but as we all know nothing is fool proof as playing on line you do meet a lot of fools …jees im rambling on now.Wtf was i writing about ???
So the main response is that the XP is flawed. There is no point discussing it any further because no one is giving solutions to the problem or problems.
Keep saying its flawed and give examples how it flawed and see how far it goes. Then again this is probably as far it will go but its still a waste of time to say its flawed without trying to give any kind feed back for a solution.
I’m sure everyone here is a creative person. Give your ideas. Lets debate
over possible fixes. I’m more intrested in that than just hearing its flawed.
c-ya
From a mathmatical point of view the XP system is not flawed. If human behavior wasn’t so flawed. We would have less flaws. So is there really a problem!
c-ya
Eh? Please explain how the XP system is “mathematically correct” and, assuming that it is, in what way this determines whether it’s a “good thing” or “bad thing”.
Do you want to continue the discussion as to whether it’s flawed or not, or do you want proposed solutions, cos I’m confused now. :???: